[Closed] Im still fuming..Is it just me or are rodies a breed apart...arrogant??

Simple, they should have allowed you to pass by going single file - if nothing else then simply going back to 2 abreast when traffic conditions allow.

The amount of time I see this it drives me crazy.

Common courtesy costs nothing, helps others than yourself, makes the passing and general road safer and like I said....

COSTS NOTHING.

bunch of lycra-clad mincing whinging retard ****s the lot of em.

m1xmag - Member - Block User - Quote
Simple, they should have allowed you to pass by going single file - if nothing else then simply going back to 2 abreast when traffic conditions allow.

Simple, they should have allowed you to pass by going single file

Did you read any of the rest of the thread? How would going single file help if, as the OP states, the road is "wide enough for two cars to pass but not two cars and a bike"

Instead of having to make say a 10 metre pass in the opposite lane he now has to make a 20 metre pass in the opposite lane.

bunch of lycra-clad mincing whinging retard **** the lot of em.

This place makes me sad sometimes.

crawps calm down people, let me update my comment...

Simple, they should have allowed you to pass by going single file

If not then judging the impact they may have been having on other users and if necessary taking appropriate action.

The OP says that the road wasn't wide enough to pass even a single file queue of bikes.

No the OP said the road was wide enough for 2 cars so by going into single file he could not only have more space but more visibility before overtaking.

So, Im driving along a country lane near home, its wide enough for two cars to pass but not two cars and a bike.

the OP said the road was wide enough for 2 cars

so riding 2 abreast made them easier to overtake...

druidh - Member
I don't know where you're getting this "us and them" thing from.

MBUK circa 1997.

I think the biggest problem here is you imposing an attitude on them that they don't have. This is whats left you "fuming".

OP you need to go out on a few road rides to understand how it feels cycling in traffic. At times it feels like open season on cyclists - close passing, abuse, sometimes psychotic behaviour. I had a guy nearly crash on a country lane - he was so busy giving me the finger after he close overtook me, that he stopped looking where he was going.
Is someone like that psychologically fit to be driving? I don't think so... but my life is in their hands and I don't like that...

So this kind of experience becoming too often the norm, we learn to ride defensively so we don't get killed or injured. Not just for our own convenience or selfishness but also because my friends and family would be in pieces standing around at my funeral and I don't want to do that to them.

So to avoid that appalling scenario, on a narrow country road where I feel tucking into the gutter would invite a driver to make a dangerous overtake, I take primary position - as taught by Bikeability - ie: in the middle of my side of the road. It's safer for me, safer for anyone trying to overtake, safer for the car driver coming the other way. Sadly this is often interpreted as selfish cycling...

Driver education is what is needed here so they can understand why we ride defensively and to respect our desire to stay alive. Cyclists have been group riding since before today's drivers were born. My club was formed in 1938... cars don't have a magic priority.

As for the 'it makes drivers angry' if they can't get past. An individual's response to a situation is entirely their choice. If they choose to get angry because they can't get past a cyclist or group of cyclists I suggest they need to see a therapist. It's probably the most unhelpful mental state to be in when driving 1 tonne + of metal.

Try some road riding - it'll help you understand how to drive more safely around cyclists, and hopefully help you to understand being angry isn't a terribly helpful response for you or anyone. I do however give you full credit for the fact that, unlike many drivers, you did have the patience and maturity to sit behind them for 4 miles. When that happens to me, I always give a thank you wave. Win win for everyone!

well put

This has parallels with the Critical Mass issue. Why, as a motorist, do you think you have a greater right to be on the roads than cyclists? Why is it such an issue that you have to drive slowly for a while? How would you feel if it were a tractor, or funeral cortege you were following? Would you still be as impatient?

The road does not exist for your exclusive unhindered enjoyment. Perhaps you would be wise to consider this.

During theTour de France in central London a few years ago, I witnessed a small number of extremely irate car drivers angry that their route had been blocked to hold a huge sporting event enjoyed by millions. I just thought their behaviour was extremely selfish. Perhaps such people shoud not drive cars, if they get so angry if others impede their progress.

To be fair brooess, it sounds (from him) like the OP behaved quite reasonably.

Actually that's a point OP, you say the road was 2 cars wide only, and twisting; had they gotten into singlefile do you think you could have stuck the pass on the whole group at once or would you have then needed them to break into convieniently smaller groups still?
i.e. 5 at a time, 3, maybe 2?
What exactly were you expecting by way of 'courtesy' from a group of group of 10 roadies to yourself and the other road users?

You are clearly concerned about the huge inconvienience to you, but you want them to break their group down (and in doing so probably drop their speed even further) so you can play leap frog over the course of what a couple of miles? all so you can sit in a queue at some lights 30 seconds sooner... you'd have wound up sat for a mile and a half unable to pass the last 3 riders due to blind corners with 7 more up your chuff giving you evils for being impatient.

However much time you think they cost you, it won't have been anything like that much, pulling in to start an argument probably did...

Thats the other thing, arguably the 'Worst' thing you can ever do in any altercation on the road is stop and get out of the car to take it further...

You might well be after a polite debate on the highway code, but I reckon most people would tend to interpret pulling over, getting out and walking up to someone who's use of the road you object to, as being a bit aggressive. Common practise these days is a beep/shout/finger on the way past to register displeasure, then off you pootle on your merry way, taking the time to approach other road users after the fact normally indicates a bit of a self control/road rage issue...

TBH, Ten of them, One of you, getting told to 'Eff off' was about the best outcome you could have hoped for...

The more I think about it, the less in control of yourself (and by extension your car) you seem OP...

To be fair brooes, it sounds (from him) like the OP behaved quite reasonably.

There are some world class knuckle dragging forkwit comments in this thread, and I'm mainly referring to the "[s]roadies[/s] other type of cyclists are scum" comments.

You should be collectively ashamed.

Moving on, I'm stunned that the OP couldn't get past a group of cyclists over a 4 mile stretch. Apparently Southern England has the busiest roads in the country but I can not think of a single time or place where I / a group of riders would hold up traffic for this amount of distance. - I can only presume this happened in some remote area of the UK?

Now we don't have all the facts but I think the road riding group could have shown more consideration in holding traffic up. Be that a simple 'sorry for the delay' type wave or once they pulled in, being polite and reasonable.

The OP's comments at the garage suggest a reasonable effort to engage them so the F O was childish in the extreme. - I can see the other side of the argument but if I was approached by someone who appeared to be a fellow cyclist and wasn't venting steam, I wouldn't immediately get all stroppy.

To the posters who referenced them all riding in the same (club) kit, you will generally find club riders are responsible human beings and very likely have been riding for many years.

A couple of additional comments.

I did the BHF London - Brighton night ride back in May and this was my first charity ride. Even being at the front of the ride I saw some [b]really[/b] crap cycling on the Queen's highways. Charity rides are on the whole a good thing but they don't half bring out all sorts of people riding bikes*

Whenever I get a vehicle behind me for a period of time, I will whereever possible, indicate and pull in to let them past. - I don't want X tonnes of van/bus/truck helping me down the road any more than they want to be stuck behind some bludy cyclist. 99% of the time I will get a toot or flash of thanks. - A tiny bit of courtesy goes along way as does a wave from me for folk who've waitied.

* = people riding bikes are not necessarily cyclists.

Riding two abreast is in the same bag as running a red light and riding on a pavement - it's not right but people do it. Annoys me and try not to do it but get caught out sometimes as no-one is perfect but I pull in asap.

When I had a brief stop on the roadside on the mtb yesterday I got passed by a group of riders, some said hello which is rare! There was a queue of traffic behind them. A few places to pass but there was a long line of cyclists so overtaking was difficult. I ended up overtaking on a corner to talk to the guys at the back who were no longer so polite. He said he doesn't have to ride single file on a road! Laughed in their faces and rode off. Car behind then managed to overtake, beeped like mad giving a universal hand sign and then proceeded to slowed without letting them pass. Childish but funny

+1 for Yunki + Junkyard

I don't get why people have to be such c**t* these days - cyclists, motorists etc etc People just seem to like being awkward and claiming it is their right.

I always assist cars get past. My friends and I ride 2 abreast when no cars are around and immediately filter in line to ensure cars can pass with a decent gap between groups of 2/3 and minimising how far they go over the white line. I also help guide them through if I can see further ahead it is safe to overtake. I make a point of making eye contact with other road users so they know I am aware of them and likewise they are aware of me. It is kind of in my own best interests to avoid any kind of incident - whether I have right of way etc I don't care - right of way/law on my side is not much use if I am dead!

I remember driving back from Afan during the Wiggle dragon ride to pick up a mate who was taking part and we had been mountainbiking.

I had to overtake small clusters who where all very courteous despite being in a race. True I felt a bit like a support car at the TDF but they way I drive around cyclists they know I know what I am doing as I stay back off their wheels, make sure I have a good view, make eye contact and give them plenty of room and notice I am passing.

There was a few times when I was stuck behind a group so waited and saw faster cyclists coming up behind so I made sure I backed off, gave them room and waved them past. Later on the same courtesy was returned.

I do similar for motorbikes who are riding sensibly - I make sure they have enough room to pass safely and give them a chance to - it doesnt cost me any time to do so and makes sure they are safe.

Some cyclists need to understand they are not doing the TDF and they need to break up the group and bit and stop chatting and give room for people to pass them occasionally. But sadly a lot are just arrogant tossers - they probably are in other aspects of their lives too. Just like there are a lot more who don't ride bikes. Human race: too many self centred arses.

It is difficult to escape the conclusion that a lot of people on here only "ride" by putting their bike in their car and driving to the trail centre, or wherever they off-road.

Anyone that thinks cyclists should hug the gutter on the road either lacks experience or is an idiot.

OP - next time, just observe the actions of this guy... seemed to work for him.

NB. I believe he did end up in a mental asylum though.

Riding two abreast is in the same bag as running a red light and riding on a pavement - it's not right but people do it.

Except that riding two abreast is entirely legal whereas jumping red lights and riding on the pavement isn't??

You've got 2 arguments here based around consideration for others:
1. Car drivers should be more considerate to cyclists, ease up and sit behind until there's space
2. Cyclists should be more considerate to car drivers and get out of the way [i]if [/i]they're holding things up

I agree in part with both arguments, and the Highway Code can support both too. I suspect that, depending on the scenario, both behaviours can be most appropriate.

Which is the nub of the issue. No-one argues against greater consideration for others. But which action delivers that consideration? Depends entirely on the circumstances...

We need clearer law and clearer priorities. As it's impossible for car driver and cyclist to communicate their points of view and needs whilst both travelling along a country lane, confusion and conflict will continue...

Oh and riding in the gutter suggests that cyclists are somehow secondary citizens and as cycling numbers increase, this is likely to lead to more injuries and deaths (cyclists and drivers), not fewer

* = people riding bikes are not necessarily cyclists.

I can see your POV and, as a cyclist, I agree with it. The problem is that, to a non cyclist (general member of the public/a lot of drivers), ANYONE riding a bike is a cyclist regardless of it it's someone on a Boris bike, a commuter on a Brompton, a kid on a BMX, a lycra clad roadie or an armoured up DHer. To the general public they're one and the same. That's why certain comments on this thread about "roadie scum" vs MTBers are so depressing to read.

You're right about charity rides, Sportives etc, they really do bring out some spectacularly shit riding and in that respect, cyclists do themselves no favours whatsoever. I hate riding in groups of more than about 6 for that very reason. For all the comments about rubbish drivers, stupid overtakes etc (which I agree with), there can be similar comments aimed at groups of cyclists who (often unthinkingly) do some unbelievably stupid things.

I really hope Taff is a troll.

What exactly is wrong with riding two abreast if the road is not wide enough for two cars plus a bike? If a safe overtake is already going to involve the car using the other carriageway, then what's the problem with riding two abreast?

I haven't really read the entire thread, but from the OP..

So, Im driving along a country lane near home, its wide enough for two cars to pass but not two cars and a bike.

So if you can't overtake them two a breast, you can't overtake them single file. In fact, if they went single file it would be even harder to overtake, as they'd be longer.

Sounds like they were a bit nobbish when you talked to them though, but maybe you came across as a bit silly or something.

Nothing wrong with riding two a breast.

Has anyone checked to see if the stretch of road concerned is a Strava seg? 😉

in the middle of my side of the road... Sadly this is often interpreted as selfish cycling...
Driver education is what is needed here so they can understand why we ride defensively and to respect our desire to stay alive

100% agree with this.

It's all very well teaching cyclists to claim the lane, but someone needs to teach the drivers and explain that [url= http://www.citycycling.co.uk/Issue8/Purpose.html ]yes we are doing it on purpose[/url], but not to annoy them.

I'd love to see British Cycling/CTC/Sustrans/RoadPeace etc get together and fund a newspaper/TV campaign about this (and other myths/misconceptions like riding two-abreast and the dreaded "road tax")

+1 crazy legs

In fact you've just reminded me of a car v bike incident I had earlier in the year.

I was out photographing a running event and driving towards a [url= https://maps.google.co.uk/?ll=51.113916,-0.486746&spn=0.002411,0.008755&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=51.113914,-0.488779&panoid=OXFltaeR1o-XtmHsXI_OZA&cbp=11,81.84,,0,0 ]T junction of a country lane with high hedges[/url].

I was in no hurry and as I approached the junction to turn right, two sportive riders swept in from my left, completely cutting the corner.

Had I literally been 2 seconds earlier they would have gone straight over my bonnet. Fortunately they didn't but that didn't stop the woman on the back mouthing off at me as if their piss poor road skills were my fault.

Twasn't worth chasing after them because they would have reacted in the same fashion as the OP's encounter.

Except that riding two abreast is entirely legal whereas jumping red lights and riding on the pavement isn't??

It's on the highway code as a 'you should never' so you can get pulled by a bored copper and it [url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/stw-cyclist-disagrees-with-police-shocker-two-abreast-not-allowed ]has been done[/url]

I really hope Taff is a troll.

What exactly is wrong with riding two abreast if the road is not wide enough for two cars plus a bike? If a safe overtake is already going to involve the car using the other carriageway, then what's the problem with riding two abreast?

I think it has its place in certain locations. In areas of solid white lines I think it prevents people from doing stupid overtakes which I see fairly often on some of my local roads. You don't have to overtake on the opposite side of the road giving a metre/metre and half of clearance is aduaqate in the majority of locations and this helps for visibility if here are small bends in the road.

Riding two abreast isn't as much of an issue to me if it's a small group as overtaking is just as easy as a car but in the likes of large group or sportive etc it does prevent safe overtaking unless the straight section of road is long enough same as overtaking a lorry although a lot slower. It's more politeness towards other road users with a bit of impatience thrown in.

EDIT: apologies if I sounded harsh before.. bad day at work

It's on the highway code as a 'you should never' so you can get pulled by a bored copper

Err.. wrong on two counts:

"Never" in the Highway Code is not the legally enforceable bits. The bits backed by road traffic law are MUST or MUST NOT in bold.

And it doesn't say [i]"never ride two abreast"[/i], it says [i]"never ride [u]more[/u] than two abreast"[/i]

It also [u]advises[/u] (but doesn't enforce) that we should [i]"ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends"[/i]

So the Op was on his way to the mountain bike playground in his car and was held up en route - big deal.
Id suggest the OP should have just carried on when they pulled in and not thought any more of the matter, to follow them in to the petrol station to give his two penneth, was so unbelievably childish and pathetic, to then come on a forum for a group hug - shows a very "mountain biker" attitude to life.
(ie insecure middle aged male who is frustrated at the world)

where i live it is literally crawling with big groups of roadies..mostly fat and clad in lycra tbh most of them do ride like a bunch of prats, they think they own the road and they are mostly arrogant...they dont do themselves any favours at all..get those bombers out.

strange thought they had closed roads off for the olympic road race

As I and a couple of others have posted but not got a response from the OP - what exactly did you want the cyclists to do? By your own admission the road was only wide enough for 2 cars not 2 cars and a bike so wtf difference does it make if they were two abreast? It would have only made things harder for you to overtake (if an opportunity to do so safely arose) as the line would have been longer.
Two abreast on a narrow lane where you can't overtake without going dangerously close to the outside cyclist (regardless of oncoming traffic) is the only time cyclists should make an effort to change to single file so you can at least attempt to pass (although as in my previous post it's often instinctive to pull left if an oncoming car appears rather than just brake so you'd end up going into the line of cyclists).
The only other thing they could have done was stop and pull over for you, that's a reasonable expectation for an HGV or on a really quiet lane but not for a single car on a road with regular traffic as otherwise you're asking them to ruin their ride.

Well here we are.........5 pages of disagreement, some fairly ill-natured, on a cycling forum.

Can we really complain when a large number of motorists and the general public look down upon cyclists in general, when quite evidently various factions of cycling do exactly the same thing.

Utterly bloody pathetic 👿

They probably ride like they are entitled to use the whole carriageway and you are obliged to give them room, you could always be a c@nt and clip them with your wing mirror like a woman did to me, smashing me to the floor in front of the following traffic. But then that is what you get with mountain bikers in their cars thinking they have an entitlement to the road and that all other road users are obliged to get out of their way.
Get a life you people, cyclists on the road is something you need to get used to.

What grhams S to taff re the Highway code from your own link ...to prove the point

You should wear
a cycle helmet which conforms to current regulations, is the correct size and securely fastened
appropriate clothes for cycling. Avoid clothes which may get tangled in the chain, or in a wheel or may obscure your lights
light-coloured or fluorescent clothing which helps other road users to see you in daylight and poor light
reflective clothing and/or accessories (belt, arm or ankle bands) in the dark

I dont think you get done for ignoring any of those that you [b] should[/b] do any more than the should re two abreast. As noted it says not more than two abreast rather than saying you cannot ride two abreast

no need to clip em with your mirror, they are probably all going to die prematurely due to all those traffic fumes they are inhaling..

It's probably already been said, but even on my own I would ride with enough space to my left for another cyclist. I will move further in if I decide it is safe, and it usually is. But it is 100% my decision - the only thing at stake is [u]my[/u] safety (well, and a few seconds' inconvenience for the driver).

I'm a 2nd cat on the road and an elite level xc racer the latter being my true love anyway yes I can say 99% of roadies are cocks....just saying like

I pull in and without loosing my rag and politely question them, asking why they never let me pass (I had cycle gear on too as I was on my way to a ride). To say they where arrogant and non-caring would be an understatement, not one of them came up with a reason as to why they never let me pass.

None of that really matters of course, as he was left fuming by a bunch of tossers, one of whom told him to **** off when asked a perfectly reasonable question. Probably tells me all I need to know re the cyclists 🙄

XCneil, I take it you are in that 99%
as you have given yourself very good odds for being in that group.

Woody, none need give a reason as to why they didnt let him pass, they are not required to let him pass.
don't you get it, when in a car you are not the number one honcho on the road, you must allow for slower road users and show consideration, like horses, learner drivers etc.
since being knocked off anyone that gives me shit for riding my bike on the road will get knocked out, I am so ****ing tired of motorists and their ****ing attitude to cyclists.
bring it on any time.

xcneil - wish I was like you, just saying like. 🙄