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Obviously he means you can ride the same stuff faster and easier.
No... I meant that it can now be ridden instead of walked round.
Agreed. If they stopped trying to puff the latest whizz-bang same difference they might concentrate on value for money instead!
I think the new Sektor forks use all the bits from last years Pikes, Revs & Recons, so with no R&D costs you get a good fork at a bargain price.
But I might be wrong.
Obviously he means you can ride the same stuff faster and easier.
if that were the case then he wouldn't have said
Probably the biggest innovation in the last 15 years has been in the terrain we now ride
because the same terrain isn't an innovation, and neither is going faster.
Last year I built a retro ride - Dave Lloyd Cats Wiskas - 2" travel forks, flat bars and bar ends with Canti brakes. I snapped two pace forks (including a modern RC31) and eventually decided to limit what I tried to do with it before I broke it or it broke me.
It was fun but ultimately limiting. I took it on one of my favourite big rides thinking it would be capable. It was okay on the climb but I had no chance of making a couple of the tricky bits on the descent which I tried a few times but eventually walked. When I got the bottom I was happy but it was more with relief than pleasure.
My Whyte 19 modern geometry hardtail with 120mm forks is a pleasure to take down round that route...
What would we have made of Glentress and Laggan etc 20 years ago? In all Likelyhood some of the bits we all love and all ride now would have been deemed unrideable. Innovation is great.
Riding is generally faster than walking is it not? 🙂
How is innovation designed to let you ride faster, not innovation?
What would we have made of Glentress and Laggan etc 20 years ago? In all Likelyhood some of the bits we all love and all ride now would have been deemed unrideable
Good point. Think of the stuff people have been doing on freeride bikes. No chance 20 years ago.
When I got the bottom I was happy but it was more with relief than pleasure.
where is this gnarly pleasure drome ?
How is innovation designed to let you ride faster, not innovation?
the innovation is the design, not the speed
If you were to compare a £3k full susser from 2000 with a £3k full sussr from this year what would be the main differeces?
Not a lot I'd wager apart from maybe a trickle down in terms of quality of componentry. But in terms of technological leaps forward? Not a great deal - Tubeless tyres, pro pedal damping.... more baby steps / refinements rather than big breakthroughs.
I think the next big thing will be around the transmission, but doubt it will ever come to fruition.
the innovation is the design, not the speed
What?
"I've been riding more and more without any suspension, to get the same thrill at a lower velocity"
I like the feel of controlling the back-end kicking and sliding around on my HT to an extent. But I don't miss the blurred vision from a rigid fork!
I do get the "retro" philosophy - doing more with less - is the same in climbing. As you improve, the technology is needed less and less.
I recently speced a custom build bike - price no object. I chose the best forks and brakes i could buy and a Hammerschmidt. The rest of the stuff is not that new in terms of tech, just good quality stuff that works well and should last well.
So for me its brakes, suspension and recenlty transmission that are moveing forward.
I dont see a leap comming up soon though. Just small improvements. One thing is different, the terrain we can all ride now is much more difficult on an older style bike. Imagine doing a trail center back in the early 90's. You could do it, yes, but on your normal all mountain bike now its eaiser, faster and more fun.
Geometry has changed a lot in the last 10 years... going away from the roady "arse up face down cheat the wind" performance oriented to a geometry that actually aids the better riding of more interesting terrain.
where is this gnarly pleasure drome ?
It's a mountain... in Scotland... close to where I live...
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How come people keep going on about transmission and gear boxes. Do we not have alfine, rolhoff etc already. And the ST 3-speed has been round for donkeys!
The thing about innovation, real new innovation is that no one currenlty knows what it is or where its coming from. If it happens its likely to be a bolt from the blue, utterly unexpected.
My guess would be electricity being involved somehow, then you could tie transmission to braking, two wheel drive all sorts of interesting ideas. But would that be classed as innovation, or evolution??
but on your normal all mountain bike now its eaiser, faster and more fun.
I don't want the riding to be easy, I want challenge, and I don't care about speed - that just means it's over sooner.
How come people keep going on about transmission and gear boxes
Because it'll move from being something built into the back wheel to something that's attached to the frame or built into the bottom bracket.
I think Alfine and Rolhof are OK, but put a bit of weight too far back and upset most riders "prefered" feel of weight distribution. We need a similar thing in the center of the bike, not at the rear.
My Hammerschmit for me sorted the things I dont like about front mechs. But a lot of that is a personal choice and typ of riding choice.
My guess would be electricity being involved somehow
my experience has me always ride with 2 lights in case one fails, so I'd not be happy with electric brakes or a transmission that gave up the ghost when the battery went flat 🙁
but on your normal all mountain bike now its eaiser, faster and more fun.I don't want the riding to be easy, I want challenge, and I don't care about speed - that just means it's over sooner.
I'm trying to visualize your riding....ahah, you are a trials rider!
Mountain bike components that don't die at the first sign of mud would be handy.
Some innovations are good and some are not. I have a Rohloff gearbox bike languishing in the garage - the drivetrain is draggy and it weights quite a lot, but it was fun for six years.
It's replacement has a HammerSchmidt and is 10 lbs lighter. The HS is not perfect, for the application much better than a front mech IMHO.
I like the feel of controlling the back-end kicking and sliding around on my HT to an extent. But I don't miss the blurred vision from a rigid fork!
Or the ****ed wrists, I'd forgotten all about that 🙂
But I was younger and healed quicker...
I am almost serious about going slower / feeling faster though - I've seen a lot of people have horrible offs as they were riding fast and the speed being a contributing factor to the seriousness of the end result. If you can't go that fast... there is the counter argument that the gear gets you out of trouble old kit wouldn't have (really notice this in narrow ruts where a suss fork will often help pull you out) of course.
I do get the "retro" philosophy - doing more with less - is the same in climbing. As you improve, the technology is needed less and less.
Often a backlash to the cycle of user/manufacturer development.
[i]I want to ride that place, but this widget always breaks first.[/i]
OK here's a better widget
[i]Cool, now I rode place A, I wonder if your widget will handle place B?...ooops no, it broke[/i]
Yeah? Well here's an even better widget
[i]Oh thanks, wow place B was awesome. But I'd like to go faster.[/i]
Man...ok here's widget rev C, what do you think?
[i]Perfect! Although bit of a problem - went back to place A....no challenge anymore...your parts make stuff too easy[/i]
&*&^*!!....you are a fussy ****....OK well here's widget rev A again, but we now call it 'retro'. I suppose you want it in purple?
[i]Oh that's ideal! Yeah I feel a purer rider, now I don't need that better thing[/i]
*facepalm*
I think the change in bike geometry has to be the biggest change in mountain biking. I still sometimes ride a fairly old hardtail which I've made fully rigid, just as it was originally when I bought it. It's great fun and I enjoy it, but it's a world apart from riding my modern full suspension bike. I can climb more, descend more confidently and generally 'clean' much more terrain on the modern bike. Brakes are hardly that big a difference to be honest, other than the V brakes eat through blocks in the mud, so I'm surprised you even mention disks. I always thought that when I added suspension forks to my bike, that made a big difference to the way you could ride.
and I don't care about speed
But lots of us do. Personally, I LOVE going fast off road. 🙂
Well I think there's a revolution on the way.
It's called the 4" tyre and it will change everything.
It's called the 4" tyre and it will change everything.
specifically, it would stop my bike from going 🙂
I hope not. I'd like to think that there'll be a revolution in cheap, mass produced components in carbon like its got cheap and mass produced for frames. New processes mean that better carbon weave and carbon alternatives will make their way into bike design. Materials being developed for clothing are already generating electricity to charge personal devices like phones so you could generate electricity from fork movement or frame flex to power monitoring and management devices. How about a bike that uses GPS, wheel and gyroscopic sensors to change shock and fork travel, seat height or even frame geometry to the terrain as you ride? And smart frame materials could electrically be stiffened or relaced to vary handling and comfort. We could get bottom-bracket based transmission with an infinite range of ratios controlled by computer so that cadence remains constant whatever the gradient and however much force you pedal with.
You could even have rear proximity sensors that play the funeral march through your earphones literally seconds before you're run flat by a daft old biddy in a P-reg Peugeot 105.
How about a bike that uses GPS, wheel and gyroscopic sensors to change shock and fork travel, seat height or even frame geometry to the terrain as you ride?
SAY WHAT ??? "Welcome to the Apple iBike. Steve Jobs says you need 6" of travel on this trail". Ye gods!
And smart frame materials could electrically be stiffened or relaced to vary handling and comfort.
That's a cool idea.
You could even have rear proximity sensors that play the funeral march through your earphones literally seconds before you're run flat by a daft old biddy in a P-reg Peugeot 105.
An even better one!
Think you are right about carbon getting cheaper. Eventually. Now it's getting more mainstream, I'm sure the idea of paying £7500 for a bike frame will look increasingly ridiculous.
Pity it's non-bidodegradable and very hard to recycle though. There will so much of it knocking around soon in obsolete designs.
The biggest advancement in cycling would be to stop worrying about innovation and just ride your bike. Maybe try new things; learn new skills?
The innovation I'd welcome the most is a big "Steve Peat" button in the middle of my forehead that would disable my sense of self-preservation when things got steep. I could hit the SP button and ride down stuff instead of slamming on the brakes, dismounting and carrying the bike down like the big Wendy I am.