[Closed] E-Livid

f we are really concerned about erosion then perhaps we should stop riding full stop.

We could ban stop those pesky walkers as well, must be loads of them causing erosion as well.........

Yep, and horse riders and deer and rainfall and wind.
In fact all access should be stopped and people should be limited to looking at pictures of it.

So twice the erosion, then;

Good thing?

Or

Bad thing?

@Mrlebowski,

True, but the IMBA data still suggest that there is the potential for increased damage at turns & grade changes.

Anyone care to explain why twice the usage isn't twice the erosion?

Twice the erosion is good, it means someone somewhere is spending twice the the time enjoying the outdoors.

Of course its not twice because ebikes don't make it twice as easy or cause twice as much damage for the same milage but if you're going to reduce it to such a simplistic level then I'm still going for twice the erosion is good.

I accept I'll be misquoted for years to come on this matter.

So twice the erosion, then;

Assuming EVERYONE rides twice as far, and those extra miles are equally off road to what they would have done anyway. And that the off-road they are riding isn't a maintained/reinforced trail.

So nowhere near twice the erosion, then.

So twice the erosion, then;

Good thing?

Or

Bad thing?

What about fast riders like Njee then ? I bet he puts out more than 250W constantly, so maybe fast blokes shouldn't be allowed to MTb either as they're causing more erosion than slower ones ?

What about weight... how much of a factor is that then, what about fat riders ? Are they not allowed either ?

I am simply unimpressed by e-bikes.

Sure they're a positive enough application for technology to help people who would otherwise be unable or more limited in their riding due to some sort of physical constraint.

But they're now being pitched at the well funded, new golfers aren't they.
So really it's another industry gimmick for "sports tourists" they can hurl £3k at an e-mtb, call themselves "mountain bikers" for six months, then leave it in the shed for the battery and tyres to go flat... Normal product lifecycle innit.

Ultimately when I drag my own lardy arse up a hill using my meagre human generated joules only, I feel a greater sense of achievement than I would if I delegated some of the effort to a bosch motor... doing it all for myself is part of the enjoyment, nothing competitive about it, just a personal [i]'ethic'[/i] if you like...

If others can only derive the same enjoyment through the use of an e-bike, fair enough...

I am over my hate for e-bikers, but have you seen those off-road segway safarists? 👿

weeksy - Member

What about fast riders like Njee then ? I bet he puts out more than 250W constantly, so maybe fast blokes shouldn't be allowed to MTb either as they're causing more erosion than slower ones ?

What's needed is a credit system- ebike owners and powerful riders can offset their erosion against the reduced impact of a puny or lazy rider, or the 90% of stw that never actually ride a bike. We could call it gnarbon credits.

Really it's just a formalisation of the traditional stokens system, we just need to work out the transfer methods.

Ultimately when I drag my own lardy arse up a hill using my meagre human generated joules only, I feel a greater sense of achievement than I would if I delegated some of the effort to a bosch motor... doing it all for myself is part of the enjoyment, nothing competitive about it, just a personal 'ethic' if you like...

If others can only derive the same enjoyment through the use of an e-bike, fair enough...

My thoughts exactly. I can't see me getting an eBike any time soon and going uphill under my own power is what I enjoy most. But that is what I like doing and eBike riders are doing what they like doing

cookeaa -Sure they're a positive enough application for technology to help people who would otherwise be unable or more limited in their riding due to some sort of physical constraint.

Do pies and beer count?

I like bikes but I like pies and beer more

going uphill under my own power is what I enjoy most.

[i]Really[/i]? Like, actually, really?

*Awaits first bike park where you ride to the top then get a downlift.

For me there is no sense of achievement, riding a bike is not a challenge, its an excuse to be outdoors away from people. So the quicker & further I can get from you lot the happier I am.

gnarbon credits 😀

*Awaits first bike park where you ride to the top then get a downlift.

It may be apochryphal, but there has long been talk of ze Germans doing this in Garda.

Wonder what the heroes would ride? Super light xc weapon to get to the top fast, or a super heavy POS to show how hard they are?

Kerley?

Gnarbon credits - an idea stated in jest, but actually strikes at a deeper point, with me anyway. I have a persistent guilt that I don't contribute directly to the upkeep of the trails I ride. I would happily pay to do so, as I have more disposable income than spare time, but the catch being that I would want to be sure that the money went directly into the trails, and not to the council or whatever...

Give it to me. I'll use it to pay off what I've spent on tools and after that, cakes.

going uphill under my own power is what I enjoy most.

Really? Like, actually, really?

That was really the point, different people enjoy different aspects of cycling, including a bit of satisfaction from putting in an honest effort and achieving something for it, Other people buy e-bikes because otherwise they apparently couldn't venture so far into the big old outdoors.

So long as either party are happy with their choices, who really cares. I don't require your validation, and I expect you'll live without mine...

Klunkers > front suspension > full suspension > disk brakes > E assist. Evolution innit.

Squirrel - Member
Klunkers > front suspension > full suspension > disk brakes > E assist. Evolution innit.

Evolution - right then - whats next?

Wonder what the [s]heroes[/s] riders who like riding uphill would ride? Super light xc weapon to get to the top fast, or a super heavy POS to show how hard they are?

Kerley?

I use a rigid single speed, currently in the form of a fixed track bike that weighs around 7kg. I would like a down-lift sometimes as going 30+ mph on a lowish off road gearing has me spinning at 200rpm on mostly hard pack gravel with some softer bits which can be challenging...

That sounds super fun! Still, each to their own

I wonder how much erosion has been caused by mountain bikes (proper, pedally ones) evolving from the long stemmed steep angled rigid things of the 80's into the 6" FS models of today. These have opened it up to riders who previously wouldn't have been able to access certain types of trails, or if they had would have been forced to mince-walk down them.

We should ban all gnarpoons, because they cause more erosion than proper old style mountain bikes.

In fact, I think it's widely accepted that FS allows riders to ride farther faster by reducing the body discomfort of a rigid or hardtail. So rather than banning gnarpoons, all suspension should be banned, so only proper tough riders can do decent mileage.

Well, obviously then, cx bikes should be banned too, as their narrow tyres increase ground pressure.
Rigid, singlespeed fatbikes ftw.
😀

and also walkers with small feet.

Evolution - right then - whats next?

Evolution - right then - whats next?

2018 specialized turbo levo.

[img] [/img]

Even solves any erosion [s]whinges[/s] issues

ha ha Tomhoward - for once i agree with you 🙂

Just seen a man on a supermarket bike wearing a great big ruck sack.There was a red cable coming out of the backpack and connected to something on his bike
He wasn't pedalling but he was was overtaking cars doing 30.
No registration plate, so not legal.

You saw an idiot

I'm with theotherjohnv on the suspension ban.

Took the toddler for a spin up on Haldon today, and at one point I was overtaken by a guy on a decent looking full-sus electric bike. He wasn't pedalling 😉
When we got back to the hub he was at the cafe and I had a chat with him about the bike. Don't worry I was really nice!
He was fully aware that it was illegal, and was a bit cagey about what he'd done, but said that he'd retro-fitted a throttle and bits he'd got online. He mentioned a forum where lots of people share info about hacking Ebikes - pedelecs.co.uk I think?
So if it's that easy, I suspect a lot of people will do it, or have it done.

Klunkers > front suspension > full suspension > disk brakes > E assist. Evolution innit.

Y'see, I'd put it more like this:

People not wanting/able to ride uphill > bikes that are better at going down than up > uplift centres > e-assist bikes > electric motorbikes - after all, why even bother pedalling at all?

I've always suspected mountain biking lacked the ethical core of other outdoor pursuits such as rock climbing. It's now official - it has jumped the ethical shark.

So if it's that easy, I suspect a lot of people will do it, or have it done.

Just the same as most people drive over 30mph in 30 mph areas, a lot of people still use their phones, i.e. a lot of people break what they see as minor laws but they are breaking them none the less.

Did you report the owner?

People not wanting/able to ride uphill > bikes that are better at going down than up > uplift centres > e-assist bikes > electric motorbikes - after all, why even bother pedalling at all?

I've always suspected mountain biking lacked the ethical core of other outdoor pursuits such as rock climbing. It's now official - it has jumped the ethical shark

I'd agree with that. On the other hand I think road biking does have an "ethical core" (Go on, flame away 👿 )

WGAS? More folk outdoors enjoying themselves is good.

"Ethical Core" - really?

ing down than up > uplift centres > e-assist bikes > electric motorbikes - after all, why even bother pedalling at all?

I've always suspected mountain biking lacked the ethical core of other outdoor pursuits such as rock climbing. It's now official - it has jumped the ethical shark

Pretty much agree as well to a point. There are mtber's who buy into the value of cycling being a wholly human powered activity. But there is a subset that has always viewed pedalling as an inconvenience. Emtb's for them are a natural evolution. I just wish they could separate from main stream mtbing and go their own way.

Would take less than 30 seconds to derestrict mine.

Plenty folk have done it.

How ever realising that flying along at apeeds that the bike isnt really set up to handle constantly and that its my skin that will be lost on the road reminds me that yep the speed limits there for good reason. And its pedal assisted because i want the exercise but i want to recover from harder sessions but not succumb to the car.

Is it black and white through taxi?

Last saturday i rode up teide from puerto de la cruz on a road bike in 4 hrs today i rode my ebike to the shops in jeans and a t shirt to pick up breakfast. Should i have got changed into my cycling clothes and put on my spds to go to to the shops on a "real bike"? Should i have walked for 2hrs ?

He wasn't pedalling but he was was overtaking cars doing 30.
No registration plate, so not legal.

Is it black and white through taxi?

I just wish they could separate from main stream mtbing and go their own way.

Wtf is "main stream mtbing"?

Wtf is "main stream mtbing"?

As you so politely asked. Riding a mtb that doesn't have an engine. I presume your not stupid so it's a surprise you couldn't work that out yourself.

I presume your not stupid so it's a surprise you couldn't work that out yourself.

Well I know the difference between your and you're so I'm not doing too badly thanks.

As a side note it does seem interesting that people commenting on this thread that are genuinely fast on a bike seem to not have a problem with legal ebikes.
But some people that as far as I'm aware are just plodders like the rest of us seem to have a big issue with them.
Maybe it's an ego thing with some of the less robust of mind people.
I don't own an Ebike and have never even ridden one BTW but can see how an Edownhill bike could be brilliant on the local DH trails with no uplift.