[Closed] Coping Without Being Clipped In!

skill?

Some of us can't imagine being attatched to the bike!

Generally with flats that have huge pins and special super sticky shoes ... so almost like being clipped ...

*runs away*

Put the seat down for coming downhill.
Press on the pedals to go uphill.

True jack, I suppose its what youre comfortable with isnt it?

Tom what happens if its not [i]that[/i] technical?

Point your toes slightly down and push on the bars while stood up, that'll grip your pedals a little more in such semi-technical situations.

Never find I fall off flats, despite being a mainly spd rider, unless I do man-made jumps, but I cant do those at all anyway 😀

I changed over from using SPDs to flat about a year ago. For me the main difference is that with SPDs I moved the bike around by jumping upwards and bringing it with me, whereas with flats you've got to push down and forward a lot more, to bunnyhop properly, to get traction on the pedals (climbing or descending). If you try jumping upwards with flats on I find that you just jump off the bike, which is bad when going fast downhill or over a drop.

With flats you cant pull the bike by your feet, you have to do it with your hands - your feet have almost no involvement with the exercise,other than a slight tilting and backward push to maintain contact. With spuds I bunnyhop with little more than a bounce on the calves and then using the shins to stop the body motion, the momentum carries the bike upward. Its a whole lot more involved with the flats.

With flats you cant pull the bike by your feet

You can! Very easily
(matt - spd user for 12 years....)

#
jackthedog - Member

Some of us can't imagine being attatched to the bike!
Posted 20 minutes ago # Report-Post

Amen.

I did Stainburn red route for the first time yesterday with flat pedals for the first time in ages. No way would I have even attempted it clipped in.

You can! Very easily

Did the route but after riding for 6+ years in SPD's I found it very strange and I must difficult in places esepcially climbind and techical descending, how the hell do people cope without being clipped in?

Try proof reading your posts before you send them

I think your post just proves that SPDs make you lazy; many people rely on them too much. Like a few have already said, I have always found it strange being attached to a mountain bike (I use spds on my roadie) and never got use to it and went back to flats, since then I have found my riding, as well as my confidence, has improved.

Staying attached to flat pedals on technical descents is easy, you drop your heals. You have to think about it tho, dropping your heals doesn't come naturally. This is correct technique anyway for control of the bike, but SPD users tend not to bother, which causes bad technique/body position.

After using SPD's (well they are actually Time pedals) for years I thought I would give flats a go. I bought some Gusset Slim Jims and a pair of 5/10 shoes and off I went. 1st ride I finished with aching knees which became agonizing the next day. Same with the 2nd ride and the 3rd and 4th. After a week I could barely walk without painkillers put the bike away and had a week off riding.

When I got back on bike after the week off I used the Time pedals and there was no knee pain turns out that I waggle my heels when I pedal heel in at the bottom of the stroke heel out at top. The Time pedals have lots of float but the Gusset 5/10 combination locked my foot in one position all the way round the stroke. Absoluteley killing my poor battered knees.

Ok does this mean that I am the only person left in the UK still using toe clips?
Love feeling strapped in, kinky I know, but it helps.

Riding flats gives you the skills riding SPD made you think you had.

roger - you are but rejoice in it, I used to love my clips apart from when my feet grew so much that normal clips left me with numb toes (squished the sides of my feet in with the strap).

"I did Stainburn red route for the first time yesterday with flat pedals for the first time in ages. No way would I have even attempted it clipped in."

Why? Its not like its hard (As in what is there that you should feel uncomfortable clipped in, IF you've given them the chance to get used to them (properly) as with most riding?)

Have you never used SPDs or just not properly used to them
As I haven't used flats in a good while I wouldn't consider anything but SPDs for the double black warren boulder trail. I want to think about riding instead whether my feet are going to fall off. I as good as always manage to unclip in time if things get nasty, if they do its often better to try to ride it out anyway

"SPDs make you lazy; many people rely on them too much."
Yes they make you lazy
But
Why does that matter? They keep you feet on(/in) your pedals and if you've gotten used to them enough that you are comfortable enough to use them anywhere (and trying to push things a bit) and unclip as you please, whats the problem?

"Riding flats gives you the skills riding SPD made you think you had."
I'd just rather ride my bike. I know I'm never going to be a pro, so why not just take one less thing out of the equation and help me along. Its not like its taking that much away from riding? (when I rode flats I was used to them and didn't have to think about dropping heels etc.. just as I don't have to think about unclipping now with SPDs)

I have been riding flats and never tried SPS's, but some friends say it helps for XC, so I might give them a go! Haven't decided to go with Time[?] or shimano SPD's yet though... which is better?

I want to think about riding instead whether my feet are going to fall off.

IME this almost never happens. I fall off my bike way more often than my feet come adrift.

Once you are used to them, no. heel dropping and other maintaining pedal grip means you don't. But once used to being clipped in, its easier to stay that way? (and vice versa)

Ok does this mean that I am the only person left in the UK still using toe clips?

Nope - bought some SPDs but can't get the old pedals off so still got the old toeclips. Removed the cage though, just use the front bit to help pull up on the pedals climbing, and I can flip the pedal over for full flat behaviour when I feel like it (e.g., descents where I suspect I may need to part company with the bike at some point!). Learnt to keep feet level when descending a long time ago after a couple of slippages...

Just find I can dab more easily with flats on really technical sections (far faster than you can clip out but more importantly clip back in) and on really fast DH/alpine stuff I get masses more confidence feeling my foot on a proper platform. Its sort of irrational, but thats why arguments spring up on here abuot this all the time.

porterclough - dont you find you catch teh cages on the floor loads? I had several cases of the straps wearing through while out on rides and found that every time I tried to ride with the flat side up the cage hooked rocks and logs 🙂

Shimano = bulletproof, engage with a nice click, not good with dodgy knees, can be a bit clog prone in mud

Time = bulletproof, engage with a lound clunk, VERY GOOD for dodgy knees, better than Shimano in mud

Crank Bros = need a lot of TLC, very quiet soft engagement (hard to tell if your in sometimes) Fantastic mud clearance

My reccomendation Time Aliums you can get them for about 28 to 30 quid and mine have lasted 4 years and they are still spinning sweet

ck - yeah, but I try and flip them over so I'm 'in'. Got sufficiently good at it it's not a problem. One day though, I really must try the spds out 😉 (I just know I will fall off sideways in slow motion though)

If i'm going to be drifting corners then it's flatties, if not then its Spd's.

[i]Tom what happens if its not that technical? [/i]

Drop your seat less ;0)

i wish i had flats yesterday could of proberly jumped over the bars insted or crippling myself

another flats rider here. Never tried spds.

I don't know how folk find it so hard to get out of spds - you soon learn - I can get my foot out of the spds to take a dab without any problems. Multirelease cleats help but I never crash 'cos I couldn't take a dab when I needed to

i use both. flats for Dh when its not pedaly courses other wise i use cleats.

everything else I'm clipped in for. use egg beaters now not SPD's

Just started using Crank Bros Mallets after always riding flats.

Need to get some confidence though as I'm a few yards slower on technical descents

i have always been put off by clips,just how quickly can you get out of them.i know in my case it would have to be about 5 microseconds for me to even consider them.

Once again the myth that SPDs promote poor technique is perpetuated. They don't, poor riders do. In exactly the same way that poor riders have their foot out at every opportunity when riding flats, relying on that rather than correct body and bike position (downhiller s buzz phrase/excuse is "foot out flat out"). Just because you ride SPDs it does not mean that you do not think about your feet or have good technique. Fair play if you can ride flats fast but with modern 5:10s and good pedals it really isn't difficult. Personally I am SPD institutionalised and whilst I can ride flats I find that the faster/more technical/steeper the terrain, the more I want to be clipped.

Flats or SPDs or toe clips who cares? Do whatever you are happiest with not what is trendy.

Well said Duir - I love the way on this thread one person said point the toes down another said heels down

Rob - being on spds does not slow me down at all in getting my feet out - but you have to learn the movement and get it to be instinctive - you [i]will[/i] fall a few times until you learn this

I dislike not being able to click in on techy terrain and prefer flats. But SPDs on XC all the way

I dislike not being able to click in on techy terrain and prefer flats

That's a confusing statement.

That's a confusing statement.

Not really, I wholely agree with it - what they mean is its worse to be unable to engage a spd and have zero platform to work with than to have no clip but at least have a good platform to stand on/grip.

I really have never found the "getting out" a problem at all, it comes instinctually to me, but getting in often takes a bike length or two especially in mud - this ruins whole sections at speed if you've needed to dab due to a slip etc.

Got to agree with you coffeeking.
I've been riding SPD for a few years (after switching from flats) now and never had any problems getting them to release in any type of riding.

I have do have a set of caged shimano ones though as it at least gives me a good amount of contact if there are mud issue or I have had to release for any reason.

Guess you just got to try the two and go with what suits

Not really, I wholely agree with it - what they mean is its worse to be unable to engage a spd and have zero platform to work with than to have no clip but at least have a good platform to stand on/grip.

I really have never found the "getting out" a problem at all, it comes instinctually to me, but getting in often takes a bike length or two especially in mud - this ruins whole sections at speed if you've needed to dab due to a slip etc.

Not being able to clip straight in isn't an issue....

[img] [/img]

I dislike not being able to click in on techy terrain and prefer flats

I am still confused. You dislike not being able to "click in" (do you mean clip in?) and prefer flats? Eh?

Yeah, that one got me too

Yes, I was confused by that post aswell.

And, In fairness to the poster who said toes down, they were not talking about barreling down rocky descents. You would point you toes down to scoop the back end up for example.

And, duir is mincing with words, I don't see anyone saying that SPDs "promote bad technique", like it's the pedals fault. I think most people are talking about laziness, which would imply the person being at fault. So, duir, you are just re affirming what is being said.

And, duir is mincing with words

I don't see anyone saying that SPDs "promote bad technique", like it's the pedals fault. I think most people are talking about laziness, which would imply the person being at fault. So, duir, you are just re affirming what is being said.

1.This is correct technique anyway for control of the bike, but SPD users tend not to bother, which causes bad technique/body position.

So I guess it's all about the feet then? I am going to go watch my Greg Minaar, Steve Peat and Gee Atherton vids and see what their clipped in feet are doing.

Oooh just found this post again!

The confusing post - the point was, I think, that if you cant clip in (click in, call it what you will) then with SPDs you're shafted and have nothing to grip with if you cant clip in properly in time. So in that case I prefer flats so that I can just step on and not worry - with basic shimano spuds your feet will slide right off the spud if you dont clip in straight away.

I like my flaties becasue you can litteraly jump on the bike and ride away.

Expecialy on realy technicaly bits where you need to put power down/have controll from the off, and don't have the luxary of rolling a few ft before cliping in. Flats you could stand on a ledge, jump on and ride off it, i'd like to see a cliped rider do the same!

SPD's have their place, but for me I can't see the point off road, they just comprimise too much on the kind of stuff that run to ride! Just look at the beast any weekend, covered in riders mincing down on their cliped in, whilst the riders on flats breeze past.

Personally I swap between the two. I have never had a problem releasing from spd's. I'm still trying to get to grips with lifting the rear wheel with flats, hands up I relied on being attached to the bike in the past. Unlike some here, I personally find it harder to get my foot positioned correctly with flats quickly (Easton Flatboys and 5.10s).

(mr MC posting)

after 15yrs of spds I will be going to flatties when my broken knee heals and am reading this with interest. Saying spds encourage laziness or lack of skill is piffle. You develop a technique that makes use of the equipment you have. Drivers dont double de-clutch now as they dont need to, does that make modern drivers lazy or lacking in skill? I shift up the box on my motorbike without using the clutch, laziness or just a different developed skill?

I am half looking forward to, half pensive about learning to ride flat as it does take a different technique. I have always been happy to stay clipped in spds on high woodwork, gap jumps and drops, and the only time I rode with flatties as an experiment and did a teeny drop (the small ladder drop at chicksands) the bike "fell away" from me, and indeed MC took a quality picture of me with my feet off the pedals, and an "oh f*ck" expression.

Riding flats wont make me a better rider, it will require a different set of techniques to be learnt.

I'm loling @ this thread

I've got used to the Mallet's now and love being clipped in

To be honest, you just get on with it, there's no mad skills involved. The only time I wish i could still clip in is jumping, but that's because I'm rotten at jumps and clips would prevent me from jumping off the bike. I know that the usual fear is for your feet to slip off but it just doesn't really happen unless you positively invite it.

Lets face it no one is right or wrong to use flats or SPD's, Its an individual choice and choice is good! Just because you use a certain type of pedal does not mean that you are a better rider and everyone should use that particular pedal. I use Z control Time pedals, they have a large platform to support my foot when I land hard or find it difficult to clip back in. They are the best choice for ME. The same thing could be said about buy different bikes and components.