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One of the lads bought the Endurance version of the Argotal and fitted it for Peaks ride this weekend, along with a Krypto rear... He was absolutely blown away. So i ordered 2 Argotals in Endurance to go along with the other pile of rubber i've bought this week.
forgot, I took an exciting photo on Saturday 😀
One professional review of the argotal that I read was not very complimentary about the endurance compound. They loved the soft and super soft compounds though.
I went with supersoft, and it is brilliant
Why oh why cant we have lightweight tyres in soft compounds ? after initially being a sceptic I am now totally sold on the benefits of tyre inserts (Tannus are bloody amazing). I used to get loads of pinch flats and ruin hundreds of tyres but now im convinced I would never have another pinch again even if I ran XC tyres with no pressure. So why do I have to have these daft car tyres just to get a soft compound ?! I get some people (probably most people) dont run inserts but with all the different brands and all the godzillion different combinations that are out there I cant believe there isn't room in the market for this tyre!!! Just bought 2 Argotals in trail compound out of stubbornness - one is going on the front....will report back if I survive the winter. Rant over.
Would be interested to know how draggy it is in SuperSoft, is it full DH/SS ?
I was thinking of fitting it but was worried it'd be proper slow and draggy, i'd be running this on my manual bike.
after initially being a sceptic I am now totally sold on the benefits of tyre inserts (Tannus are bloody amazing)
Continental say NO.... No no no.... They change the way the tyre reacts due to changing the air volume (i think), but either way, according to Continental, don't run any inserts. I know Ethan wasn't running them on his GT this year and suffered very few issues.
I’ve been running Kryptotal DH on my new bike and they’re pretty draggy and *feel* heavy when pedalling in sloppy/muddy conditions, whereas in summer they were fine. Unless I’m riding uplift then the endurance/soft seem a good compromise if you need to pedal. Have two Argotals on order to get me through winter.
Continental say NO…. No no no…. They change the way the tyre reacts due to changing the air volume (i think),
They wouldn't be mush use if they didnt change how the tyre reacts 🙂
Would be interested to know how draggy it is in SuperSoft, is it full DH/SS ?
I'll prefix this by saying its gone on an ebike, a low power ebike - trek fuel exe, but still an abike all the same.
I fitted the DH super soft on the front (with no inserts). It doesnt feel draggy - and the battery range has not noticably decreased. There's two things I noticed immediately, one is loads of grip - almost like dry levels of grip. The other is the damping of the tyre, you dont get any pinginess from it,no harshness, its a very well damped feeling.
I'm a total convert to inserts. I love the effect they have on the handling and damping of a tyre.
I'd be fitting my Rimpact inserts if I bought a Kryptotal/Argotal combo. I didn't realise Continental had forbidden them.
It doesnt feel draggy
I missed the edit window - but was going to add that it doesnt feel draggy compared to the maxxis assegai exo+ in maxx terra compound that I had fitted before the argotal
I only discovered the Magic Mary last winter after several years of running a shorty and now I have to change? 🙂
I've just put a new one on the front, an ADDIX Ultrasoft with the Super DH casing, it's heavy! But I didn't notice the extra weight on yesterdays pedally ride over the Peak district. It worked really well in some of the worst conditions I've ridden.
I'm coming to the conclusion that DH casing (on the front) along with supper grippy rubber is the way to go. I was able to run it with lower pressures than I normally would without it squirming, the grip was by far better than anything else I tried previously.
Now it looks like the MM is being usurped!
I'm changing up a wheel size in the coming month or two so looking for tyres, bookmarked for feedback!
Continental are due to be bringing out the enduro case in supersoft.
IMO they are a step up from the Maxxis offering, much better levels of grip, wear is much better (I'll be lucky if I get 12 weeks out of a DHR on the back, and we are talking no sideknobs left, centre section is still good to go!)
Currently have an Argotal DH SS up front and a Kryptotal DH S on the rear on a Kenevo SL, no real difference to the range compared to Maxxis. No need to run inserts either.
Would be interested to know how draggy it is in SuperSoft, is it full DH/SS ?
Maybe read some of the previous posts or even fit them and try it for yourself...
One mans draggy is another mans fine to do huge days with.
I thought I read there maybe a trail / soft coming out as well. Would be a good trail tyre on the front Kryptotal. Maybe like an exo+ 3c maxx terra sort of thing. But perhaps a bit burlier than an Assegai knob height wise.
I've just fitted the Trail compound/Endurance to the Trek for this weekends ride. Not because i'm unhappy with the Hillbilly, but just to experiment with this and see how it feels.
julians
Free MemberOne professional review of the argotal that I read was not very complimentary about the endurance compound. They loved the soft and super soft compounds though.
TBH I just don't think it makes much sense for the argotal- the soft isn't exactly draggy considering what the tyre's for, and tbh with the knobbliness of the tyre I think most people would go softer rather than harder, and if you want harder you'd also go less knobbly. Or put it another way,it's like a shorty, if a shorty is the right answer then maxxterra is probably the wrong compound.
I don’t know about that comment 100% - I think with knobbly mud spikes it’s often the tread itself finding the grip digging in - as much as the compound. An old Hillbilly Gripton I had (old rubbish rubber) worked amazingly in the mud. It’s just when it found roots and rocks the crap compound got found out.<br /><br />
So for muddy bridleway sort of stuff the Argotal endurance may work - just for steep tech muddy and rooty / rocky stuff I’d want soft or ultra / super soft.
With the front Kryptotal I’m less convinced on the endurance compound - I’ve gone for a soft one in enduro casing now to save weight over the DH one bit with better rubber than endurance.
I think the endurance compound is more suited to a rear Kryptotal probably - like running the equivalent of a Dual compound maxxis dhr2 on the rear. Rolls a touch faster and lasts longer.
Anyone else having problems ripping the sidewalls on the enduro casing Kryptotals? I'm generally been pretty easy with tyres but now killed 2 fairly new rears in 6 months running around 25psi +/- (I'm about 71kg).
Love the tyres but getting frustrating/expensive. Anyone running a dh casing (soft) Kryptotal rear on a bike they do a lot of pedalling on? Not sure an insert would save them as they've both been quite big slashes.
anyone else having problems ripping the sidewalls on the enduro casing Kryptotals? I’m generally been pretty easy with tyres but now killed 2 fairly new rears in 6 months running around 25psi +/- (I’m about 71kg).
Love the tyres but getting frustrating/expensive. Anyone running a dh casing (soft) Kryptotal rear on a bike they do a lot of pedalling on? Not sure an insert would save them as they’ve both been quite big slashes.
I run an enduro kryptotal on the rear, no issues so far (600 miles) , I'm usually pretty hard on rear tyres but this one has been hassle free, running 20psi, no inserts etc, in rocky peak district trails, southern spain etc.
Anyone else having problems ripping the sidewalls on the enduro casing Kryptotals? I’m generally been pretty easy with tyres but now killed 2 fairly new rears in 6 months running around 25psi +/- (I’m about 71kg).
Love the tyres but getting frustrating/expensive. Anyone running a dh casing (soft) Kryptotal rear on a bike they do a lot of pedalling on? Not sure an insert would save them as they’ve both been quite big slashes.
ive given up on lighter casings on the rear. we have alot of flints our way and, it must be how i ride - (i like sliding the rear end about?), but i tend to cut slashes in lighter tyres. DH tyres i seem to be OK. Every now and again i break and try a lighter tyre but it always gets cut before it wears out. no experience with Contis though but i am very conti curious!
I ripped an enduro soft Xynotal in Dyfi forest - 2-3cm slash in the sidewall. I think it wa as freak issue as down here in south wales /‘Fod / Mendips / Bristol I’m fine with a trail casing Kryptotal. Smashed one round bike park wales on the weekend fine with no dramas too. Running a Kryptotal front enduro soft and loving that so far - at bike park wales it was just glued everywhere.
I ran a Kryptotal front on the rear in DH / super soft and it was a bit of a draggy thing tbh. Can you get the rear DH in a soft compound maybe?
I picked up one of the cheap Argotal endurance for the front of my ebike (Trek Rail). I do a lot of boring miles to meet my mates and didn’t want to wear out a soft quickly. Got a cheap Assegai from Peaty’s bike bonanza on the rear. Apart from the obvious risks of mixing brands it’s working really well. Plenty of grip in loam/mud but also surprisingly ok on sandstone.
My lad has a gen 2 Shorty Maxx Grip DD on the front of his bike. He says it’s amazing (good rider).
Side by side the Argotal & Shorty look very similar, block pattern is almost the same, the Argotal having much taller blocks.
Apart from the obvious risks of mixing brands
You mean being ridiculed?
Exactly. I’m in mismatch logo Hell.
Here’s an Argotal on the left and a Shorty Gen 2 on the right. Very similar apart from some differences in the sipes on the centre blocks.
and a different shade of yellow on the logo 🙂
colp
Full MemberMy lad has a gen 2 Shorty Maxx Grip DD on the front of his bike. He says it’s amazing (good rider).
He's right, it's an incredible tyre, but it's also like pedalling a paving slab- maxxgrip is a very sticky rubber but also slow rebounding and the doubledown is pretty much a light dh carcass. Love mine but it's got to be properly terrible conditions or uplift before I fit it. It's even a noticable go-slow on most descents never mind getting it to the top.
TBH this is basically why the argotal soft's such a fantastic success for me, it's not really the grip , it's the speed.
Having read so much praise for the Conti's I ordered a Kryptotal F and Xynotal both Enduro/Soft to try from Bikeinn last month.
28 days later, they showed up yesterday. I decided to fit them before I went out riding, replacing a WTB verdict L/H and a Breakout T/H I've been running for a while.
The Kryptotal was a pain to seat. I had to use a tube to seat it, the Xynotal was easy. Both seemed to be slippery to handle. Once fitted I picked my bike up and it was noticeably lighter.
First impression was they were much easier to pedal than the WTB's. Local riding is chalk & clay which was has dried out a lot but not turned to dust just yet, these are my favourite conditions for these trails.
Initial impression was how fast they were and how much cornering feel they had.I then had a shock braking on a short steep section on trail. Braking grip was nowhere close to the WTB's.
I then crashed on my second descent. I was couldn't slow down for a off camber awkward section and got in a mess braking and turning, and now I have bruised ribs.
The Kryptotal reminds of a Wild Enduro Gum X, and a Vittoria Mazza. The cornering bite was like the Michelin, but it doesn't have the braking. With a Mazza it's very fast but you have to brake in a straight line and I realise it's going to be the same with this. I liked the casing feel compared to the WTB'S which a find a bit wooden.
They have some upsides but the braking is worrying. I set pressures to my usual 24/27 when they were cold and then rode 15 minutes on warm roads to the trails. I do wonder if they warmed up and the pressure increased, but this would only be a minor amount.
I have another set of wheels with an Assegai Exo+ Maxx Grip & DHR2 Maxx Terra on that I like and I will do some back to back testing once my ribs are better.
I can’t say I’ve found the Conti’s any worse under braking than most other things I’ve used. The Xynotal will probably give up some grip to the Kryptotal rear in this respect. Currently running Hillbilly t7 front / Kryptotal Trail rear and it’s been epic through all the recent mud. I w had grip on corners where other people have been sliding.
Will shortly be switching to Kryptotal front (soft / enduro) Xynotal rear (soft / enduro) and will run that until it gets properly biblical again.
I think the 2.4 Kryptotal rear is very similar to a dhr2 2.4 - but the trail / endurance one is stronger than an exo or exo+ casing but lighter than DD.
Kryptotal front is like an Assegai but better for me - deals with mud better.
Xynotal is interesting - I found it’s a great all rounder / rolls ok / finds more grip than you think it might do with the ramping on the centre knobs.
Edit - just to add on pressures I mostly run 23 psi both ends. Unless it’s muddy / steep tech and then I go down to about 20
Xynotal is meant to be more of a hard condition tyre (certainly in NE England there's not much of that at the moment) with more and more closely spaced blocks than the Kryptotal. I have one waiting to go on the non-e-bike to replace a Kryptotal rear. That is an awesome tyre but fairly draggy, so hoping to trade off a bit of grip for speed. Argotal up front in both cases, and all Enduro casing soft compound.
Kryptotal front is like an Assegai but better for me – deals with mud better.
Which just goes to show how much the terrain you ride is the variable I guess, as this is the exact opposite to my experience. I think the Krypt is a good tyre, but so far for me, in all the rain we've had, the Assegai edges it, and I've taken off the Krypt and I'm waiting for it to dry out a bit more.
Interesting - maybe it depends on the mud. I’m comparing an exo / 3c maxxterra Assegai with a Kryptotal enduro / soft. The Kryptotal bites better and clogs less for the most part round here.
I just swapped from a krypototal enduro soft rear to a xynotal enduro soft on the rear wheel - under braking it feels about the same as the kryptotal, it is noticably worse for traction uphill on soft surfaces though, which I guess you'd expect from the heavy ramped knobs, it spins out quite easily. The xynotal feels a bit easier to pedal than the kryptotal though. I'll be keeping the xynotal on for the summer.
I have a argotal downhill supersoft on the front - and I'm shortly (just waiting for a longer period of dry weather) going to swap that for a kryptotal front enduro soft , or maybe the rumoured trail soft version thats not yet available.
replacing a WTB verdict L/H
Ah well, you were swapping from the best front tyre in the biz (in my opinion) 😉
Or were you not so keen on it?
I like WTB tyres and the Verdict is superb for the winter. The Breakout is my all time favourite rear tyre. The one I took off is very worn and I have one more with some life in it.
The Breakout looks good, shame that WTB don't seem to have very effective distribution in the UK in recent years.
I love the Verdict for winter or mixed conditions, and the Vigilante has impressed me too. Bit more of an all-rounder.
Argotal DH supersoft front and soft rear, 29 2.4 flavour on an ebike. Half a dozen or so rides on the steep, loose and slippy trails round here and they are amazing. I was coming off a very good set of tyres (Mary Ultrasoft SG front and DHR2 DD Maxxterra rear but the grip from the Argotals is a level up
I set pressures to my usual 24/27 when they were cold
Edit – just to add on pressures I mostly run 23 psi both ends. Unless it’s muddy / steep tech and then I go down to about 20
Tried mine (Fr Enduro) on the front recently, I went for 20psi based on Schwalbe's PressureProf recommendation for their similar Super Trail casing, and it felt fine. I'm 75kg, previously ran 20psi in EXO type front tyres with a Rimpact.
Conditions too different to have much confidence (and no insert as I failed to fit it), but they felt less conforming under loaded cornering than the Der Baron Projekts they replaced. Like they were remaining rounded, not deforming as much into a flat contact patch.
Can't be long now.
Few weeks ago:
Sea Otter this week:
Used my Kryptotal front / Xynotal rear summer combo today. Woods were drier than they have been and the things were great. Bit into the loose stuff on off camber / rooty traverse bits and just generally awesome. That said the conditions were better than they have been in months and months. Really enjoyed my ride today and got a pb/ a few 2nds on Strava
Anyone else having problems ripping the sidewalls on the enduro casing Kryptotals? I’m generally been pretty easy with tyres but now killed 2 fairly new rears in 6 months running around 25psi +/- (I’m about 71kg).
I ripped an enduro soft Xynotal in Dyfi forest – 2-3cm slash in the sidewall. I think it wa as freak issue as down here in south wales /‘Fod / Mendips / Bristol I’m fine with a trail casing Kryptotal
Might the Enduro casing be in fact less tough than the Trail casing?
They're both 3 ply cap and 2 ply sidewall, but the plys are 60tpi on the Trail but 110tpi on the Enduro. That should make the Enduro more supple but have less puncture resistance.
Not having thought about that, the supposedly (turns out perhaps not) tougher cap and sidewalls was the only pro I had for the Enduro Soft versus Trail Soft with an insert - that's where I get my punctures. Bit moot given those aren't available anyway. My Fr Enduro also arrived 90g overweight so 175g over a Trail, main reason I'll be replacing when they become available. @momo halfway down this thread also had one similarly overweight.
Still waiting to have different compound options on each casing!
They've been seen on some OEM bikes since at least February
Just got a Kryptotal enduro / soft rear to try instead of the trail / endurance one this winter. Kryptotal front enduro / soft has been on my bike all summer and it’s been great. Will stay on until it’s hillbilly conditions.
The enduro doesn't work for me on the front unfortunately, not supple enough at the pressure required to keep it from burping.
Wild Enduro up front at least while I'm waiting. It's very square.
I fitted my argotal dh supersoft for an uplift trip, got 1 and a half runs in and had a massive crash, knocked myself out and broke my shoulder and both hands. Clearly the tyre's fault 🙂