I recently visited a suspension company, who to my surprise also made a few general recommendations to my overall setup.
One of these was to roll my bars much much more forward than I had them. I did have them in line with the fork angle, which is the recommendation I had been given from a well known DH racer who gave me a bit of coaching once, plus seems to be what most people I know go with.
I’ve only been able to try this new forward roll setup once, and so far seems to be good, although the trails were fairly mellow. But is it going to cause me a problem on perhaps steeper trails or jumping? Has anyone else gone with this sort of setup or are you more “traditionally” in line with the fork rake?
I adjust for comfort really as if that isn't good nothing else is.😁
What poop said.
My bars have a slight rise and sweep, I have them slightly angled back as that is comfortable. (brakes and gear levers adjusted to comfortable angles also).
I don't belive there's any hard and fast rule otherwise we'd all be running flat bars. Bars with a bit of sweep and rise allow a bit of rotation so you can put them where they are best for comfort and riding style.
It might be good for pure DH, but you're presumably not only doing DH all the time?
Fork angle (head tube angle?) has little to do with bar rotation considering there's lots of bars in terms of rise, sweep, length..
Also depends on if the bike frame is a good size for reach..
rolling bars back pops your elbows out. i did a youtube video on it a few months back too
Thanks all
Matty - no not DH all the time, trail riding with variety.
Jedi - thanks just watched the video. Do you not mean rolling the bars forward pops your elbows out though?
There’s really two parts to it - rolling them changes the upsweep and backsweep, and that changes how the bars feel, how your hands sit and what your arms are doing.
The other part, which is pretty significant with high rise bars and short stems, is that as you roll the bars forwards you’re effectively lengthening the stem and vice versa. Roll a 40mm rise 800mm bar forwards on a 35mm stem and you can hugely change the steering feel - I even notice the different with a relatively small change in roll with a slightly narrower bar and a longer stem (but I am a bit weird like that...)
Chief thanks that’s all making sense now, as the recommendation was to roll the bars forward and to fit a shorter stem.
Now I was a bit reluctant as the bike is big in terms of reach, and the existing stem was already short (40mm). But I’ve gone to rolling forward and a 35mm stem that I had spare and it feels great so far.
And I have realised I have my brakes angled way too far down....
And I have realised I have my brakes angled way too far down….
Welcome to the noughties. There was a bit of an arms race regarding brake angle until folk had them vertical. I thought we'd all moved on from that stupidity already.
Welcome to the noughties. There was a bit of an arms race regarding brake angle until folk had them vertical
I love the weirdness of mtb style dictat. Watch levers now go nearer horizontal in the customary overcompensatory shift 🤣
It's not just about sticky-out elbows though. It's about how the forces are transferred through your hands. Some hand positions mean the primary force goes into the 'skin' between your index finger and thumb, rather than your palm. On longer/Alpine descents this can be a problem. Also, some (hand/elbow/brake lever) positions lead to the wrists being quite bent, so they collapse under hard hits. Again, the type of trail plays a part here. You may prefer horizontal levers if you ride a lot of really steep stuff.
You need to make adjustments and experiment, then assess what is happening.
I love the weirdness of mtb style dictat. Watch levers now go nearer horizontal in the customary overcompensatory shift
I've set mine skywards just to make sure I'm ahead of the curve.
I was watching the DH worlds and noticed that most of the riders seem to have the bars rolled back so there is little or no upsweep. What's the reason for this?
I was watching the DH worlds and noticed that most of the riders seem to have the bars rolled back so there is little or no upsweep. What’s the reason for this?
The riders will adjust them until they feel comfortable. Obviously, they are comfortable with little or no upsweep. Bike setup is a very personal thing, what suits one person doesn't suit another so copying what other riders do is no guarantee that it is actually a good setup for you.
yes I get that, just wondering if there's something more specific to the conditions that they are riding in (steep, fast, intense etc.) that makes this work from a biomechanics / technique point of view.
I recently visited a suspension company, who to my surprise also made a few general recommendations to my overall setup.
One of these was to roll my bars much much more forward than I had them.
Was that based on them actually seeing how you were sat on the bike or just some generic piece of advice? I usually just start with the bars in their marked neutral position and tweak from there if I'm not happy. I can't actually remember the last time I felt the need to tweak them forward or back.
But having just bought a new bike I had given it a little thought and this thread has reminded me to experiment a little. Given the current "trend" toward shorter stems I'm a little surprised at the advice of rolling the bars forward, but then we don't know how far you already had them rolled back?
Thanks for starting this thread. A week ago or so I saw that jedi video and had a play. I rolled my bars forward quite a bit. I can definitely feel the difference in the elbow position after a longish ride over the weekend with them like that. Too soon to say if it's better or not, though...
“yes I get that, just wondering if there’s something more specific to the conditions that they are riding in (steep, fast, intense etc.) that makes this work from a biomechanics / technique point of view.”
One thing could be that the bars are higher than on a trail bike. I’ve noticed that on my Levo I have the bars rolled a little further back and the brake levers flatter than on my hardtail, and the Levo’s stack height at sag is higher than the hardtail’s. If the bar roll and lever position was the same then relative to my shoulders and arms and hands the bars would feel rolled forwards and the levers downwards because it’s the position vs yourself, not vs the ground or the bike that matters.
DH bikes also spend most of their time pointing downhill, so that changes your position on the bike.
Moshimonster - the advice was given after seeing me riding, specifically seeing me cornering.
In terms of how far angled back I had them, they were approximately aligned to the angle of the forks/head angle. So approx 65 degrees
Surely it's about finding your own personal sweet spot, no advice from anybody could change my mind on what I find most comfortable, you've got to feel good to ride good, everybody's different, bar roll, bar height, lever angle, ride style, nobody's the same, as long as you understand the effects of bar roll etc your good, there's to many variations of torso length, arm length, shoulder width etc, so there's no right or wrong, its totally down to personal preference, that's why those all in one bar/stems won't catch on.
I think there are two factors at play here - rolled forward as jedi says makes the elbows sticking out riding position easier to achieve - but I find for comfort then need to be rolled back as that puts your wrists in a more natural position.
Not being a riding god I go for comfort so rolled back. My guess would be it depends on the type of riding you do
With risers, if you roll them forward it increases the up sweep as said. This means that the angle of the grips with respect to the horizontal increases i.e. they slope down towards the stem. And Vice versa. I find that I like a bit of up sweep because at least for XC this distributes my weight across my hand. If the grips are flat then there's too much weight on the thumb/finger webbing which I don't like.