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ORANGEBIKES.COM Like the look of that. Hides its e-bikeness better than most and seems to be right up there in the power stakes although I'm no expert? Will defo be on my list if and when I make the move to electric.
TBF they were as ugly as your average ebike when they were normal bikes
Well that looks a ton better than the original Orange eeb!
That thing was pure goppage.
I'm thinking, expensive.
I'm thinking, expensive.
£8,250-8,750. Had a look but not sure what the USP is, other than being an Orange
Yeh, pricey. Moreso when compared to Atherton.
I just can't see the point in buying a single pivot these days now that many manufacturers offer free bearings and sealing is generally better. A DW link or similar is just better performing in every technical metric except maybe weight but no one was buying an orange for that, especially an eeb. I demoed 5 bikes a couple years ago back to back down innerliethen and the stage 6 felt awful. The world has moved on from linear suspension and brake jack.
I'd be keen to try it.
Contrary to the previous post, I've always enjoyed the way single.pivot bikes ride. Orange bikes in particular have always had an engaging, lively characteristic that I prefer over the muted feel that some other setups have.
Whilst I wouldn’t purchase an orange e-bike personally the idea that your average singletrack riders would ever actually have a perceivable difference in performance as a result of suspension design is just silly.
I want to want an orange but man they are gopping. It is like they've pigeon holed themselves to tightly into a design they can't get out. Add to that, the few people I know who did have them in the past both had cracked rear triangle and crap support from Orange.
The only Orange bike I ever liked the look of was the nickel coloured P7.
- Nah, that actually looks pretty good for an e bike
- And even if it didn't who cares. Someone riding an ebike isn't exactly craving admiring glances from other riders are they?
Much improved from their previous ebike offering which was pure gop. Hopefully will sell well but think my money would be going on the Atherton over this
You can roll a turd in glitter...
Shame its Mx as I think its looks well for a HX5 bike . Neon yellow or pink please (cira 2013)
I've got single pivot and multi pivot full sussers and think they're both ace. Always enjoyed the ride of an Orange FS, lively and engaging imo.
As for the looks, when I started a thread for people to show what they thought was a good looking FS the results were challenging to say the least (although it also flagged up a lovely looking Spur which led me to buying one)!
I think it looks great.
Always really enjoyed my Oranges, my theory is that single pivot works better with longer travel, harder hitting bikes... I mean my 224 was noticably slower than my Herb but it was way easier to ride, you could just hop on and go, the Herb took me half a day to get used to.
Avinox + Orange is like putting a Telsa motor in an Austin Maestro.
A Changan engine in a Morgan.
Avinox + Orange is like putting a Telsa motor in an Austin Maestro.
Or a K20A into an Allegro - sounds like fun to me 😀
I'd not dismiss the Orange for being a single pivot (I would've at one point in my past) - heard too many tales of how good they can ride. I'd want to test rid the shite out of one though, e-powered or not. Main issue with this one, and not limited to Orange, is the cost of an eMTB like this.
I’ve never owned an orange but I’ve had a go on quite a few, I’ve always thought they rode surprisingly well for such a simple design but need a really good shock and staying off the brakes to get the best out of them.
Single pivot Orange bikes. Upsetting inadequate riders since....
Single pivot Orange bikes. Upsetting inadequate riders since....
Username checks out for guy championing shit suspension 😉
I'd rather ride a HT with my inadequacies than a poorly designed FS tbh
Single pivot Orange bikes. Upsetting inadequate riders since....
My v1 Mega was single pivot, and that was a great bike.
It's the hideous swingarm on Orange bikes that has always bothered me. The front ends don't look much better but I'll concede they have improved a little bit in recent years.
Their 90s hardtails were lovely looking bikes.
Popcorn at the ready .. I do love watching the toys being thrown everywhere when it comes to view points on Orange bikes .. So many triggered riders .
What makes it poorly designed?
Not developing suspension kinematics post 1990's when every other manufacturer has done?
“Not developing suspension kinematics post 1990's when every other manufacturer has done?”
If you actually study kinematics you’ll see that the suspension behaviour of Orange bikes over the last 10+ years has been very good.
The anti-squat is in an excellent range for good pedalling without excessive kickback, the brake squat holds the geometry in shape better than most four bar designs without being so high the rear brake locks things almost solid like on more fashionable high pivot bikes, the leverage ratio is essentially constant and not regressive, and low enough to be easy to damp and reasonable shock pressures or coil weights for bigger riders - if you go big add volume spacers and/or high speed compression and/or hydraulic bottom out.
And the resulting frame weighs less and is easier to maintain than something with more links. The only real downside is fitting a water bottle in - and comments on kinematics from people who don’t understand how this stuff works.
I don’t ride an Orange, I ride a four bar Specialized and I wish it had higher brake squat like my old Banshee (which was a four bar short link design) which had similar brake squat to an Orange. But I do prefer my bike’s more linear and less progressive linkage vs that Banshee - so an Orange would be good on that front.
But I like having a bottle on an ebike - it works so well with the big downtube keeping it clean!
Since about 2015 most full-sus bikes have had pretty decent kinematics. But before then, four bar (Horst link) bikes were all over the place, some ok but also so many bad decisions in pivot placement etc, wallowy pedalling, no midstroke support when you hit a been or jump, wiggly curves making it hard to feel what the back of the bike is doing. A single pivot with the main pivot and ends of the shock in the right places just works! Harder to sell though…
But I like having a bottle on an ebike - it works so well with the big downtube keeping it clean!
Bottle bosses on the underside of the toptube on this Orange - that's definitely a Fidlock bases:
Lolz 🤣
So a design you don't like rather than a poor one?
I don't really have a strong like or dislike. I just refuse to believe that a single pivot with limited variables can be as effective as other suspension designs that have been developed over decades.
I've never ridden one and likely never will. I could be wrong in my assumptions, but I'm not going to lose any sleep if I am, I won't be buying a bike with that design. I'll cope
who still makes single pivot anymore apart from orange? Starling? can't think of anyone else.
I've never ridden one and likely never will
So why bang on about them being shit if you've never even tried one?
Mine was shit. But then I got a good shock for it and it was excellent. I was massively surprised how much better it was.
I like a single pivot. All my linkage bikes ate bearings (4) My single pivot bikes (3) have had much less maintenance.
I guess a single pivot does suit certain riding styles but that's the same with any bike.
I'd love another short travel orange for razzing about. Just so much fun to ride.
“I just refuse to believe that a single pivot with limited variables can be as effective as other suspension designs that have been developed over decades.”
The multi-link marketing has worked well on you! 😉
I like this sort of engineering, I remember being at uni studying mechanical engineering and thinking I’d like to design car suspension for a job (I was mountain biking before uni but that was all on rigid bikes).
If you look at Orange’s geometries you’ll see they’re consistently low slung - so you don’t run quite as much sag as on more progressive bikes but the sagged geometry ends up at a good height and the bottom out forces are similar. You end up with similar or better midstroke support and you’ll have a bit less sensitivity on small bumps but they’re also the bumps where the simple swing arm and one pivot gives the bike more torsional compliance which is arguably more important for finding grip in a corner.
If I started a mountain bike company I wouldn’t do a single pivot design because it’s so much harder to sell after years of multi-link marketing (especially from Specialized who made so many rubbish FSR designs before they converged on behaviour far more like most dual short link bikes) and because you can’t fit a water bottle within the frame without a fight.
you can’t fit a water bottle within the frame without a fight
My only bug bear with Orange FS’s. Otherwise they are great fun and low maintenance.
who still makes single pivot anymore apart from orange? Starling? can't think of anyone else.
I think there are still quite a few but many use a linkage to drive the shock.
There is certainly less than there used to be with brands like Comnencal and Forbidden moving to other platforms.
The bigger Nukeptoof bikes use linkage driven SPs. Think Saracen, Evil & Kona as well? .Then there are flex stay bikes from Spesh & Transition which are also similar.
Anything with a 'Faux-bar' is a linkage driven SP.
There are split pivot bikes from Orbea, Trek & others which are basically linkage driven SP but can isolate braking forces
All of these can behave quite differently, it's not just about the number of pivots.
I can't help but look at the Orange, then look at the Atherton and completely forget about the Orange.
what “development” have other manufacturers achieved really?
specialized are largely using the same old horstlink that was designed around v-brakes and qr wheels.
what “development” have other manufacturers achieved really?
specialized are largely using the same old horstlink that was designed around v-brakes and qr wheels.
Yup, was going to say the same. After years of 'this multi pivot is best', 'no this years version is', 'no this completely new design is' most of the manufactures seem to have settled on a variation of a design that's been around as long as Orange single pivots have!
Loving the I've never ridden one but they're definitely shit argument. 🤣
Bike companies telling people their multi-linkage complexities are about 'kinematics' rather than patent use or patent avoidance is one of MTB marketing's greatest triumphs.