[Closed] 650B - dead already

Send in your pics so we know who has fallen for the BS!

judging by the number of bronsons you see around the surrey hills and swinley id say 650b was in rude health!

certainly at the UKGE theres a lot of 650b bikes around, as much because buying a new 'enduro' bike means its all thats on offer

considering I have a 97, 2002, 2006 and 2013 bike in my shed 26ers will be around for a while yet id say

anyway, i hate kittens, they turn into cats and cats crap in my garden

Very odd statement. I'd say mountain biking is bigger than ever and folks are splashing lots of money on high end mtb's

Totally disagree, my LBS has 85% road bikes on show & sales reflect this

Why do you think bike companies are pushing 27.5"? It's because the mtb market has stagnated & they are trying to kick it up the Arse

Very odd statement. I'd say mountain biking is bigger than ever and folks are splashing lots of money on high end mtb's

Have to disagree with the roadie comment. I can't think of anything worse than being a roadrat/Tarmac terrorist. I hate everything about it.

I think this user may be slightly biased.

IMO the perceived movement away from MTB to road is a symptom of the cycle industry shooting themselves in the foot with the needless attempts to foist two wheel size standards on consumers in an established market for the sake of change when 26" works perfectly well. Given the choice of buying into a wheel standard that may well be transitory or a set of settled road bike standards, why would anyone take the risk of making the wrong choice?

I predict a backlash against it all within the next couple of years with a resurgence of high end 26" bikes and components. If not, then the industry will end up throttling the goose that has laid it so many golden eggs over the last thirty years.

And no, I'm not expecting to see 900c road wheels appearing...

The thing is, the new range of 650b bikes offer longer slacker geometry, which means faster bikes. Add the new range of forks and rear shocks and these 150+ travel bikes climb pretty well too. I was a 26" full sus rider, tried a 650b in the new model on my local tracks and immediately new it was better, it made me better. So an order went in

Anyway still haven't seen a 650b yet!

You've been riding with at least one most Thursday evenings!

Just to offer a different perspective in the shop I work in we are reducing road stock to make more room for the MTB bikes/stuff that we sell more of.

IMO the perceived movement away from MTB to road is a symptom of the cycle industry shooting themselves in the foot with the needless attempts to foist two wheel size standards on consumers in an established market for the sake of change when 26" works perfectly well. Given the choice of buying into a wheel standard that may well be transitory or a set of settled road bike standards, why would anyone take the risk of making the wrong choice?

No, I'd say the road boom really started in 2007 when the TdF was last here, and as Rocketdog says, the 650b push is effect rather than cause. I know some of us (ie. tinytimbo) are failing to face up to the fact that, unlike road cycling, MTBing currently isn't cool (though given this forum is mainly frequented by middle-aged blokes that [b]really[/b] shouldn't be a shock). Even living in Pennine Lancashire, I see far, far more road bikes about than MTBs.

Just to offer a different perspective in the shop I work in we are reducing road stock to make more room for the MTB bikes/stuff that we sell more of.

Maybe so, but equally there are a number of road-only 'boutiques' that have opened recently.

I live in a village with quite a few surrounding small woods.
On any given Sunday I see equal amounts (quite a few considering) of road and mountain bikes whilst walking my dog down the shops.

But the mtbs are big wheeled, short travel hardtails with relatively skinny tyres with fast rolling un aggressive tread.
The riders would not look out of place on a road bike as more meat on a butchers pencil and clipped in fully clad in Lycra.
They are also not hanging about, hammer down on the Tarmac between woods.
I never see anyone like myself, baggies 140mm travel, chunky fit and forget tyres on 26" wheels.
Thing is I think they have it right given my surroundings.
But I suffer with delusions of radness and would look ridicules in lycra.
So remain a overbiked baggy biffer.

I never see anyone like myself, baggies 140mm travel, chunky fit and forget tyres on 26" wheels.

Ah well thats because they're all playing in the deepest darkest woods or trail centres...or sat on their computers talking on forums or hovering their mouse pointers over the buy now buttons on CRC.

Where i ride in the Cotswolds/Wilts you see far less Mtbikers than 5 years ago.Saw 3 yesterday in Cranham/Lecky few years ago that would have been 20 odd.Yet today shorter time out riding on quiet roads saw loads of roadies.

As for wheel size people with newish 26" bikes probably feel shafted by the industy.

Yes..
All hail the NEW 650c 😉

The only 650b rider I've knowingly seen out on the trails was last week when he was sat by he side of the track with bike upside down desperately asking passing riders if they had a spare 650b tube. Probably still there now.

That's it,
In the woods I see the above mtb'ers (people who take there mountain biking seriously).
The occasional dad with a couple of small kids on supermarket mtbs, and an old boy on what must be nearly a twenty year old rock hopper in original spec, which does what my bike does and goes where my bike goes and the old boy could probably ride the legs of me. And I do admire him as I see him practically every weekend for years now on that same bike which I imagine he has had from new and never spent an unnecessary penny on it and done 1000s and 1000s of miles on it.

I only come across what I think of as AM bikes when I go to swinley which is as gnarley as my bike gets.
Some days I really wish I was a northerner.

Why do you think bike companies are pushing 27.5"? It's because the mtb market has stagnated & they are trying to kick it up the Arse

This. 100%.

I used to MTB round Surrey Hills every weekend from 2005-20010. You barely saw a road bike round there. Now the A25 is jammed with groups - to the point where you daren't go anywhere near the national speed limit, but keep down to 30/40 cos there's likely to be a group round the next corner. Which is 100% fine by me.

Peaslake Stores - same - as many roadies as MTB these days. It's all bikes, it's all good. It might just save the UK from sinking under the (over)weight of its population 😀

If the industry had faith that 650B was better than 26 they'd have brought it in as an option like they did with 29, not forced in on people like bullies.

One major factor they've forgotten about - wages have stagnated, living standards are falling, lots of people are skint. MTB is not an essential purchase! Few people are going to spank £2k + on a new bike they don't really want to have to buy or think is any better if they can keep the old 26er running for a few more years and keep their readies for food/rent/mortgage payments.

I hope 650B fails - it's a nasty way of doing business...

Sorry, kittens.

650b.

PTSTIBS.
🙂

That stranded 650b rider could've tried a 26" tube; butyl being an elastic material it would stretch to fit. But sadly this generation has been so brainwashed by consumerism they wouldn't think in the creative way we old skool riders would.

Yes,I'm old and cynical...

When I said big wheeled in my above post I mean 29ers.

And untill recently could not resist an anti 27.5 bleat on a wheel size thread.
But recently I was in halfords admiring a boardman ht for a few minutes before realising it was a 650b, and what gave it away was the huge white 27.5 lettering on the tyres,if not for the lettering I would not have realised.

Which made me realise what a croc the whole thing is and now could not give a toss.
They are just mountain bikes with wheels that are a tiny bit bigger, and not worth bothering my self about.
If people think they are great, well they are right they are mountain bikes but if someone tries to tell me they are better than 26" by a fraction or a revolutionary leap in mountain biking performance and enjoyment, let them believe that because I know it's just riding bikes in the woods.

I did the QE Enduro today, on the way there in the car we passed at least 15 roadies, when we got there, there were about 200 mountain bikers. There was a stall selling about 6 mountain bikes by Lapierre, Nukeproof and Kona - they were all 650b. These, gentlemen are FACTS. (facts without a conclusion, I grant you, but facts all the same).
I was riding a 26" wheeled bike from 2006, by the way.
Also the a couple of the roadies I let go by didn't even thank me. Miserable gits. (this is not relevant to the conversation)

It's the marketing and change for the sake of it to another incompatible standard that irks me; not to mention the thought of all the obsolescent 29" and 27" created.

And not content with doing it once the b'stards did it twice...

fwiw, where I work (Evans) road and city/commuting is booming, has done consistently for the 3 years I've been there, while MTB has been pretty flat. Different area shops sell different splits of bikes but including MO sales there's a clear growth in road bikes. That's new riders coming into cycling and MTBers buying road bikes imo. The base MTB and road rider numbers out there may not have changed much but the new riders are buying road bikes. I'm not sure wheelsize stuff has put anyone off but I doubt it's driven any more sales overall - I'd guess it's stalled as many buying decisions as it's advanced.

So let's see if disc and axle standards then go and do the same thing for road bikes over the next year or 2 .. : )

Planned obsolescence, the lazy way of making people buy more stuff since making stuff that's better in a 'quality' sense is so much harder. Also a sign that there's more stuff available than the market really needs?

It's the marketing and change for the sake of it to another incompatible standard that irks me; not to mention the thought of all the obsolescent 29" and 27" created.
And not content with doing it once the b'stards did it twice...

Just take a deep breath, shit happens.
It is bullshit, but what you gone a do.

Worse things happen in life than a multi billion pound industry keep changing standards in order to drive a market.

Buy an old rockhopper, the sort you see chained up outside on any high street near you,
Put a hundred thousand miles on it and say screw you to the bike industry.

Or think sod it, worse things happen at sea. (Or gaza , Ukraine, Iraq, the list goes on)

"You've been riding with at least one most Thursday evenings!"

It's so fast I didn't know it was there - must have mistaken it for a 26" bike with high rollers on 😉

I think the next big idea is 650b road bikes - makes as much sense a 650b mountain bikes - so that's a green light for the marketeers then - makes the tarmac come alive

Yes,I'm old and cynical...

I also have ridden my 650b with you dark cyan!

I think each one of these wheel size threads should come with a free endoscope so everyone can experience what it is like to disappear up their own jacksies for the umpteenth time. They say that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expect a different result, it seems some kind of hive insanity is taking over.

Is this the STW forum equivalent of Colony Collapse Disorder?

Bought 2 26" frames in the last 7 months. Why...because all my kit is 26" and 26" forks are pretty cheap at the moment plus serviceable, as well as at least one frame that I bought with the bottom failing out of the market. Unless they stop making tyres...which they wont, I'm pretty content.

Perhaps those that need an extra 1.5 inch are compensating for something else? 😉

[url= http://theoatmeal.com/comics/apple ]In a nut shell the 29/650/26 debate[/url] in a IT terms

I hate to break it to all of you saying road bikes are more popular than MTBs where I live and " I never see 650b bikes when I'm out " etc but the UK is one tiny portion of what is a huge global business and manufacturers will make what they can sell globally which means your experience may not be very representative of the overall picture .

I'd love to see the arse fall out of the MTB industry over 650b.

I've never, ever seen such a cynical, nasty, small minded, mean spirited, graceless marketing scam in my life.

I hope those who forced this pointless toss onto the market suffer financially for their decision.
But they won't.
They'll be too busy raking it in by selling the new road standard (whatever that might be) to another bunch of gullible fools.

Harsh attitudes. Big deal if they slap on different wheel size on new bikes that's barely any different to current bikes. If you're happy with what you've got, ride it. New buyers get the new wheels and ride. Only negative impact is on upgraders but it's not long term and there's stock to cover both sizes during it.

Wishing failure on the industry is not good. In fact if they stuck with no change they are more likely to fail and MTB goes into serious decline in favour of the ever more popular road bike.

Remember, not all the industry are money grabbing faceless corporations looking to rip everyone off. There are a lot of smaller guys out there just trying to survive in the market, and even these are looking into or already going 650b.

I wouldn't buy 650b just for the wheel size, but I'm fine with it if the market needs to move on. I'm currently 26 as it is and only if I'm up for a frame change or new wheels will I consider 650b.

Anyway, do we think the world is ending as suspension designs change to progress? No. We lap up new things usually and the market moves on.

ohnohesback - Member

That stranded 650b rider could've tried a 26" tube; butyl being an elastic material it would stretch to fit.

myti: sorry, I didn't notice;-)

Dannyh your talking sense my friend.

I hate to break it to all of you saying road bikes are more popular than MTBs where I live and " I never see 650b bikes when I'm out " etc but the UK is one tiny portion of what is a huge global business and manufacturers will make what they can sell globally which means your experience may not be very representative of the overall picture .

Why is there no great debate among motorists about the ever increasing trend to bigger wheels with ever lower profile tyres on cars?
Mostly driven by marketing and image - just like bikes.

Seems to me the OP needs to nip down to specsavers....

tomhoward:cheeky, what size rims do you suggest?

If 650B really isn't selling they will cease to be made. What comes after that, who knows?

It's so fast I didn't know it was there - must have mistaken it for a 26" bike with high rollers on

Maybe you thought it was a 29er? The front tyre is only 1/2" short of that... :p

There were loads of them at QECP today too!

At least you can put 27.5" forks on a 26" bike - try putting tapered forks on a bike with a 1 1/8" headtube....

I haven't seen darkcyan around here for a long time.

That guy really knows his stuff, shame he never posts anymore.

theocb - you stumped me there!

Grahamh link says a lot,

People take a lot of pride in their bikes and do seek appreciation.
You spend a shit load of money on a bike you want people to tell you how awesomez it is.

There was someone on here just after orange brought out the 650b five who had just bought a new. 26" and was quite pissed off , talking about would the bigger wheels fit his bike or maybe trading for the new one.

Now I am guessing he felt like he had gone from hero to zero overnight .
Yesterday he because of his bike was the envy of his cycling friends , today was the guy who dropped a wedge on a obsolete bike. Because Nothing physically had changed about his bike he still had a great bike, but now would have to listen all the bs about how much better the newer one was. Unless he believed the hype himself.

I am pretty shit as mountainbikers go so will never receive plaudits on my off-road prowess, so sadly only can hope for acclaim on how wide my bars are, short my stem is or how big my wheels are.

If only I could ride like matey boy who had no rear tyre, It would save me a fortune.

I think a lot of people have had the jam taken out of their donut by the switch and are pissed of about it.

@suburbanrueban, I came across a report that put the UK market a second to Germany in number of bikes sold. Then France , then Italy. The Netherlands spent more per average.
The market was worth about 2 billion euros per annum in Germany and 1.2 in the UK.