Forum menu
coming form the motorcycle world, only in a marketing mans head can something that is heavier, less agile and be marketed as more stable and quicker in a straight line, and the next best thing
I guess the biking comparison who be a Hayabusa vs a Panigale
OK - I not light, and I'm not short - so in "ratio" terms a 29er would make sense - the higher front end alone is an attraction. I do look like a gorilla humping a football on a 26er
But I have a Soul and a BFe that I love. My only real gripe being that at 6ft 3ins I find the front end quite low (so correct with riser bars - top tube length is fine)
So when "the man" goes on about 29ers rolloing over things better - can anyone tell me if the front wheel hits a 15 cm object - what is the difference in angle of attack between a 29 inch wheel and a 26ers - is it 2 degrees, 5 degrees or much greater?
Rides over objects / depressions easier - so you hit a 30 hole in the track - a 29er is 10% bigger as a wheel - so this translates perhaps at 3mm more at the depression. Does that make such a big difference ?
I can understand that with a 29er that if BB height is the same , then you are sitting "lower" on the bike , so the CoG will be lower.
Isn't this the only reason why 29ers seem to ride better?
It would appear that everyone in now lower the BB heights of suspension bikes ... is that just coincidence?
Can we expect to seem some 26ers with lower CoG?
Or am I just being a luddite ...
I keep on thinking mini-disc player and betamax
You can throw as much logic at it as you like ......but you'll really have to ride a few to find out if its for you
there are a lot of variables,
the wheel may be heavier, but you dont have to accelerate it as hard because it doesnt rotate as fast for a given speed,
ditto with cornering, for a given speed it will rotate a little slower, lessening the gyroscopic effect.
they arent for everyone, and theres nothng wrong with 26ers anyway.
try a couple, you might love em, or not, not worth getting uptight about.
Is the gyroscopic effect more on a bigger wheel and thus it is harder to turn? Just wondering as they had some spinning wheels that you held at a science museum I went to today and once a wheel is spinning fast it does take a lot to shift it.
I'm not reading all that.
I think it's more 916 vs a td350 meself
Try one and see if you like it is pretty much the only way to find out
Yes - you are probably right - way too much logic 😉
Depends whether its a science or an art!!
I trust the 916 was the 26er ...
Having just sold a 998s maybe I am ready for the dark side ( but I did sell the GS 1150 ADV before that !)
it' possible to make a crap bike with any wheel size.
26 design has had a long run and lots of development time.
29 seems to be moving from "stick bigger wheels in it"
Go try one
As everyone else has said,best to try both. Each has is its on feel, me personally, 26 all day. Have currently got a stumpjumper s-works 29er, wish I had tried it before I bought it. Will be in the classifieds shortly lol 🙂
You're pretty much right OP.
It's the combination of larger wheels and their lower rolling resistance and BB drop. No matter what you do with the BB height on a 26" you'll never get near the drop of a 29'er unless you put 140mm cranks on it.
As we know the main mass on a mountain bike is the rider, putting that mass level with the wheel axle centerline rather than 40mm above it increases stability by quite a large degree. Imagine a motorbike with the engine and fuel tank level with the axle centerline. Think about the cornering and braking advantages.
People find them sluggish or whatever because they're so planted. When you're really hauling ass they come alive but you have to be a bit more aggressive with them than a 26". You'll be going quicker though, no doubt in my mind.
Try here for nerdy discussion :
GEDA - Member
Is the gyroscopic effect more on a bigger wheel and thus it is harder to turn? Just wondering as they had some spinning wheels that you held at a science museum I went to today and once a wheel is spinning fast it does take a lot to shift it.
A bigger wheel at the the same rpm will be harder to turn than a small one at the same rpm - all other things being equal.
But at the same bike speed a 29er wheel will be spinning more slowly than a 26" wheel. But what the balance between the 2 is I don't know.
You're over-thinking it. Just take one round your regular route and make up your own mind.
Not again!!!!
I wasn't entirely convinced but being 6'1" i thought i would give it a bash, so i got myself a cheapie a vitus a year on ive ridden it more than my far more expensive 26er and on the rare occasions i did ride it the 26er felt cramped and sketchy. Now im in the process of rebuilding my 26er into a 29er (probably with carbon rigids since i didn't miss suspension either). You can analyse it all you want but at the end of the day the only way you'll know for sure is to ride.
I ride with mates who have gone into 29er's in a big way, ss, hardtail and fs.
Before they could not keep up in the rough stuff but now they can although the really twisty bits I would say my Five is still the quicker bike.
Where they really score (29er's that is) is on the faster flatter rolling countryside to the pint where I am starting to look at them myself although I will keep the Five.
I attended a demo day on Scot bikes last year and I hated the carbon hard tail 29er but loved the full suspension one...but then they told me it was £6.5k!!!
The wheel size alone doesn't determine a good or bad bike. In theory 29ers have distinct advantages, but rarely does theory and reality converge perfectly. So don't sell your Soul or BFe just to go 29er. They're brilliant bikes.
coming form the motorcycle world, only in a marketing mans head can something that is heavier, less agile and be marketed as more stable and quicker in a straight line, and the next best thing
So why don't we just use 20" wheels? Or 12"? Or 4"? Can you imagine how fast we'd all go with desk chair casters?
What makes 26" this idyll that everything else is wrong? That's the marketing!
Futon River Crossing - nobody is making you read the thread. It is clearly titled ! So do feel free to move on and read something that your don't think is wasting your time
The answer will be to hire a 29er as you all suggest and give it a go ...
Being a bit of a fanboi, I have the Solaris in my sights - but the Charge cooker looks interesting as well, but at a better pricing point
Being an On-One lover of old - how do their 29ers stack up?
Njee - I never said 26ers were faster - smaller wheels are slower - so your analogy is a tad crap. A 20 inch wheel will be far more agile - hence why BMXers have used smaller wheels and down hillers have used 24inch wheel at the rear.
Everything is a compromise, between stability/agility. Too twitchy and it becomes un-ridable. I will give frame builders credit that most know what they are doing - but much of 29er fever is marketing generated to shift units. (Just in case you - I am a marketing director). However, if it is here to say and is no just going to be filed as the 2012 version of biopace and 150mm stems , then great. Consumers should be given choice.
I just want to make a well informed on - what concerns me is that is is difficult to get an objective decision. It always turns personal quickly - I am not criticising anyone else choice .
Please feel free to ride 31 inch wheel dressed in a monkey suit 😀
Try a Singular Swift too if you can, comes with rigid forks and an EBB which are handy options, and cheaper than a Solaris too. Genesis High Latitude and Fortitude too.
Wheel mass is important on an XC 29er. With the Cooker/High Lat you get what it comes with. Buy a frame and you get to spec your own wheels - but it will come out more expensive. So that's worth looking at.
Hi Matt,
I have build up the On-One, Soul and Bfe myself , specced to my choice . TBH that is the concern I have with the Charge - I would be changing bits in weeks
Being an On-One lover of old - how do their 29ers stack up?
One of my riding buddies has just built a 29er Inbred, I've not seen it yet but he may be able to chime in. He said geometry is near identical to the Swift (tiny bit slacker and shorter in ETT I believe, but not much), and got an outstanding price on it in the OnOne sale.
TBH that is the concern I have with the Charge - I would be changing bits in weeks
Ok so in reality the 'saving' on the Cooker full build won't last for long - it looks good value and a nice bit of kit tho.
Perhaps they do frame only, dno.
On-One do offer stunning VFM unless you are a dedicated follower ...
I rode my 456 down mountains in CH that i thought it shouldn't have been able to take. And that was pre CERN
Charge do the cooker frame at 350 , so 150 GBP less than the solaris but possibly as not as good tube set
OK - but 150 quid doesn't make a lot of difference over the lifetime of the bike, I wouldn't let it settle a decision between Cooker and Solaris if you can afford either.
To be honest I do feel there is a bit of 'brand premium' on Cotic (I have a Soul). & frames that use Reynolds, and are stickered up that way, are going to be paying a premium for use of that trademark too. I don't doubt there are other steels just as good but without the brand cachet (or costs).
Also it's not just about the grading of the steel, how they are put together matters too.
I keep going back to looking at the Salsa El Mariachi. Some decent deals there, if you shop around (to a bearded ss-meister's shop for one)
and are stickered up that way
Well, the Solaris doesn't have a Reynolds sticker.
The salsa looks nice - I would rather have a 120mm fork up front TBH ..
Where do you ride? I demo'd an MCR 9 with 100mm, it's all I would have needed for XC and 'normal' trails, the big wheel adds a bit too btw. I'm actually running rigid at the mo and getting by OK, but there are no rocks around here.
It will mainly be around the South Downs and Brighton/ Sussex area
OK, whatever you ride on your 26ers, knock off 20-30mm for equivalent feel on a 29er I think.
It will mainly be around the South Downs and Brighton/ Sussex area
In that case fully rigid is all you need - test ride a Jones, one of the most sorted 29ers out there - very nimble in the twisty single track - the fat front wheel weighs in at about 3kg - yet I have no problem keeping up with HT or fully 26ers - there are test bikes available in Sussex - Eastbourne I think - contact Biff, or Charlythebikemonger.
As FRC said, unless you're freeriding off Beachy Head, you probably don't need sus forks at all.
I didn't actually say I was only riding around there ....
Well if you feel you need skill compensators - 😉
Well if you feel you need skill compensators - 😉
Or want to keep up with me on my 140mm 26" HT on the gnarlier trails... 😉 The Jones and its rider are quick on the twisties though!