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Tubeless - Help!

70 posts & 33 voices | Started 3 years ago by gingerflash | Latest reply from gingerflash

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Feck bastid thing why doesn't it work godamnit

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gingerflash - Member

Right, so I've given in and ordered a Stans kit from JRA.

I'm fitting new Conti Mountain Kings to 717s.

I've done exactly what the instructions say but with the yellow rim tape (2 layers) and my normal nylon rim tape, and the rubber strip, the tyre is still nowhere near sealing. The air's just coming out all the way round. I'm using a track pump, lots of soapy water.

Tried a CO2 cartridge but that didn't work. I tried pumping with the valve core removed, that didn't help.

What am I doing wrong? What can I do to get the thing to seal?

Thanks
GF.

Posted 3 years ago #
Vortexracing - Member

Take the centre of the valve out and see if you can borrow a compressor or pop to the petrol station. That should do it

Posted 3 years ago #
stuartie_c - Member

Too much rim tape?

I did a 717 rim with Stan's kit and only used one layer of yellow rim tape then the Stan's rim strip. There was a bit of faffing to get the rim strip properly seated under the bead hook, but after that was done it all went without a hitch using a track pump, Stan's sealant and a Bonty Jones tyre.

Could it be that all the rim tape is not allowing the rim strip to sit under the bead hook?

Posted 3 years ago #
boxelder - Member

Go to the garage and use the compressor. Sounds like a sloppy fitting tyre mind. I stick some goo in there - can get a little messy, but works.
Once it's sealed once, seems a lot easier next time.

Posted 3 years ago #
mboy - Member

Use a velox cloth rim tape (or 2 of them) instead? Seem to remember they reccomend using cloth rim tapes.

Posted 3 years ago #
boxelder - Member

Bonty tyres are about the easiest I've used.

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

Is that likely to make all the difference? Surely a petrol station compressor will be a schraeder valve won't it?

Posted 3 years ago #
andywhit - Member

Bung a tube in there inflate to 50psi and leave overnight to allow the tyre to take on the shape of the rim. Then tomorrow remove tube and have another go.

Posted 3 years ago #
Vortexracing - Member

yip, but I use one of those brass adapters

Posted 3 years ago #
molgrips - Member

The yellow tape must have no wrinkles in it. If your rim has a deep well in the middle, then cut the strip narrower so it sits in the bottom of the well - no tape must have any kind of wrinkle or bubble in it.

You don't need your original rim tape in there, that's probably not helping at all.

Be careful with the CO2 that the gas isn't all pissing straight out of the tyre - make sure the tyre is covering the valve hole...

Do you get it to inflate? On some tyres it takes a long time to seal the sidewalls.. so inflate, swill sealant about, inflate again, swill till you hear no hissing.. then come back in 10 mins and re-inflate. Ride up and down the road a lot, check pressures, then go on a PROPER ride - if you leave it overnight it'll probably go down - if you have leaky tyres like I had with my Kenda Nevegals. Took a couple of rides to properly settle down.

Posted 3 years ago #
Russell96 - Member

Have you made sure to pinch the tyre bead so it's in the middle of the rim as much as possible, before inflating? I've also had more success pumping up tyres with no water/soapy mix on them and doing them dry, putting in the sealant later on.

Posted 3 years ago #
singlespeedstu - Member

I'm using a track pump, lots of soapy water.

Think more along the lines of watery soap than soapy water.

You need to get enough bubbles in between the bead and the rim to make a kind of makeshift seal to get it to blow out.

Bubbles, bubbles and more bubbles.

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

Stuat - with yellow tape and the rimstrip, the tyre was just about falling off. With yellow tape, now 2 nylon rimstrips and the rubber strip, it's a better fit but still not close to sealing. It's still quite easy to get the rimstrip under the bead hook apart form round the valve.

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

At the moment, as per the Stans instructions, I'm trying to inflate it without sealant, just soapy water.

No, it's not inflating even for a second.

without my normal rim tape I can practically get my finger between the bead and rim. Miles too slack.

Posted 3 years ago #
gregc - Member

Don't use Conti's ,they're very difficult to get sealed . Use Maxxis tyres instead .

Posted 3 years ago #
stuartie_c - Member

Hmmmm.

I found that the rim strip only just fitted under the bead hook with just one layer of yellow tape and that was after a lot of massaging to iron out the bulges.

It's working a treat now, though.

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

I am not using different tyres just for the sake of tubeless.

Posted 3 years ago #
Autoelec - Member

Gingerflash, I run the same set up and had a real game getting them to seal. However I mangaged it in the end!! By using an "emergency" tyre inflator. Although they arn't high pressure I found it provided a constant supply of air for me to manipulate the tyre to rim. I found keeping the tyre on the floor and "patting" it helped!!! Thats after I launched it across the garage a couple of times!!!

Posted 3 years ago #
solamanda - Member

Get a valve and remove/cut off the centre bit, so you still have a 'valve' screwed in without the valve centre. This will allow you to screw a schraeder adapter and get tons of pressure in with a compressor or CO2.

Posted 3 years ago #
nickc - Member

You're not doing anything wrong, it a pants system....

(says the grumpy ex-stans user)

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

What's an emergency tyre inflator? I've got an electric compressor for the car, only a 12v low pressure thing, might that work? I'm going to have to get a presta/schaeder adaptor from somewhere though aren't I?

This is looking like a lot more trouble than it's worth. I have already spent about 3 hours swearing and shouting at it but that hasn't worked either.

Posted 3 years ago #
Pauly - Member

What did you do wrong? Not using Mavic UST rims matey.

Posted 3 years ago #
andywhit - Member

As above, put a tube in and inflate well. Put it aside for the night and try tomorrow before you have a breakdown

Posted 3 years ago #
auricgoldfinger - Member

Never got that combination to seal. Sidewalls on the black chilli MK's I used seemed pretty porous too which didn't help
Inflated Bonty tyres first time. Keep trying more soap and use a compressor not much else you can try...

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

The porous nature of the tyres is the least of the problem. The air is just pissing out between tyre bead and rim. There's about a quarter inch gap all the way round.

As for using Bontragers or Maxxis, I don't see the point of going tubeless if you're then restricted to certain tyres. I thought the point of the conversion was you could use any tyres you like. JRA's site says "Most Continental tyres work well".

Posted 3 years ago #
sslowpace - Member

Fitted stans to a 717 rim sunday. As prev mentioned, you want the sealing strip to be consistantly fitted all around the rim, evenly between the sidewalls and even tension around the rim. This took the most time for me,getting it nice and even, especially around the valve which was a sod to get under the rim to give a good, even, bead hook. I also found hanging the wheel with the valve at the top easier for inflating, rather than being on the floor.

I only had to use 2 layers of the yellow tape pulled very tight under the rim strip.

HTH
Pete

Posted 3 years ago #
PaulMc - Member

I use Conti tyres (kevlar verti pros) but on Mavic UST rims. At the first attempt I simply could not get them to seal even with plenty of soapy water. I used the 'inflate hard with an inner tube' method to get them into shape (don't think I had to leave them overnight) and they were straightforward after that. Just needed some vigorous action with a track pump to get a seal. Don't know how this relates to the Stans kit though.

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

Besides using a compressor or a different brand of tyres, I've tried everything above. I've had the tyre hung rather than on the floor. I've tried yellow tape on its own, with normal rim tape on top and with two layers of rim tape on top. The rimstrip is even and tight under the bead hook. the tyre bead is in the centre of the rim.

I'll try with more concentrated soap.

I am grateful for the help, just extremely frustrated.

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

While I've been on here, I've put a tube in and blown up to 50psi. Guess what - **** rim split open along the seam!!!

Time for a beer I think.

Posted 3 years ago #
Autoelec - Member

Thats the thing Gingerflash, yep get a presta adapter. Sounds like your in the same place as I was (pissed off). Trust me, you'll get there. I do agree with others comments about the tyres being porous. Just spend some time getting them sealed once they're inflated.

Posted 3 years ago #
gingerflash - Member

I'm expecting them to be porous and need more sealant and more shaking, that's OK. I just want to get some **** air into the **** things.

Posted 3 years ago #
mboy - Member

singlespeedstu - Member

I'm using a track pump, lots of soapy water.

Think more along the lines of watery soap than soapy water.

You need to get enough bubbles in between the bead and the rim to make a kind of makeshift seal to get it to blow out.

Bubbles, bubbles and more bubbles. [:wink:]

Cue a chorus of "I'm forever blowing bubbles" from SingleSpeedStu

Posted 3 years ago #
singlespeedstu - Member

Bubbles.......

Posted 3 years ago #
ChristoGinger - Member

I think with tubeless you just have to admit you need a compressor - it's not even an issue once you get one - previously I was swearing and cursing and covered in latex and it was a right pain in the hole. compressor now and no issue's, makes changing tyres just as easy as with tubes.

aldi are selling them for about £60 or 80 bucks at the moment

Posted 3 years ago #
paulosoxo - Member

GF. I had exactly the same problem. Couldn't get my high rollers to inflate. Have you drilled the inner of the rim for the valve as per the stans video?

I could only inflate mine using a co2 cartridge.

I put loads of sealant in. Shook like mad, turned the wheel a bit, shook like mad, etc etc, till the bead was well covered in latex. Then inflated with a co2 can.

It was a nightmare!

Posted 3 years ago #

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