Right...planning my first build and want a super light hardtail. Very tempted to bolt everything to an On One Carbon Whippet or Carbon 456. Anyone here experienced good or bad stuff with these frames?
Also, if you ride either, what sizes are you and frame? I'm 6'2" and tempted by a more 'flickable' 18", but am tempted by a more comfortable 20".
Share.
Where to start.
456 - tick.
Sizing - 16" and 5'9".
Good: Loads of fun to ride (comparison is Kona Cindercone HT / Orange 5). Seems to be changing my riding for the better (I think). Still only on course to move from rubbish to wherever's next though. Light obviously. Nice big forks on a HT is fun. Enjoying that a lot. Doesn't seem to rattle me to death as much as my old Alu HT. That could be the better forks of course, but suspect it's more than that.
Bad: Short HT means a lot of spacers for me (or my back gets killed). 18" and above it gets longer, but not long. Carrying on a bike rack is a pain in the ass, which I never thought of when buying a carbon frame. Apparently not supposed to clamp them too tight. Obvious issue is what's 'too tight'. Mine hasn't broken though.
Tuppence worth ...
I'm the same height as you and ride an 18inch. I own both a steel and carbon models. cheap, light and ride well.
Thanks guys.
Mr Diggy - presumably you're referring to the 456?
Any happy/sad, short/tall Whippet owners out there?
C456 here, I'm 5'10 and on a medium. Could possibly have got away with a small but it'd be close.
Pros- it's cheap, it's light and it's strong. Decent geometry, big mud clearance, etc etc. Very good rear end feel- I gave up on my Mmmbop as the rear wheel just didn't want to track the ground, it bounced off everything. This has a bit of steel-like compliance without being bendy.
Cons- the finish is pretty poor, scratches very easily and some of it's actually come away when I've removed helicopter tape, that's not good. Feels a shade long, but weirdly doesn't climb all that well (standard 456 failings tbh) Geometry and general handling doesn't quite match my old Soul, but then, not much does. Still very good though.
All in all, not an amazing bike but a very good overall performer. Best HT I've had since my Soul, and it's pretty close between those two. I've just stuck a Works head angle reducer which does make it even longer but seems like it's generally an improvement.
No problems putting it my Thule rack btw.
The 455 and whippet are rather different in intended uses... What sort of riding do you do?
The 455 and whippet are rather different in intended uses... What sort of riding do you do?
Trail/singletrack riding mostly, with all the usual small jumps, obstacles, etc that come with that territory. Also a smattering of general XC. I'm very aware the Whippet is designed as an XC frame but was hoping it could still handle the twisty stuff and i don't needs loads of travel.
If you want super light that says Whippet.
I don't think 'twisty stuff' is particularly damaging to frames...
the biggest downside of the c456 for me (and this may well apply to all carbon frames) is the amount of transmitted noise.
After years of steel hardtails I can't believe how noisy it is sometimes. Riding down a descent with lots of stones it sounds like the frame is a tupperware box filled wiht marbles beign shaken as bits of stone hit it. Also, any creak or groan from components is amplified through the frame.
Other than that I love mine 
Did a mini review of my experiences here: http://brightonmtb.org/2011/06/16/on-one-456-carbon/
5ft 10 and ride a C456 18 inch. Only one ride old and not as quick climbing as my Scandal, but very stable descending. Rides nice, although early days so far.Not as whippy through the tight singletrack either, comparing to the Scandal.
Whippet is exactly same geo as Inbred, so not total pure xc race. A mate of mine got the £999 one on R2W & seems pretty good & he uses it if for trail centres & pennine xc.
If it were me i'd get either the frame only or the XT one, as some of the stuff on the £999 one is a bit low rent (un-suprisingly).
My wife has had a 16" Whippet since they first came out. She really likes it, she seems to ride it a fair bit faster than the Specialized Epic that it replaced. It has been used mainly for twisty singletrack riding and races. I don't think she has ever not been on the podium when racing it - although that may say more about women's xc racing than the frame... It has also done a few day trips at Afan, and has stood up to that sort of use very well, there are a few stone chips in the top paint, but the carbon underneath seems very tough. For the money I don't think you can go too far wrong with either frame.
If you want super light that says Whippet.
What njee said. My C456 (16" painted) was no lighter than my Scandal (18" anodized, 2nd generation)...in fact if you want the figures, on the same scales the Scandal frame was 1540g, the c456 1599g (with bolts and swapouts).
However, I went for the c456 over the Whippet or keeping the Scandal as I wanted the flexibility...31.6mm seattube for dropper seatposts (27.2mm for Scandal), swapouts, standard BB (BB92 on Whippet), any length forks I like pretty much (Scandal 130mm max, Whippet 120mm max).
5'9" on a c456 16" btw...only built it up this week and it's been ridden once.
Waiting for the Lurcher to appear here, but I've been waiting some time 
I'm 6'2", don't have the carbon but Ti - I went for the 20" - sizing seems just right - but then I've long arms/legs too
I was considering the Carbon 456 before I got my Soul, seems a good design approach. Would be like a lighter version of your P7 whilst a Whippet would be a different thing altogether. I'm amazed you're 6'2" though, I thought you were the same height as me! 
6'2" with a 20" Whippet, seems a good size, certainly plenty of standover, anything smaller may feel a little short? Enjoyed the ride, seemed smooth, just trying to get used to HT after 15 years of full suss....
The length doesnt change much between 16",18" and 20", so as long as your seatpost is long enough you'll be alright on either the 18" or 20" probably. Brant always said he'd prefer a 16" but can't get a seatpost long enough, hence the three sizies being similar lengths.
On the assumption that you are actually planning to ride/race this bike then I'd go 20". A 'chuckable' bike can be great for short rides, but being hunched up for hours on end will not be comfy.
FWIW in a superlight bike the kit matters more than the frame, which is about the 3rd heaviest part anyway!
Great frames though, I'd buy a Whippet if I was after a winter bike no doubt.
. Riding down a descent with lots of stones it sounds like the frame is a tupperware box filled wiht marbles beign shaken as bits of stone hit it.
Mine sounds more like a filing cabinet full of spanners being pushed down a flight of stairs.
But it's wonderful to ride so I forgive it.
Weighed it last week, an ounce under 26lbs.
Built with RS Rev Team maxle light, Pro 2/Crest wheels (tubed), SLX/XT gearing and carbon post/bars.
FWIW in a superlight bike the kit matters more than the frame, which is about the 3rd heaviest part anyway!
This may be true, but the frame is a much cheaper way to save weight when you consider the price of XTR!
I have the whippet but not ridden it much in anger yet - I'm 6' and a bit inbetween sizes for on-ones, have the 18 frame but could have equally well gone for the 20 I think. 18' with a short stem felt a bit cramped.
I got the x9 one they were offering a while back - not what I'd call superlight out of the box, but the wheelset is nothing special. I'm not what you'd call superlight myself, so the solidity of it is actually reassuring. If you're a streak of pish racer it might not be what the doctor ordered.
Thanks all, very helpful. Looks like it'll likely be a 20" Whippet once the next shipment of frames rolls in...
This may be true, but the frame is a much cheaper way to save weight when you consider the price of XTR!
Huh? I wasn't talking about XTR. Was meaning fork and wheels! £500 on a new frame. I'll bet I can save more weight for £500 than replacing the frame. No reason not to change it - will be a totally new bike, but even starting from a BSO you'll only save 2-3lbs. Just saying like...
I was considering chopping my Cotic Soul in for one of these lovelies. I haven't ridden one though and with the Cotic being soooo good, I'm thinking it may be a bit of a disapointment!?
Don't want to compromise snappy singletrack handling to save a pound or two.
Any thoughts?
18" whippet rider here, i hunch over mine at 5" 11, and have found it to be very good, its comfortable, although i started off with the on one reccomendation of a 70mm stem, this was way too short and have now fitted a 100mm version which is lots better.
Running it 1x9 and all in with my stans wheels its a shade over 20 pounds, the only real negative is the laquer comes off very easily.
Overall really happy with it, and will be giving it hell through the winter.
was considering chopping my Cotic Soul in for one of these lovelies. I haven't ridden one though and with the Cotic being soooo good, I'm thinking it may be a bit of a disapointment!?Don't want to compromise snappy singletrack handling to save a pound or two.
Any thoughts?
Really?
how come, i thought the Soul is a amazing Hardtail frame?
Given the 456c is just carbon(not that lighter tbh) and is more at home with 150mm forks is it really worth getting it over quote" one of the best hardtail frames around" bike radar"
be interested to hear peoples thoughts on Cotic Soul over 456c
I came to my C456 via a Scandal, a Soul, an Mmmbop and a BFe. Soul and C456 are a little different in how they do their business but at the end of the day, quite similiar bikes as they come out of the box.
C456 can handle more fork, is lighter, but isn't as good a climber as you'd expect even with a short-ish fork. Not as snappy as a Soul, though still agile, it feels longer than it is (which is good and bad, sometimes). Overall "feel" is very similiar though the handling is a little different. (it'd fool people into thinking it was steel, I'm sure, just like a steel 456 could fool people into thinking it was alu)
Very much a fan of both. I'm happier with the C456, since I slapped a head angle reducer headset into it- I always wanted a bit more descent-bias than the Soul's perfect allrounder. At my skill level, I can hustle that a bit harder than I could my Soul. I don't consider the long fork much of an advantage, mine is hardly ever u-turned past 140mm anyway.
Just depends what you want really, I don't think I can split them.
6ft1.9 on a 16inch. Its long enough
6ft1.9 on a 16inch. Its long enough
6ft1.9 with a 16incher. Its all about range
FTFM
5 foot 10 with an 18 incher. Sometimes I think it's just a little bit too big
But on the other hand its intimidating length and girth does help compensate for my tiny knob.
6ft on a medium 18" C456, good for the money goes downhill well and climbs ok, ideal for me for the coming winter so
Hopefully will make me get out more rather than the full suss
6'4" and a 20" 456 - a lovely ride
UUUUUUUUG-LY!
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