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slam the door on white Christian immigration.
Oh noes - moar brown people! Whatever will we do.
Well Farage had better come up with something. Already EU immigration is down to about 25% of its pre referendum level but overall immigration has remained about the same - i.e. non EU immigration is up massively.
Well Farage had better come up with something. Already EU immigration is down to about 25% of its pre referendum level but overall immigration has remained about the same – i.e. non EU immigration is up massively.
The majority of which are students. Besides who cares besides racists?
The fence sitting is going well, isn't it?
https://twitter.com/derekjames150/status/1128067152060268544
Seeing if they can get down to single figures with the Tories
EU27 will argue that we came back
Hard to come back to somewhere you haven't left, non?
Seeing if they can get down to single figures with the Tories
The poll in The Observer this morning had labour at 29% so where have the figures in that tweet come from?
The 29% is GE polling, not European Election polling (which are the figures in the tweet with a downwards trajectory).
A General Election isn't happening right now… so polling for that is very much about long term voting inclinations… where as a lot of otherwise Labour supporting voters have a chance, this week, of giving the party they "naturally" support a message. From social media it looks like A LOT of Labour MPs are getting that message…
The 29% is GE polling, not European Election polling
Funny isn't it how everyone's suddenly so enthusiastic about euro parliament elections 😉
Well Corbyn’s half rice/half chips approach has clearly made both rice and chips fans that maybe they’ll go for the salad instead.
He’s without doubt the most inept, clueless political ‘leader’ I’ve ever seen. And I include Iain Duncan Smith in that
Funny isn’t it how everyone’s suddenly so enthusiastic about euro parliament elections
I’m not surprised you couldn’t be arsed to check what the percentages represented. Isn’t the EU virtually indistinguishable from a dictatorship? In which case, you may not have realised there was even an election happening.
He’s without doubt the most inept, clueless political ‘leader’ I’ve ever seen. And I include Iain Duncan Smith in that
Actually Corbyn is caught between a rock and a hard place. He is not clueless as everyone thinks because he knows he will be blamed regardless so why bother? Might as well let the rest do the talking for him so he does not get the blame which is a wise move if he intends to keep his seat. Those that shout the loudest will know their fate in the next GE.
All hail the killfile. 🙌
The polls can say what they like. And they don't say 29% Daz, they say 20% and that's the most optimistic for labour
Me and Mrs Binners are both lifelong labour voters and have just done our postal votes to vote Green
My parents were over this afternoon. Both are lifelong labour voters and have just done their postal votes to vote Lib Dem. They're both in their 70's, politically clued up, Lifelong Guardian reading lefties and have absolutely had it with Magic Brexiteer Grandad. This is the first time in their lives they've not voted labour
My neighbours are lifelong labour voters and have just done their postal votes to vote for the Greens. He's recently retired, a son of a Manchester Labour councillor and steeped in the Labour party. Brought up with it. They've both just done postal votes for the Green Party. This is the first time in their lives they've not voted labour
One of my best mates is labour through and through. Until now. She worked under Blair at the home office and is a lifelong labour party member. She recently cancelled her membership. She just did her postal vote for the lib dems. This is the first time in her life she's not voted labour
Can you see a pattern emerging here?
Labour won't get a sniff of 20% of the vote, never mind 29%. The people, like me, who they could always have relied on to put their cross in the labour box - their core support - are deserting the party in droves
And with bloody good reason.
When Magic Grandad 3-line whips his MPs to abstain on Mays fourth attempt at getting her deal through, he'll have sold us all down the river
So * him! And * the pathetic far-right enabling labour party he's created!
And with bloody good reason.
Nope - with paranoid delusions based on right wing press lies. Its sad you cannot see how yo have been manipulated by the tory press to vote against your own best interests
Too True TJ. The mainstream media is the enemy of the people! Fake news about the properly elected leader must end!
That’s the problem with us capitalist lackies and slaves to the military industrial complex. We can’t even see the shackles of our own oppression
Oh how the right wing media keep making me seek out the speeches and interviews of our glorious leader to read the actual words he uses. If only they would work even harder to keep me away from his words and force me to only read the spun interpretations of his words delivered to me by the more sympathetic journalists (yes I'm looking at you, the once widely respected Paul Mason).
We have another Binners prediction...
When Magic Grandad 3-line whips his MPs to abstain on Mays fourth attempt at getting her deal through, he’ll have sold us all down the river
We will see
Predications are crazy when it comes to this.
I think we'll still be in the EU come May next year, and be on our third Tory PM within 12 months.
The one thing I have no idea about, is how, when the mess of Brexit is rejected by even more of the public, the anti-Brexit Labour MPs, members and voters get the Labour leader to change, or to change who that is, before we Leave. I can't see any change happening in time there.
We have another Binners prediction…
I am wondering if he is Jacob Rees-Moggs dad considering his liking for predictions and how shit he is at them.
Morning comrade!
So, on Thursday i’ll Be voting for the strongest Remain party in my region: it’s gonna be Lib Dem for me. Labour has lost my vote and the Greens never do well in what is traditionally a Conservative safe seat.
It really is a one issue election.
Me and Mrs Binners are both lifelong labour voters and have just done our postal votes to vote Green
As someone who has voted green in every election since 2003 apart from general elections I'm extremely encouraged by this. It's a shame though that many who will be voting for them are doing so purely on the basis of brexit, when they have many other excellent policies, not least about the most important crisis we should be worrying about, instead of the sideshow of brexit.
You do realise though don't you that the green party are way to the left of Corbyn?
It really is a one issue election.
It's a very weird election, that's for sure, as a poll lead and predicted victory for a party which didn't exist a month ago is somehow being interpreted as a massive shift towards remain. Whilst everyone obsesses about Jeremy Corbyn, Nigel Farage gets a free run.
You do realise though don’t you that the green party are way to the left of Corbyn?
I don't think you get it, it isn't Corbyn's leftism that is the problem, it is his incompetence and ineffectuality when tested.
It really is a one issue election.
Yep as will every election for the next decade- which is why fence sitting is so pointless.
I'd love to vote green, but their stance on GM leaves me with big reservations about their wisdom.
Lib Dems it is.
Sadly farage will do well , even tho not having a plan for Brexit is now something he's proud of !
MSP beat me to it, but thats exactly how I feel. I also think that there's a very nasty undercurrent to the whole cult-like atmosphere within his evangelists, who will not tolerate any dissent or criticism. I suspect that if Corbyn and his acolytes got anywhere near power they would get very, very authoritarian, very, very quickly
I predict months of frigging about by our political leaders whilst we get more and more frustrated and people who would otherwise be broadly agreeing with each other fall into increasingly acrimonious endlessly revolving arguments
So which is it. Is Corbyn the master manipulator who has the entire party under hard left control or is in ineffectual and hopeless?
Or have you just swallowed propaganda about him?
There is not a single "hard left" policy proposed - just normal social democratic policies. YOu guys are doing what the right wing press want you to do here - cutting off your noses to spite your face.
Kelvin so what speeches and statements do you object to?
The ones where he refers to the EU, and our continued membership of it.
there’s a very nasty undercurrent to the whole cult-like atmosphere within his evangelists
Said without a hint of irony 🙂
😉
Didn't I read this morning that he has said he will not end freedom of movement. Will try and find a source for that.
Edit: Torygraph. YMMV: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/05/19/jeremy-corbyn-says-labour-could-keep-freedom-movement-brexit/
Well, ChangeUKwhatever seem to be impolding. Vote Green or LibDem this week.
[edit: other options are of course available for those outside England.]
On a side note… why such stern defence in this thread of Corbyn's handling of this issue by people who vote Green not Labour anyway?
Didn’t I read this morning that he has said he will not end freedom of movement.
I can't see it. He's been just as adamant as May that FoM will be ending. Its a manifesto commitment on the Labour Party website
Always go back to the source…
"It would be open for negotiation the level of movement of people between Europe and this country if we're a non-member of the EU."
I think that's lose enough to support literally any immigration policy you can dream up. He only has to say that he would support FoM carrying on, much it does for other non-EU European countries, and the whole "close relationship" compromise can become real… being involved in the Single Market in some new way could then be on the cards… that could be a genuine offering that could win over many people who want us to Leave the political union but not turn our backs on our European partners… and that isn't something unique to 2016 Leave voters…
Put that to the people in a fresh vote… rather then the current unicorns of both the Brexit and Labour parties. I'd still vote for EU Membership, but I'm pretty sure I'd be on the losing side.
why such stern defence in this thread of Corbyn’s handling of this issue by people who vote Green not Labour anyway?
You confuse 'defence' with 'understanding'. You lot are just as tribal and blinkered as the supposed 'cultist acolytes' which binners talks about. Being pro-remain doesn't automatically mean you should hate Corbyn. He's trying, probably with little hope of success, to hold his desperately split party together as he knows it's his only hope of winning a general election. When remainers should be directing their ire at Farage and the tory nutters, instead they are obsessed with Corbyn, which only results in splitting the labour party further, and doing the job of the tories and Farage for them. As I've said, stop worrying about labour and look at the real problem in the polls, which is Farage and his Trump-supporting mates beginning to build a support base which could propel them to power.
So "Tribal", in my case, that I changed my vote to Labour at the last General Election, because of Corbyn's talk of member led policy. If he can't, now, persuade you to vote Labour, or me, how well is he doing?
The ones where he refers to the EU, and our continued membership of it.
Cite please?
Pick any. Or go back through this thread. There is even one talked about on this very page, if you're feeling lazy.
because of Corbyn’s talk of member led policy.
You do realise don't you that labour's policy was formulated as a result of a democratic process involving and ratified by the membership? You may disagree with it, but don't pretend that the membership had no say. There'll be another opportunity at this year's conference to change it.
Being pro-remain doesn’t automatically mean you should hate Corbyn.
It's not about hating Corbyn. The point is that since the last election the Tory party, particularly the headbangers, have been constantly throwing around the statistic that '80% of voters voted for a party that was committed to taking the UK out the EU"
So a lot of us are now voluntarily removing ourselves from that group by voting for parties that don't get us included in that statistic. That doesn't include the labour party
don’t pretend that the membership had no say
Back to the bullshit composite motion, that was the very moment that the whole ideal of Corbyn's "empowerment of the members" dream was shown to be utter fantasy.
80% of voters voted for a party that was committed to taking the UK out the EU
Not just thrown around by Tories… also key Labour movers and shakers.
Labours policy fooled the membership with a cheap magicians trick, the non-policy on brexit to counteract the parties wishes to support a 2nd refrendum has failed, and still he is sitting on the fence, entrenched in his position of appeasing a minority of racists, rather than worrying about losing the majority of labour voters.
look at the real problem in the polls, which is Farage and his Trump-supporting mates beginning to build a support base which could propel them to power.
'Linda from Doncaster' on 5live just now says she's a labour/green voter who supports remain but she's going to vote for the Brexit party because she thinks the result of the first vote should be upheld. She said she was 'conflicted'. Farage must be laughing his **** off.
And still you vocally support those who think we must* Leave** (while voting for a party that says we shouldn't). So much cognitive dissonance at work.
[*Adding to the narrative that to take any other path, or to ask the public, is contrary to democratic processes.]
[**Leave the EU, Leave the customs union, Leave the Single Market.]
A random twitterer puts it better than I ever could TJ & Daz…
https://twitter.com/damocrat/status/1130417871476146176?s=21
And still you vocally support those who think we must* Leave**
If you're referring to the post about Linda, where did I say I supported her? It was to illustrate that there are people out there who will prioritise 'democracy' over their views on brexit. Linda is clearly an idiot, but she's the sort of idiot who wil propel Farage to power.
I was referring to your fervent "understanding" of Corbyn's position of honouring the referendum and leaving the EU, despite you not voting for his party while he has been its leader.
And Linda isn't an idiot… this country has loads of people of all political persuasions telling her that we must "honour the referendum result"… yet all interpreting that result to best suit their political aims.
A random twitterer puts it better than I ever could TJ & Daz…
The war analogy is a good one. Labour party policy is designed to avoid a war altogether and instead reach a negotiated peace, and if that isn't possible, change the negotiating team, and if that fails, ask the soldiers if they want to kill each other or call the whole thing off.
How's that working out? Will you be voting Labour this week?
Labour policy is pro war, but to oppose a damaging tory war, and instead have a labour lead war that is good for both those who want war and those who oppose it.
Which anyone with an ounce of common sense can see is ****ing mental.
For me when i think of Corbyn and Labour it is the old, i am not angry and just disappointed...
Been a lifelong Labour supporter, but the one time you really wanted them to step up to the plate and be real opposition to the Tories, the response seems to have been a resounding "...Meh.." a lot more of a half-arsed whimper than any real opposition. If they have played this well, they should be gaining votes against the Tories with each day that passes, instead they are losing supporters. They should be calling out Tory BS every day and trying to set record straight and trying to illustrate the poison that comes with Farage.
The only good thing that may come out of all this is the fall of the two-party system, that parties like Lib-Dems and Greens come more and more into play and provide real opposition.
How’s that working out? Will you be voting Labour this week?
I'll be voting for the party which has been consistently saying for 20 years that instead of fighitng each other over petty irrelevances, we should be uniting to fight real enemy which threatens to kill us all.
UKIP?
That should be obvious, I've already said (3 times now on this thread) that I'll be voting green. I've voted green for nearly 20 years now so it's not a change based on brexit policy. In a general election though I'll be voting labour for obvious reasons.
Labour party policy is designed to avoid a war altogether and instead reach a negotiated peace, and if that isn’t possible, change the negotiating team, and if that fails, ask the soldiers if they want to kill each other or call the whole thing off.
But all this is happening after the enemy's nuclear bomb already bounced twice, and will come back down again in a few months. It's infuriating the way they say "it's fine, we're sticking to our policy" as if nothing has happened since last September.
It’s infuriating the way they say “it’s fine, we’re sticking to our policy” as if nothing has happened since last September.
The main thing that's changed is that the govt have failed to get their deal through parliament. Given that Labour policy is to negotiate their own deal with the EU, why would they change that because the tories have failed? It's a bit daft to change your policy when you're a step closer to achieving it.
Can’t find a milkshake icon - maybe this will do
🍼
😆 Milkshake a Fascist today!
Given that Labour policy is to negotiate their own deal with the EU
Which is pretty daft when they aren't in power and their voters are 2:1 to oppose Brexit. Most Labour voters don't want a deal, they want remain. And that's why those with any sense will stop voting Labour while there's any hope of staying in the EU.
I think that Labour is going the same way as the French PS. Remember François Hollande? It's not so long ago he was in power. Now have a look at how the PS are doing in polling, 4-6%. If you piss them off enough even your most faithful electors will desert you.
Lactose the Intolerant.
(nicked off of Twitter)
I’ve voted green for nearly 20 years now so it’s not a change based on brexit policy. In a general election though I’ll be voting labour for obvious reasons.
I used to but I am now voting Green in GE too. Their policies are close to Labour and some are better and more radical. Plus their representatives are much more open and honest and less playing politics (I realise that is easier when you don't have loads of MPs)
ROFLOCOPTER at the laughing on the Farage+milkshake interface vid 😀
Brilliant, isn't it? 😀
All while a woman shouts 'FASCIST!' at him
I bet that ones doing the rounds and causing much hilarity in Brussels
So...talk to me about the brexit party.
From what I can tell its an illegally funded private organisation with no policies or manifesto.
At the moment it seems the EU would be happy for us to call this whole car crash off but I fear if we elect and a bunch of gammon MEPs whos soul intend is going to be to poison the EU I can see brussels trying trying to get us out ASAP. there is no way they'll want them hanging around causing trouble.
The problem is that our electoral system is so slow and unwieldy that Farage and Arron Banks and their oily ilk have realised they can just get away with telling blatant lies and use dodgy oversees funding to influence the outcome of elections.
Then 2 years later there will be a report saying that they were telling blatant lies and using dodgy oversees funding to influence the outcome of elections, but by then the damage is well and truly done, and irreversible.
Seems to me that they're pulling all the same (illegal, morally vacuous) stunts as they got up to during the referendum campaign. Gordon Brown has been out this morning calling for their dodgy funding to be looked into. I'm sure we'll get to hear all about it in 2021 when the report is published
Strafed by a well co-ordinated flock of seagulls.
I love his response too- "I spotted that a mile away". And then did the same thing to stand up for himself, as he did in the EU parliament to stand up for britain, **** all. Then blamed someone else
Brexit party to be investigated
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/electoral-commission-brexit-party-donations-funding-review-headquarters-a8922086.html
Brexit party to be investigated
Oh that's interesting 😀
Let's be honest, farrage will be used to getting covered in sticky translucent white liquid from his meetings with arron banks.
On a more serious note, I find it quite heart warming that the extremists are so worried now that the milkshake ritual is so perevelent that there's a high chance they'll get a spaffing whenever they are out and about.
We'll done to all the spaffers out there.
I walked passed as he got off the bus beside Northumberland St. If the news suggests there were any more than 20 people there to meet and support him they're lying. Admittedly the 20 or so over 55's there were very loud, it still didn't drown out the shout of 'you fascist ****' shouted by some students who were walking past at the same time 🙂
We’ll done to all the spaffers out there.
Must be the new norm that ALL politicians must face soon ... 🤣
They should ALL carry umbrellas in future if they go walk about.
Ridiculing Farage without throwing things would be preferable… am I the only one to think this? The milkshake thing makes no useful political point, and will only strengthen the support of followers who (mistakenly) think they are backing the plucky underdog with the common touch.
The milkshake thing makes no useful political point
Perhaps, but it is absolutely ****ing hilarious.
*tweet-theft*
MY prediction is that there will be violence on the streets. Maybe clashing protesters, maybe a protest that turns unexpectedly I don't know but there will be violence. Which side to instigate it? Again no idea.