Viewing 40 posts - 121 through 160 (of 197 total)
  • Driving at "Driving Test" standard.
  • michaelmcc
    Free Member

    No one I know drives the same way you were taught in the test.. most of my mates try to hit roundabouts at speed and hit the apex. Obv you would fail if you did this in a test.

    Ok so maybe I didn’t word this how i meant it, but I’m still trying to make a point that most people drive a lot differently in real life to the test. And no I don’t intend on driving like that. But anyway the amount of drivers that drive roundabouts at speed without indicating is ridiculous.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    I choose to drive a little outside of the test spec when it’s safe to but you say it’s unrealistic? Mmm. That I’m afraid is utter balls. And reflects badly on you, if you mean it seriously, that’s a terrible attitude.

    So do you turn your head 45 degrees when looking in mirrors then????????????????

    I’m afraid that is utter balls…..

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    Assuming he does somehow pass his test in that time, it seems quite unlikely he’ll survive long enough to do that. Most likely another young male driver dead on a narrow country road, still at least he recognises motorways are dangerous… …just a shame they are actually the safest roads in the country and he hasn’t woken up to the rest!

    Thats utter pants… 🙄

    I think people training for the test are probably the safest drivers out there… I believe this… after that most people seem to forget everything in the test and drive too fast, don’t bother indicating, change lanes like they own the road, etc.

    It’s a bit of a lottery whether you pass or not it seems, depending on the mood of the driver and how many people have passed that week etc. I’ll back this up with the poster who said his mate passed on about the 8th attempt and is still terrible at driving.

    Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middling Edition

    Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middlin...
    Latest Singletrack Videos
    SurroundedByZulus
    Free Member

    You wont have failed because you didnt turn your head to 45 degrees to look in a mirror. You’ll have failed because you didnt look. Driving examiners are trained to look for eye movement when assessing mirror use. What you need to remember is that driving examiners dont just test learners on their car test, they also assess experienced drivers for many various things.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    So tell us, what did you actually fail for? Totting up of minors? One consistent driving error judged as severe?

    I’ve already said the main thing I clocked up errors for was observation, even though i always look when changing lanes, moving off etc, the examiner might not have seen me look.

    Also got a few errors for road positioning when stopping, turning right, turning left.. even though i made sure i followed the curb when turning left and drove very carefully. I did cross the white stop line once by about half a foot or so, so probably got marked down for that. There was a few right turns where i didn’t see which turn it was until late so didn’t get the best line around… didn’t think he’d mark me down for it though.

    Btw over here in Ireland we’re only allowed nine grade 2 errors, not 16. Also it seems by other posters that the test has got a lot harder over the years..

    pennine
    Free Member

    Passed 1st time in Bradford 1965 & bought a A35 van £60. Nearest motorway was the Preston by-pass & the M1 had only reached Northamptonshire. There was no speed limit on motorways and the bangers I drove back then wouldn’t have been safe at 50 never mind anything higher!

    In the Mods & Rocker era I had a Cortina Mark 1 where we travelled to Brighton, Clacton, Gt Yarmouth & Scarboro & tuned into pirate radio. Ah! the distant memories.

    Driving test was about 25 minutes + 3 highway code questions. I’d say the test is a lot harder these days. Interestingly, we were taught only to signal on roundabouts when exiting.

    Rightly or wrongly, I’ve always thought examiners passed those who they felt ‘safe’ being a passenger with. They produced the failed tick list so they didn’t have an argument with the learner driver

    Northwind
    Full Member

    michaelmcc – Member

    So do you turn your head 45 degrees when looking in mirrors then????????????????

    Excuse me but wtf are you talking about now?

    Think about it this way- you say you’re a really good driver but test-standard driving is in some way wrong. Now even if you’re right why is it that with the adequate driving ability you think you have, you can’t drive to the test standard which you think you understand well enough to judge?

    Observation doesn’t just mean “looking while changing lanes and moving off”- though that might just be your turn of phrase.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    Northwind – Member
    michaelmcc – Member
    So do you turn your head 45 degrees when looking in mirrors then????????????????

    Excuse me but wtf are you talking about now?

    Think about it this way- you say you’re a really good driver but test-standard driving is in some way wrong. Now even if you’re right why is it that with the adequate driving ability you think you have, you can’t drive to the test standard which you think you understand well enough to judge?

    Observation doesn’t just mean “looking while changing lanes and moving off”- though that might just be your turn of phrase.

    Because it seems you need to turn your head a lot and show the examiner that you’re looking.. not just moving your eyes. To me it’s a lottery whether you pass the test or not, It seems to be very much based on the person you get on the day, and traffic etc.

    And why are so many people on here hiding behind fake names as a cover up to their silly talk.. i probably know a lot of people on here.

    Nonsense
    Free Member

    Eric 64 I don’t like jam. Do like a nice coffee though.

    I think a huge number of people mistakenly think they are great drivs as they have nothing to compare it to and any instruction they have relates purely to passing the test. Not only that, butdriving safely with any speed on the road is a completely different skill to being able to get a car round a track quickly. I say this as a class 1 police driver and someone who has done quite a few track days. I’m lucky that i get to thrash a job car around because it means I can pootle about in my own car without feeling like I’m missing out on any fun. I’ve also been unfortunate enough to turn up to a number of collisions where poor driving has cost people their lives. You should never overestimate how good your car control is or underestimate the stupidity of other road users.

    AnalogueAndy
    Free Member

    You should never overestimate how good your car control is

    Too true. I remember one of our instructors used to say the first skill you need is to be able to recognise your faults.

    I’ve said it before here lots of times, seems especially relevant for the OP: being a good driver starts with having the right attitude. No amount of ‘skill’ will save you if you have the wrong attitude.

    When you’ve passed the test, come and have a go at the advanced one 🙂

    http://www.iam.org.uk

    br
    Free Member

    Passed first time after 7 lessons in 1982, never went out of the 30 limits due lessons or test. Also didn’t do an emergency stop nor a hill start (Goole is rather flat) during my test.

    Passed my m/c test the same week, back then the instructor just stood at the side of the road and watched (well, since I was on an RD250 with expansions) he could also hear me 🙂

    poly
    Free Member

    Thats utter pants…

    Which bit? That you are much more likely to die on a country road than a motorway? Because I’m sorry, no matter how you “cut it” the evidence is quite clear that motorways are our safest roads, and high speed collision on country roads are the biggest killer of young men behind the wheel.

    Hopefully you won’t take out any innocent road users on the way.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    michaelmcc – Member

    Because it seems you need to turn your head a lot and show the examiner that you’re looking.. not just moving your eyes.

    Not really… In fact, not at all. In both my tests- bike and car- I just made my obs completely normally. You show the examiner that you’re looking by acting appropriately on what you see.

    Obviously I wasn’t there for yours but what I was getting at earlier is that there’s more ways to fail on obs, than just not doing any- you can be looking in your mirrors constantly and still fail if you’re not taking in the correct details, or acting well on what you see. Looking alone isn’t enough. Also you mentioned only changing lanes and moving off- surround obs are absolutely constant, again could just be your turn of phrase but those fundamental checks aren’t enough.

    GrahamS
    Full Member

    Because it seems you need to turn your head a lot and show the examiner that you’re looking.. not just moving your eyes.

    How can you check your blind spots properly if you only move your eyes?
    Are they on stalks?

    surround obs are absolutely constant

    Yep. I remember my instructor saying I should check my mirrors before I accelerate, brake, change gear, signal or fart. 🙂

    chewkw
    Free Member

    I will be signing up for some lessons soon.

    Any good instructor in the North East in the toon?

    🙂

    Woody
    Free Member

    I think people training for the test are probably the safest drivers out there… I believe this… after that most people seem to forget everything in the test and drive too fast, don’t bother indicating, change lanes like they own the road, etc.

    That’s really rather silly, isn’t it.

    You have virtually no experience and yet you feel qualified to make a statement like that 🙄 Learner drivers may be relatively safe but that is only because there is someone sitting next to them (hopefully) with experience and keeping them right.

    You mention that your road positioning was poor and make a point about being obvious with your observation. A decent examiner will know if you are aware of your surroundings and looking and seeing are two very different things. By saying that whether you pass or not is a lottery, or bad traffic, seems to me to be trying to shift the blame for your poor performance onto everyone but yourself, when you have actually admitted to very basic errors throughout your test.

    Sounds to me like you need a few more lessons.

    mc
    Free Member

    Did you look or glance at the mirrors?

    I’ve done three driving tests (B, B+E + C), and passed all first time.
    Main thing that helped me, was somebody who told me to remember that the examiner wants to go for a pleasant drive.

    C test is the most nervous I’d been for such a prolonged time I can ever remember.
    I was feeling quite confident to start with, as the bit I’d been the most worried about, the reverse manouver, I’d managed perfectly, but then in the process of doing the controlled stop, I crunched reverse going up the range change, and nerves kicked in big time.
    It was a 4 over 4 box, with a range change switch, so you basically rolled around the corner into the test straight in 2nd, block changed to 4th, flicked the switch to High, then back into 1st gate which was then 5th gear. Somehow I managed to push through the reverse gate and slightly crunched reverse, but got back into 5th and made 20mph just at the braking markings.
    I thought I’d failed before I even got out the test centre. It wasn’t helped by the examiner who laid his clip board in the centre of the cab just out of where I could see it, and would pick it up every few minutes and run his pen over it, making it look as though he was marking something down.

    I’d say I’m a reasonably good driver, but part of that is realising what my weaknesses are, which is mostly going a bit too fast, and currently enjoying the ability to get the back end of the car weaving along the temporary road surface along to the house 😆

    emanuel
    Free Member

    part of the problem is the infrastructure is simply not designed for todays’s volumes,or speeds.
    If it was up to me,only emergency services would have cars.doctors,vets.most freight would go by rail.But it’s not up to me.
    So every f….g time I go out on my road bike I have one near miss with some d….d who’s going too fast/overtakes where he can’t/ecc.
    having said that,most drivers are considerate,still don’t drive at driving test level though.shame really, they’d drive better.

    Edukator
    Free Member

    Before the police officers on here get too self-congratulatory I’d like to remind them that despite all the training the agverage Met police officer is more likely to kill you with his car than an average driver.

    Police driving standards are lousy

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    Which bit? That you are much more likely to die on a country road than a motorway? Because I’m sorry, no matter how you “cut it” the evidence is quite clear that motorways are our safest roads, and high speed collision on country roads are the biggest killer of young men behind the wheel.

    Hopefully you won’t take out any innocent road users on the way.

    It just seems to me that you and some other people are implying that I’m some boy racer behind the wheel, which I’m not at all. I just want to pass the test so I can drive to different bike venues I’ve never been to.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    I think people training for the test are probably the safest drivers out there… I believe this… after that most people seem to forget everything in the test and drive too fast, don’t bother indicating, change lanes like they own the road, etc.
    That’s really rather silly, isn’t it.
    You have virtually no experience and yet you feel qualified to make a statement like that Learner drivers may be relatively safe but that is only because there is someone sitting next to them (hopefully) with experience and keeping them right.

    How many people do you see nearly cut you off on the bike, rail around roundabouts with no signal, changing lanes nearly causing a crash, mostly drivers with no L plates.. unless theyre learners and just don’t bother using them. Ok so in a lot of cases their old people that might be past it and possibly not allowed drive on the roads, but thats a different debate.

    I’m much safer at driving than a lot of people out there..

    IanMunro
    Free Member

    😀

    Edukator
    Free Member

    I think people’s atitudes to you might in some way reflect you telling various posters they have their heads up their arses, are on high horses etc., mmc.

    I haven’t offered any direct advice so far but will now:

    Relax, take things in your stride, drive so that however incompetent and aggressive others may be they don’t put you in danger or force you to make brusque movements. Leave plenty of distance between you and other road users, react a soon as you identify a potential hazard so that if it becomes a real hazard it’s easy to stop/avoid. If the tester can sereenly watch the world go by as you smoothly chauffeur him/her around he/she won’t fail you.

    When someone raises a finger smile, when they blow their horn impatiently potter on unruffled. And do the same when posting on STW.

    jam-bo
    Full Member

    Classic teenager logic. I failed my test but it’s everyone else’s fault.

    My 17yr old brother in law crashed into the back of a lorry in the the snow a couple of winters ago because ‘it stopped to quick’.

    aracer
    Free Member

    I’m much safer at driving than a lot of people out there..

    Your driving is above average? Or is your “lot of people” your mates who straight line roundabouts?

    timber
    Full Member

    Failed the car test first time. Driving rather over confident, didn’t slow for a roundabout because I could see that the other ways onto it were empty, should have at least shown an intention of slowing rather than changing up. Remembered this and passed second time.

    Failed trailer test first time too. Just because I am used to driving country lanes and squeezing through a lot of tight gaps, now well practiced and without having to slow much, does not mean that the assessor is and he had a few eye closing moments. Took note, passed second time.

    Not stuff that was done because I thought I was a driving God, just got a bit familiar and blase.

    Also done a load of stuff through work for quads, 4×4, tractor and stuff, far more interesting and about finding the boundaries.

    As for the motorway comment, from where I grew up in West Cornwall, the nearest bit of motorway is Exeter, would make the test a half day affair. Would far rather people learnt to drive on country lanes, not down the middle, most are wide enough for 2 cars to pass and you should not be travelling so slow as to hold up a tractor.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    michaelmcc – Member

    I’m much safer at driving than a lot of people out there..

    That’s entirely possible. But don’t be too pleased, it’s only because there are a lot of people out there driving who are terrifying. You can be safer than them and still a liability 😉

    The idea is to make you a safe, qualified driver; not to make you better than the worst on the road.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    I’m much safer at driving than a lot of people out there..

    Your driving is above average? Or is your “lot of people” your mates who straight line roundabouts?

    I was talking about said people that cut me off when I’m on the bike, don’t bother signalling at roundabouts (it seems the norm where i live to not bother after you’ve passed your test), pass out at stupid places etc.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    Anyway I think this thread needs to be put to bed, I’m a bit fed up with it and don’t think it’s going anywhere now.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    When someone raises a finger smile, when they blow their horn impatiently potter on unruffled. And do the same when posting on STW.

    Not sure what you’re getting at there.. I get on really well with most fellow mountain bikers. The only ones not so much maybe are ones that came to the sport late and haven’t developed the biker mentality about things yet.

    aracer
    Free Member

    Anyway I think this thread needs to be put to bed, I’m a bit fed up with it

    Can’t imagine why that could be.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    michaelmcc – Member
    ones that came to the sport late and haven’t developed the biker mentality about things yet.

    Funny, I feel the same about drivers 😉

    Nonsense
    Free Member

    Edukator although your argument that police driving standards are lousy is as typically sophisticated and nuanced as most police bashing that goes on STW permit me raise a couple of issues with that report.

    Firstly – those statistics and that entire article are based on reports from the Daily Mail. Despite me being typical violent, fascist, stupid, racist, jobsworth police officer I distrust anything reported by the Mail or its stable mates.

    Secondly – those statistics are collisions ‘involving’ a police vehicle. Let me do some of the work the reporter hasn’t and give you a better understanding of the way in which such stats are compiled. Say for example I’m on a blue light run in a marked police vehicle and I approach a red traffic light. I treat the junction as a give way and slow to a standstill. A vehicle coming from my right reacts to the lights and sirens and slams on his brakes a little quicker than he needs to. A cyclist then slams in to the rear of his vehicle and hurts himself. That would be a collision involving a police car, although it wasn’t my fault as the police driver. Let me give you another example. Someone parks a police riot van in the yard of a police station and grazes another police vehicle as he’s reversing. Thats recorded as a collision involving two police vehicles! Shockingly bad driving from everyone involved and a totally unacceptable risk to public safety. Let me give you one more example. Say a police vehicle is in a pursuit with a stolen moped. The police vehicle keeps a safe distance in the hope the moped rider stops and gives up. The moped rider takes a wrong turn and ends up at a dead end. He crashes the ped and jumps over the side of a pedestrian bridge, not realising its actually 20 metres up. He dies. This would be treated as a fatal collision involving the police. Those statistics make no mention of who was to actually blame for any fatality or collision. The police invest huge amounts of time and effort in improving standards of driving and the investigation of any collision involving a police vehicle is very rigorous.

    I’m also not entirely sure that comparing the general public like for like to a group of people that have to drive at high speed, in pursuits or who come in to contact with intoxicated or criminal drivers is statistically sound. Are you suggesting that if the general public were given blues and twos and asked to drive at full tilt everywhere there would be no resulting increase in crashes? Personally I think only the Daily Mail or someone a little soft in the head would look at it in such a simplistic way.

    Edukator
    Free Member

    There are plenty of other sources of statistics on police accidents on the Net. The police have lots of accidents and are involved in more fatal accidents than average. It’s getting better but still not good. The Sweeny style is no longer acceptable and discouraged but officers still have lots of crashes.

    Any casual observer can see why, too many drive too fast on missions that simply aren’t life or death.

    IMO (and it is only an opinion remember) if the police wish to go around chasing people because they judge them dangerous they should be armed and on motorbikes or in helicopters. They’d stand a better chance of protecting the public without putting the public in danger.

    Chasing a stolen moped in a police car is exactly what the police should not be doing. Putting the pulic in danger for something as trivial as a moped when the police can’t even follow the thing down an alley way. Who’s soft in the head, me or a copper stupid enough to go racing through a residential area in a probably fruitless attempt to recover a moped. Let’s keep pursuits for mass murderers and armed robbery eh.

    IanMunro
    Free Member

    Edukator’s police force out catching offenders earlier 😀
    [video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtmwACycJGo[/video]

    Edukator
    Free Member

    Not quite what I had in mind Ian but demonstrably efficient.

    There might not be quite as much STW police bashing if police contributors were a little less sterotypically heavy handed, condescending and incapable of listening to the views of others without considering those views a bookable offence..

    GrahamS
    Full Member

    I think Nonsense makes a perfectly reasonably point Edukator.

    The accident stats for police vehicles will naturally tend to be higher due to the work they do and the way the stats are recorded.

    You can’t take those figures and correctly conclude that “Police driving standards are lousy”. It is classic false reporting. Something the Mail tends to specialise in.

    Edukator
    Free Member

    So the mere mention on the Daily Mail in an article renders it invalid. OK. Here’s the opening paragraph of a Nottingham Unversity study:

    “Police pursuit driving has previously been defined as “an active
    attempt by a law enforcement officer operating a motor vehicle
    with emergency equipment to apprehend a suspected law violator
    in a motor vehicle, when the driver of the vehicle in question
    attempts to avoid apprehension” (Alpert, 1987, p. 299). This
    activity can be extremely dangerous to both parties involved in the
    pursuit and the general public. Recent statistics and some highprofile
    incidents in the United Kingdom have highlighted a rise in
    police-driver accidents. Sir Alistair Graham, chairman of the U.K.
    Police Complaints Authority, recently commented on a 178%
    increase in fatalities involving police pursuits, which he described
    as “totally unacceptable. . .“

    I’l adopt Sir Grahams vocabulary and refer to police driving standards as “totally unacceptable”, which means much the same as lousy.

    michaelmcc
    Free Member

    Can’t imagine why that could be.

    Because some people here are acting like tool bags.

    Mods close this down please!!

    Nonsense
    Free Member

    Edukator – you also missed my point about not being over confident and driving beyond your ability. I don’t think you quite appreciate the point I was making and I think you may have taken it a little personally. I wasn’t trying to have a go at you. Just suggesting that statistics were being manipulated to support an ill thought through argument.

    Now that study. Firstly thats talking about police pursuits, which you correctly identify are highly dangerous and therefore very carefully managed and frequently result in the police ending the pursuit. That is completely different to response driving. Even if the pursuit results in a fatality it does not automatically follow that the police driver was at fault.

    I’m not suggesting the police are perfect or that the training, especially for standard response drivers, could be more rigorous. But you are talking about a subject that you clearly know very little about.

Viewing 40 posts - 121 through 160 (of 197 total)

The topic ‘Driving at "Driving Test" standard.’ is closed to new replies.

Members Notice New deal added to Members Discounts