They had a section that contained an extensive report from a surgeon who has been working in Syria. This section was preceded by extensive warnings about the terribly graphic and upsetting nature of the accounts of injuries that would be relayed.

Terrible curiosity got the better of me; I turned off when they started talking about the ‘white spots’ on the little boy’s head. I turned off because I knew where it was going and I just didn’t want to hear it.

I just want to know, did that little boy surive? I suspect not, but I would like to know.

A simple yes or no will suffice.

Whether he survived or not was not mentioned any further in Dr Notts specific description of that specific day’s destruction.

Why did you turn off?, Do you not consider we need to hear reporting such as this so we can pressurise our Government & elected officials to come to some agreement over a mass effort to get basic medical aid into the country, I’m sure there are ways and means of applying pressure on the Assad regime to stop blanket bombing areas with 500lb TNT barrel bombs – his description of the destruction and horrific injuries suffered by the population should be played on repeat…on repeat…on repeat till the message gets through to everyone who chooses to turn off the radio, switch channels on TV or merely shrugs their shoulders and changes the subject.

He made mention of a cocktail party where he attempted to speak with a member of the government and how this elected member/official did not want to talk about what was happening so the official changed the subject to Ebola then eventually made his excuses and walked away – i honestly do not know how Dr Nutt managed to keep his anger withheld but i guess he has seen this situation play out time and time again so he does all he is able to do – which is attempt to repair the damage done.

I”m **** sick with anger…. with disgust…. with utter contempt for those in power who are now agreeing to softly support Assad and until this entire country gets to see or hear what is going on with our so called Allies against terror then our Government (and we, by association) are just as complicit in the killings.

I was cooking my tea as i listened to the start of the program but i soon stopped and just sat at the counter and listened to the despair in his voice, this is from a man who has spent all his life working in war zones throughout the world yet he has never saw destruction on such a scale, his chilling remark at the end of the program over what he considers the fate of Syria is chilling.

Why did I turn it off?

Because I have kids and I don’t want the image of it being them in the description in my head.

I don’t have kids but that doesn’t change the fact that i consider we need to see and be aware of reporting such as this to be broadcast anytime, to anyone.

Perhaps then we may not have such an apathetic population who prefer to turn the other cheek, perhaps we would start to take an interest in those officials who we elected to carry out descisions that may mean the difference between life and death in other populations around the world.

Syria Relief charity – Dr David Nott

I think you are getting annoyed at the wrong target there. I listened to it all and it was harrowing. I can completely understand why anyone would turn off because it was so upsetting. It was amazing radio and even if it caused some to turn it off it can be argued it has served its purpose in eliciting an emotional response. Turn it off or listen to it all and the one thing you have in common is awareness of the issue.

I listened to it in its entirety too, and do you know why? Because we have to.

i’m not annoyed (forums do not convey vocal intonation or expressions) but i am perplexed as to why anyone would turn off rather than be informed by someone who has genuine experience of the situation rather than a second/third hand report from a news journalist, next time i have the ear of any politician on the campaign trail i’ll be backing them into a corner to elicit a genuine and personal response from them with regard to this and a number of other issues that i feel have not been satisfactorily dealt with.

I don’t think they said whether the boy survived. His sister didn’t.

It made me think that it’s all too easy to turn off the reality and go back to our middleclass British lives.

The Dr works for Syrian Relief. He said they are desperately short of money. Maybe it’s worth making a donanation over the Christmas period.

fear of upsetting mental images surely pales into complete insignificance when compared to what those people are going through, that’s generally the conclusion I come to, and I listen. For all stories like these I feel it’s the absolute minimum I can do is to hear the story, to ‘turn off’ is a bit churlish to put it mildly, and I couldn’t allow myself to do that.
I wish I had half the courage of Dr Nott though, incredible human being.

I found it hard to turn off. Ended up sitting in the street in the car for ten minutes, feeling like I owed the guy my time. Though I must admit, my curiosity radar was through the roof. Compelling listening. And very harrowing.

Incredible listening. Angry, sad, frustrated. And humbled by Dr Nott.

Incredible listening. Angry, sad, frustrated. And humbled by Dr Nott

+1

What was the most depressing was him describing the plight of Aleppo. How much the situation had deteriorated in a year. How it would be completely cut off within weeks, then destroyed with barrel bombs. That Assad has achieved all his goals,by driving out or killing anyone who opposes him

Depressing. But I wish the media would give more time over to courageous, intelligent, caring, and humble people like him, telling it how it is, instead of politicians spouting sound bites, and ego fuelled commentators, who by comparison, know absolutely **** all! We’d all be better off for that

And i’m sorry, but turning it off was an absolute cop out! How on earth can anything change if we all just choose to look away from things we find unpaletteable? The problem is still there, just even less likely to be addressed

The one part of the program that “did it for me” (as if the entire program wasn’t harrowing enough) was towards the end of the broadcast when Eddy Mair asked about the future of the country and those who continue to live and work there, Dr Nott could not hide his vocal wobble and obvious emotional discomfort as he began to talk about how he sees the situation progressing till every person he knows will ultimately work till their death under such brutal bombardment by the regime or by the rebels inhumanity. This is from a man who has worked in the most horrific war scenarios for his entire life and he sounds utterly worn out by this current situation.

Did you see the programme with David nott on ch 4……

A&E in The War Zone?…yeah..sigh!….I didn’t see it as it was broadcast (nae tv) but i have since watched it on 4od catch up.

I sat outside the house in the car listening until the end. Extraordinary. Made even more poignant for me as I’ve just started to work with a chap from Syria so have heard a fair bit about it from him in the last couple of months.

It’s certainly easy to turn off…..

Edit: my friend is from Aleppo too and only last week was showing me pictures from before the conflict. Lovely place.

Just because someone has a lower tolerance for graphic material doesn’t mean they care less. Stop being such a bunch of judgemental pricks.

Cougar : leave both threads open eh?.

Squirrel king : I think you’ve got off on the wrong side of the discussion

A&E in The War Zone

Horrendous. I don’t do graphic but couldn’t turn it off as it was a programme that had to be watched not least because of commitment and tenacity of Dr Nott and the plight of the people he was working with and treating. Astonishing man, awful circumstances.

I would say just the opposite squirrelking; clearly geetee cares a lot, or he wouldn’t have bothered posting (and I’ve never got the impression that he’s anything other than a decent bloke).

Most of the posts above that responded to him could be summarised as: yeah, its tough, but we should be listening.

A few Kurdish friends here, they like Assad at the moment as he’s helping them in Kobane with actual fighters on the ground. The west isn’t really.

I don’t think we can complain about Assad until we actually commit to helping with soldiers on the ground in both Syria and Iraq. The opposition are just as bad as well.

I listened and found it harrowing, this is what happens when people drop bombs, its been repeated many times and will continue to be repeated, I only wish it was on prime time tv, I also wish something similar had been broadcast post March 2003.

I would say just the opposite squirrelking; clearly geetee cares a lot, or he wouldn’t have bothered posting (and I’ve never got the impression that he’s anything other than a decent bloke).

That was my impression as well, my beef was with the usual sanctimonious judgemental shite being thrown at him for turning off.

To expand on my point, the OP clearly cared, certainly enough to listen to what he could tolerate. But what would have been achieved by listening on other than being able to willy wave about it on a public forum? Just because he chose to turn off doesn’t mean he cares any less or is any less passionate about the situation, tbh if he has as vivid an imagination as I do I sure as hell wouldn’t want those sorts of thoughts floating about my head especially where my own child is concerned.

Squirrel king : I think you’ve got off on the wrong side of the discussion

Well if you don’t like the direction I got off on perhaps you shouldn’t have taken it there with your holier than thou attitude. The discussion was about the program contant, not the ins and outs of the OP’s tolerance thereof.

I listened all the way through, like many was interested in the situation from a first hand perspective and humbled by the work he does and how he does it. Geetee isn’t lacking in compassion or fibre for turning it off IMHO.

When I was 21, in the summer before my final year at Uni, I got involved with a group led by Medicine Sans Frontiers. This was 1994 and there was a very nasty ethnic conflict that had sparked up in Azerbijahn against the ethnic Armenians in Nagorno Karabak and the Azeri indigenous population.

I saw first hand the effects of various types of land mine on adults and children; missing limbs mostly. In particular the the effect that these little silver balls have when picked up and explode in a child’s hand.

I never saw anything as bad as that described on the radio last night but I was never too bothered by the sight of gore or viscera.

Last night’s broadcast was too much for me because I now have kids of my own and since then, my ability to hear or see things that involve the suffering of children has dropped to zero. It’s just too painful because it’s too easy to transpose the image of that child with that of my own and it crushes me (and as I type this, my two year old is sat on my lap).

Which is precisely why we need broadcasts like last night. Without any empathy we can have no compassion and sometimes we need to hear the shocking truth in order to get that empathy, even if it is very painful.

My primary reason for posting this thread was because it would have been a small victory if the report had concluded with the child surviving.

Thankyou for the responses and for highlighting that there is somewhere we can give money to to help.

Happy christmas.

As above. Turning the programme off is not the same as ignoring the issue.

Fair enough Geetee. I certainly wasn’t accusing you of a lack of compassion. I don’t think anyone was. I’m sure it had more impact on you given your experiences. If it came across like that, apologies

After listening to the doctor, I read this article in the Guardian by Will Self. Its regarding our attitude, and acceptance (or not) of the horrors of Syria (amongst other places). I think this thread disproves his main point, but its worth a read. Its very relevant, and does you make you think about your own attitude, and the portrayal in the media of conflict. The today programmes coverage being so noticeably different in that regard

We are passive consumers of the pornography of voilence

I now have kids of my own and since then, my ability to hear or see things that involve the suffering of children has dropped to zero. It’s just too painful because it’s too easy to transpose the image of that child with that of my own and it crushes me (and as I type this, my two year old is sat on my lap).

Does this happen to everyone once they have kids?

Some people (not GT) do go apoplectic at some child related issues.

And i’m sorry, but turning it off was an absolute cop out! How on earth can anything change if we all just choose to look away from things we find unpaletteable?

How does listening to a radio programme change things? You don’t need to listen to harrowing accounts to know that what’s happening in Syria is horrific, and you don’t need to listen to decide to give to charities or write to your MP (fat lot of good that does).

I don’t think I’d listen to that. I don’t need to know.

I listened in on my drive home from work. We do need to know what is going on out there, we should know.

I find it increasingly depressing and saddening about what people are capable of doing to others.

I squeezed my kids a little bit harder when I got home last night.

My God we are lucky here in our soft Western affluent bubble, purely by luck of birth.

Thing is, though, the world isn’t becoming mroe violent and dangerous – we’re just exposed to it more. And I’m not sure that’s a good thing. It’s possible to have compassion for others without hearing the gory details of their suffering.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/foreigners/2014/12/the_world_is_not_falling_apart_the_trend_lines_reveal_an_increasingly_peaceful.html

There’s a comparison with reporting of child abuse/kidnap. Kids nowadays have never been safer, but we’re also a lot more paranoid because of the in-depth coverage of every incident where a child has been kidnapped.

How does listening to a radio programme change things?

It doesn’t. But it raises awareness. Be honest… when was the last time you listened to anything similar? Or watched anything as thorough. Rarely, I’d imagine. This stuck out to me because it hammers home how insulated, and detached we are over here. The mainstream news skims over this stuff. And doesn’t dwell on the true horror of it. This is ironic, given the 24 rolling news agenda we now live in. We’ve decided as a society to collectively look the other way. And the vile celebrity obsessed culture we are now saddled with has filled the vacuum

If you look at reporting a few decades ago. Don McCullin’ or Eddie Adams Vietnam pictures in the Times, and Time for example, they’re a lot harder hitting than the media coverage we have now. Where is that level of reporting? Wheres the depth? The real people like Dr Nutt telling the truth about the uncomfortable realities of these situations? It hardly exits any more. Except for notable exceptions like Channel 4’s aptly named ‘Unreported World’.

Now its embedded journalists covering what the army tell them to cover, and a squeamish TV media who are deciding if images are too graphic for us. Best not show them eh? We’re grown ups FFS. We can make our own decisions. Like last night. But this was a rare example of us being told the whole truth, by a knowledgable and concerned person, uncensored. If it showed anything, it showed how rare this honest reporting now is!

Horrific things have been happening in Syria for 4 or 5 years. The West tried to intervene but was blocked by Russia who are allied to Assad. Cameron gave a vote to parliament to get involved and it was defeated.

I read and watch a lot on the Middle East, there are many excellent local news services now available on the web. There was a reasonable amount of coverage from Syria until IS took over and captured journalists like James Foley, they didn’t want people to see what was happening. There have been many many more Palestinians killed in Appello than Gaza. There have been over 200,000 casualties in the Syrian civil war.

As I said we had a vote to get involved and it was defeated. Political pressure has been out on Assad for many years but it makes no difference and we have very few economic levers we can apply, Russia is their ally and trading partner and the Russians have supported them.

I haven’t listened to the programme but I will.

We’re grown ups FFS. We can make our own decisions.

Yes, and I’ve made the decision that I don’t want to know the details – knowing them won’t mean that I do any more than I already do about the situation. I already donate what I can to charity, and politically I regularly annoy my MP.

The recurring theme with this and the report from Iraq on the Today prog this morning seems to be the need for humanitarian help. Leaving aside the rights and wrongs and which side to support, these people need medicines and food, even $35,000 worth of chocolate apparently.

I took a lot of chocolate with me when I went to Nagorno Karabak. We took a huge amount of other food and medical supplies as well, including a few tons of sugar which was essential for preserving fruit.

You’d be amazed at just how much of a positive effect chocolate can have on a child trapped in a war zone.

Binners I haven’t taken any offence to anything you or anyone else has said. The debate is important.

Ben – you seem pretty determined to be affronted, without actually reading what I’m saying. I’m not having a go at you or anyone else.

The decision to listen to it or not is yours. Fine. I get that.

My point is, that in most cases nowadays, our media sells us short, and has already made this decision for us. We’re being treated like children. It seems they’ve collectively decided to spare us the details of conflicts, a lot of which is the direct result of our actions or inactions, going back a long way. Thats why such a detailed, no holds barred account was so striking. For its rarity

You have to ask yourself who’s agenda that suits? Certainly not the people of Syria. That’s for sure

They commented in the report last night that a lot of the images coming out of Syria were not broadcastable because they were too shocking. That is why they chose to broadcast the first hand accounts.

It certainly seems to have done the trick with those that listened.

And thats sort of my point GT. We’re being infantilised by the media. Are they too shocking? I’d like to be the judge of that myself thanks. I know where the off button is.

Going back to Vietnam for example, the American public broadly supported what was being done because of a dearth of information coming out of the country. When Don McCullin and Eddie Adams started publishing images* in Time Magazine that showed the reality, rather than the cosy perception, this changed things dramatically.

It was then that the mood changed and people saw what was being done in their name. Then came the protests. Its important IMHO that, in a democratic society, we are given all the information about complex situations. No matter how uncomfortable or upsetting. Whether you choose to view that is your decision. We’re all grown ups. But this isn’t happening now.

And its been going on for a while. Margaret Thatcher personally barred Don McCullin from travelling with the task force to the Falklands, as she knew his honest portrayals had in her words ‘changed the course of the war in Vietnam’. And she didn’t want a repeat.

We as a society need to grow up, stop insulating ourselves from inconvenient, uncomfortable facts, and face up to reality of things as they are, not as how we’d like them to be

* I’d post them up, but I’m not trying to be provocative. You know how google works. And you’ll know some of the more dramatic ones anyway