found it here
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=384697
saying something about removing the negative air with a piece of film wedged in the seal?
Bike Forum
coil shocks
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Posted 11 months ago #
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Forget that bit - general consensus is you're much better off leaving the neg air in there. In my experience it works a treat and you don't lose any travel.
Posted 11 months ago # -
heavier tho, and less adjustable
The spring was quite thin wire, and only a few inches long - hardly weighed anything. Adjustability wasn't an issue really either.
I'm tempted to remove the floating piston from my 66s because it takes up a significant chunk of the air chamber near full travel and hence helps prevent me from getting full travel.
Posted 11 months ago # -
OP - Not sure about night and day (air/coil both "work"); but as i understand it coil is a performance upgrade if you want to blast down hills/mountains and hit stuff hard.
Its going to add about 0.5kg to your build so it not that significant and it will pedal up hill as good as any air shock as long as it is set up right.
IMO.
Posted 11 months ago # -
I bought a Van RC from LoCo last week for my RFX and can heartily recommend him. Very helpful and very prompt postage. Price was excellent!
Posted 11 months ago # -
andy> how different are the ride charcteristics? what shock did you have before?
Posted 11 months ago # -
DHX5 air shock. Shock feels quite different. Going downhill it feels very positive. Only been out round Lee/Cragg quarries this weekend but first impressions are good. The DHX seemed slow to respond and quite 'dull'. RC feels immediate but without being twitchy. It's definately heavier but not that noticeable on the bike.
I'm no expert as you can guess by my description but would definately recommend the upgrade.
Posted 11 months ago # -
Hello from Portugal.
I'm the author of the first video (you know, that pointless stupid wtf video).
I'm not an shock expert, and the video has the value that it has! Probably you can do better and send me.
The drop test in the video was a simulation of a quick small impact. As you can see, in the shock coil, the shock absorvs the energy of the impact, and in the air shock, the shock does NOT absorbs anything (it doesnot move either) which means that the shock is "blind" to small impacts. So it is not a rebound problem because the shock does not compress. The problem is that the air shocks have a stupidly higher pressure in IFP (200-300 psi) and have more friction, which results in a harsh ride. As probably you should know, IFP pressure is needed to pressurize the oil in damping, to avoid hydraulic cavitation, but, more than that will reduce the small bump performance. The reason that conventional air shocks have such an higher IFP pressure is to have some pedal "platform"...But that kills all the bump performance! In my Swinger Coil shock, I'm running IFP at 60 Psi.
You can do this test to a lots of different air shocks, and in most of then, it doesn't bind the wheel in the ground. Recently I also did this test with an Enduro SL with DHX5 air with minimum pressure (90Psi) in IFP and it also does NOT bind the wheel completely, although, it bounces less than AFR.
As a conclusion of this test, the coil shock has a lower blow-off treshould in such a way that can absorve smaller impacts.
This "stupid wtf pointless" video means that when you are in a fast bumpy downhill singletrack, the wheel keeps in the ground, and you have a much more plush and control ride than with an air shock!
So, I do AM and FR type of riding, and IMO the coil is much much better for everything. Only disadvantage is the weigh ganning. It doesnot suffers from pedal bobing, it is more active in climbing (more traction), and much more plush in downhill.
Good bye from Portugal, and try a coil shock in your AM bike, I think you will like the feeling.
Bye good rides and sorry the english.
Posted 10 months ago # -
you say "much more or better" slightly or even inferior would be more accurate.
why would I want a heavy coil shock on a xc bike? and I think the quality of the damping is more relevant.Posted 10 months ago # -
I swapped my RP2 for a coil Van R .
Difference was night and day for my 99KG.
RP2 could be set nicely to sag (static) but put any weight over it and it would wallow and sink. Now I think that could have been fixed with a tune by Mojo but Coil was instant win and cost just as much for a good SH one
I run a 650lb spring. I never turned the PP on on the old one anyway so havnt missed it
Posted 10 months ago # -
I have an enduro with both coil and air shock set to my weight/sag etc etc. They both absorb the "drop test" perfectly. The video shows two shocks that are setup very diffently but that does not mean that an air shock can not be setup to give the same outcome on this "test".
Posted 10 months ago # -
I'm going to get skewered for this by the engineers but:-
I think the video test accurately reflects the difference in performance between an RC and an AFR. An AFR IS more rigid and sticky than an RC. I don't see why conceptually it's a flawed test to just drop the damn bike provided the shocks are set up roughly the same. Certainly there is no way the difference in weight between an Enduro and a Pitch could explain the difference shown in the video.
Incidentally a significant part of the problem with AFR shocks is that they are just difficult to tune - nothing like as simple as an RC. If the Youtube poster had difficulty setting the AFR up to match the RC because the adjustments are so opaque - that is a performance issue in itself.
Posted 10 months ago # -
The drop test in the video was a simulation of a quick small impact.
Not a very good one. The bike's unladen for a start. Air shock stiction itself is really not noticeable when actually riding, not like it can be on forks - I can verify this.
It is true though that coil shocks are plusher than air shocks, but everyone knows that already. Your video makes out that you are discovering some amazing proof!
Coil shocks are better, but heavier. That's common knowledge
Posted 10 months ago # -
Molgrips sums it up very well.
Out of curiosity I tried the flawed bounce test on my AFR equipped Enduro and it sucked it up nicely (better than my Yeti ASR5 with RP23 which I'm guessing is mainly due to the Enduro being heavier). Something ain't right with the Enduro in the vid.
Posted 10 months ago #
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