Hello, asking any of the photographers on here what camera set up they can reccomend for photogrpahing artwork, mainly pencil drawings.

My artist friends who are doing the same are using set ups that i cant afford at the moment and have little experience of entry level DSLR’s. My budget is around £500. I have a tripod and a studiolight so i am looking for any recomendations on a camera body and lens. I dont mind used or pre-owned.

I would say the lens is more important than the camera body.
You want a lens with low distortion towards the edges, if you are aiming to fill the frame with your artwork, rather than just use the centre of the image frame.

I would have said you want something like a 60mm prime lens, or perhaps even a bit longer.
I am not sure about specific lenses that would give you better performance over other lenses, but there are plenty of review sites that have photos taken of test boards to show distortion at the edges.

With regards to taking the photos, I would aim to get the camera as central to the artwork as possible and square to it. i.e. not pointing up/down/left/right as this will give you converging/diverging lines.

It might be worth setting the white balance yourself using a test shot of a white piece of paper – all SLRs will do this, and it will give you the most neutral result.

Definitely use the tripod & take the shots at between f8 and f11. Generally, that is where the lens will be sharpest so will give you the best reproduction.

Thinking about it while writing all of the above – Nikon do a highly regarded 50mm lens that is pretty cheap. You could probably get a decent body & that lens for well under your budget.
You’d have to get a bit closer to your artwork to fill the frame than something like a 70mm, but that shouldn’t be a problem.

Here’s a link to a Ken Rockwell review – there are a couple of pics that show how sharp it is:
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/5018daf.htm

There are others on here with much more camera experience who will be able to give you more advice on equipment than I can……

I think stumpy is right on the lens front. If you want a cheap option look at an olympus e-p1 or e-pl1 and an old canon fd lens (anything from 24, 28 to 50mm).

An e-pl1 can be had for £179 new and an adapter for £15 and another £20-odd for the lens.

Olympus always have low barrel distortion and chromatic abberation in the reviews, which I suppose are the things you want to avoid most. High ISO noise won’t be an issue if you are lighting it yourself and using a tripod.

But really I’d suggest an e-pl1 simply because of their price. There’s really nothing that offers better image quality for that kind of money, I reckon. I personally wouldn’t bother much with a prime lens, I reckon you would not notice the difference between that and the prime lens when snapping drawings.

What are you going to do with the images? Online? Print?

With regards getting the pic centred and the camera level, the Sony alpha I’ve just bought had a spirit level for side to side and fore and aft tilt on the screen.

catflees – what size are they?

Getting the lighting/contrast/colour correction correct, would be top of my list if I was copying artwork with artificial lighting.

2nd hand Nikon D80 – £200 from Ebay. Brand new 50mm Nikon prime £100 to £300 depending on quality / model.

Correct for any distortion in SW afterwards eg PhotoShot etc

Lens wise, you ideally want a low distortion lens corrected for flat field copy work (the majority of lenses aren’t). Such a lens is the Nikon 60mm AF Micro (not sure about it’s AF-S successor though).

Thankyou to everyone who has replied, 🙂

What are you going to do with the images? Online? Print?

I wish to use the photohraphs for my website, print outs and portfolio.

catflees – what size are they?

Most of my commissions are A3 in size, however i would like the photography set up to be able to handle close ups for the tutorial part of my website.

If you are starting with nothing, budget in a good tripod (Manfrotto 055 or equivalent minimum), a focusing stage (I got a used one of eBay), and a remote control:

Thanks Tucker, do you photograph art yourself?

I really need a system that will pick up the very subtle blending and changes in tone.

It’s an odd kind of easy, kind of not easy thing to do. The important factors are lens, light and exposure.

Any macro lens should be well corrected and stupidly sharp. All the major manufacturers have 50mm and 100mm macro lens.

The most reliable way to light is to have two strobes in large softboxes, one on each side at a shallow angle and a good distance away from the artwork.

Exposure and white-balance are vital too. I use a lastolite fold-out grey card and a x-rite passport colour chart.

But by the time you get lights (£500), camera (£200), lens (£200), colour chart (£50), and a tripod it’s getting a little pricey.

*I am a photographer and have to photograph expensive art works on a regular basis.

^^ is that expense really necessary?

The Nikon 50mm 1.8 can be had for £100.
A Nikon D3100 can be had for £320 or a 2nd hand D80 for about £250.
A grey card is around £20.
Lights – is the strobes/softbox set-up really necessary? How about just taking pics in an evenly lit room. Probably wouldn’t be quite as good, but would it be good enough?

Actually reading the original post, the OP already has a tripod & a studio light….

Oh by the way, Olympus 35mm macro is an excellent lens and I got mine for £150 or so. Would fit on an E-PL1 too.

Could you not arrange lights out of some bits of white paper and bedside lamps?

What am I missing here, why isn’t the answer “a flatbed scanner”?

Thank for the further replies.

JPR, that’s the kind of set up I wish to have in the near future. Thankyou.

I have an old Canon Eos 300v film camera. I should have a cable release on that, I will have to have a look. My friend works at a university and is replacing the lights there, he is donating to me the old light, I don’t know and details of it but he said it’s perfect for what I want (and free) he will also get me a card, he said it’s tatty but will do.

Cougar, flatbed scanners ‘wash out’ pencil drawings and don’t do them justice.

Really? Fair enough, I didn’t realise that.

Lots of people struggle with flatbed scanners (myself included), but my local art printer (expensive giclee stuff) swears by his.
I’ve always found the ‘close-to-whites’ get blown and the dark graphite reflects, but I’ve seen his results and they are superb.

So I wouldn’t totally rule them out – there must be products or knacks that make the difference.

With my photography of artwork, I’ve found it very very difficult to get an even light. I would say that was the number one problem to solve.

Tripod

Camera

Self timer.

Overcast day.

JOB DONE.

Is this for the STW ART CLUB as well 😉 ?

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/draw-this-a-stw-weekly-art-project

Is this for the STW ART CLUB as well ?

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/draw-this-a-stw-weekly-art-project

He he no, im bowing out. My drawings incorporate photo realism, among more sketch like styles. I dont fancy the drawing from photos debate.

Lots of people struggle with flatbed scanners (myself included), but my local art printer (expensive giclee stuff) swears by his.
I’ve always found the ‘close-to-whites’ get blown and the dark graphite reflects, but I’ve seen his results and they are superb.

Thanks 🙂 ive seen impressive results with scanners, but the ones that can do that are way beyond my budget. Also i sometimes make artwork thats larger in scale and a camera would be more versatile.

IIRC, it was <£200, but I get your point about versatility.

Forget a tripod, the legs will get in the way. Unless you’re going to mount the work on a wall and photograph it like that. A copy stand is far easier to use really.

Some here, although s/h ones can be picked up cheaply. Local camera fair might have a bargain, or Ebay etc.

http://www.kudlian.net/products/copystands/

^^ is that expense really necessary?

Well no, but for high quality results, with flat, even lighting, a balanced diffused lighting set-up will give best results. Using ambient light invariable leads to uneven lighting across the image. S/h lighting sets can be had for a few quid really. Full on TTL flash/strobe systems can cost a fortune, but a couple of cheap old flashguns can work really well, speshly if it’s dijical and you can play around with settings. Flash will be a lot cooler than standard lights, although without modeling lights offered on spensive studio flash units, more difficult to set up as you can’t see the effect.

Also consider a light tent, although you don’t have to spend loads you could make one yourself really.

http://www.shutterfreaks.com/Tips/BillsLightTent.html

TBH a lot of stuff can be rigged up very cheaply at home using standard easily available stuffs. Unless you’re earning good money from photographing artwork, it’s not worth investing in dedicated kit. if you’re only going to be doing stuff occasionally, consider hiring equipment, or even just get a pro to do it, as you’ll get top results without spending thousands like they did…

I really need a system that will pick up the very subtle blending and changes in tone.

Which unfortunately means expense. I don’t rate copy stands as I prefer the power and flexibility of strobes, although they do have their place photographing small works of art that aren’t rigid.

Light tents won’t work for flat art work.

The most important part is going to be the grey chart, colour chart, colour management side of things. It’s essentially why it’s so difficult to get good results out of a scanner as they tend not to give you any/fine-enough control over exposure.

Also: perspective crop in PS is your friend.

Light tents won’t work for flat art work.

Why not? It’s about achieving an even spread of light across the image. Would be ideal for less than flat stuff, such as oil/acrylic paintings, metallic surfaces and that. Basically it’s about diffusing the light source sufficiently so as not to create hard reflections/light fall-off.

I don’t rate copy stands as I prefer the power and flexibility of strobes

I don’t understand that. You can use strobes with a copystand. 😕 I have done…

And they allow you to get the cam square-on to the image.

I’m thinking you could get sumat like this for smaller artworks, then wrap tissue paper round two sides, create a sort of ‘tent’ to diffuse the light, then use flashes/lights either side.

As the OP stated there was a relatively small budget, just trying to think of solutions which would save money, leaving more for other kit, like a decent s/h macro lens. £500 isn’t going to go very far if you spend loads on studio strobes and stuff…

Most of my commissions are A3 in size

I really need a system that will pick up the very subtle blending and changes in tone.

The light tent will run the risk of having the sides directly reflected on the artwork, leading to uneven lighting. The greater the distance of the strobes from the artwork the less the variation in lighting across the art work will be.

I’m not saying you can’t do it on a budget, I’m just saying that for good, reliable results there is going to need to be a degree of investment.

The more powerful your lights the easier it is to overpower the ambient light – thus the easier it is to get reproducible results regardless of time of day or weather.

The more powerful your lights the greater distance you can put them from the artwork, creating more even lighting.

Paint your walls white and get some strip lights around the edges?

Or probably paint them magnolia actually.

Thanks for the replies. I wish to build a decent photography set up slowly, JPW’s advice is the kind of thing i want in the near future. My ex-girlfriend worked at Bonhams and they had a really nice set up, they used to photograph my art, but alas thats not going to happen now.

This photograph was taken on my iphone as it best highlights the advice i am after.

The white of the page is broken up onto smaller areas, is this called noise or is there any other technical term for it? sometimes the white is displayed with a slight colour on it, normally pinks and blues.

As you can see drawings look crap on iphone and lack depth, is there a particular camera set up that will show the ‘real’ depth in the drawing?

This one was taken on my current Panasonic compact point and click. It washes out all of the skin tones and the eyes are not deep enough.

Again on the Panasonic, the gray areas appear noisy.

….flame away opn the drawings 🙂 he he

Well no, but for high quality results, with flat, even lighting, a balanced diffused lighting set-up will give best results. Using ambient light invariable leads to uneven lighting across the image. S/h lighting sets can be had for a few quid really. Full on TTL flash/strobe systems can cost a fortune, but a couple of cheap old flashguns can work really well, speshly if it’s dijical and you can play around with settings. Flash will be a lot cooler than standard lights, although without modeling lights offered on spensive studio flash units, more difficult to set up as you can’t see the effect.

Also consider a light tent, although you don’t have to spend loads you could make one yourself really.

Elfin ^^^ so you’re agreeing with me that the expense isn’t really necessary, as you can probably cobble something together with regards to lighting for less than the £500 I was referring to??

Flash will be a lot cooler than standard lights, although without modeling lights offered on spensive studio flash units, more difficult to set up as you can’t see the effect.

Perfect for using a digital camera, then?? You don’t need to see the effect before taking the picture. Set it up how you think it needs to be, take picture, review picture, adjust if necessary, take picture, review picture……etc.

catflees – the pics looks great. Not sure you’ve lined it up properly though, and the lighting doesn’t look that even. I’d move the pencils/erasers etc. out of the way too…….. 😉

catflees – the pics looks great. Not sure you’ve lined it up properly though, and the lighting doesn’t look that even. I’d move the pencils/erasers etc. out of the way too……..

Hehe, made me smile

The white of the page is broken up onto smaller areas, is this called noise or is there any other technical term for it? sometimes the white is displayed with a slight colour on it, normally pinks and blues.

Yes, this sounds like noise on the image. If you are using a tripod with plenty of light you can minimise this. Keep the ISO of the camera low, even if this means extending the exposure time.
If you zoom right in though, this can never be 100% eradicated, but with modern digital cameras it should be 100x less noticeable than the pic from your iphone.

You comment about pinks and blues is a question of white balance. I don’t know exactly how it does it, but you camera will decide what is white and adjust all colours according to this. It doesn’t always get it bang on, in fact more often than not it won’t get it bang on, so you end up with a colour cast across the image. The most obvious examples of this is when using a camera under normal indoor bulbs; the pics will appear very orange, or under flash light they might appear blue if the camera isn’t adjusted to ‘flash’ white balance’. It is easy to see the effect of this – change the white balance settings of your panasonic compact and take pics of the same thing with each change of setting.

I am not sure about how close a camera can get to reproducing what you really see. Part of it will be the ability of your monitor to display what the camera has photographed.
You mention the images looking washed out, lacking depth etc. You might need to take several exposures and merge them in something like photoshop to get the most detail from the shadows/midtones & highlights??

Great work catflees, would not mind seeing some more once you have them online.

You’ll find 4 things going on:

Exposure – cameras try to expose for normal scenes. If you photograph snow it will come out underexposed as a 100% white scene isn’t normal so you have to manually increase exposure or it comes up dull. Your drawings show this to a lesser extent (they look dark to me) so you need to manually adjust exposure.

White balance – the lighting will influence the colour of the image. You can manually set the white balance using a grey card or through software if you shoot raw.

Noise – small sensors can’t receive much light due to their size so show a lot of noise. The noise is fixed so it’s the ratio of signal (from light received) vs the noise that you see. More light and bigger sensors (that have a greater area to receive what light there is) give less visible noise.

Dynamic range – the number of shades the camera can differentiate between black and white. The higher the dynamic range the more tones you can potentially see.

A ‘real camera’ (as opposed to an iphone or a cheap p&s) will let you manually adjust exposure and white balance. A large sensor camera (not a p&s – m4/3, aps-c or full frame) will give you low noise and high dynamic range under good lighting.

BTW, back when I used to work in the trade (many years ago), we used to use a grey card, standard (very old) Nikkor 50mm lens on F2’s, Gitzo tripod and use the light from a large skylight on an overcast day in the studio 😉

Smaller stuff, anything A5 or smaller, used to be done on a copy stand like Elfinsafety setup.

Boss was a big fan of keeping any setup as simple as possible 😉