I’m confused – I thought you were suggesting road riders who couldn’t quite make it doing XC instead?

Yes I was meaning I thought there was (much) more talent amongst roadies than xc currently as if there was more talent we wouldn’t have this problem. So my logic was if we get a few decent level roadies committing to XC perhaps they can get somewhere results wise, attract some funding and get to the Olympics.

Where are the youngsters supposed to learn and hone their skills? With access being so crap, there’s little or no incentive to look at xc as being a serious sport in the UK. Far more opportunities in other disciplines.

But you’re not suggesting decent level roadies, you’re suggesting roadies who couldn’t make it. What makes you think they’d do better than the current top UK XC racers who would have made it onto a pro road team if they’d gone that way (oh, and can also ride a bike off-road)? There also seems to be a bit of the usual theme of XC racing not being technically difficult – you do realise that the days of riding around fields are long gone at the top level and the top XC racers would school all of you lot on anything technical?

@mboy, I think you misunderstood me.

I didn’t

Unless some really talented athletes show an interest in xc and get some resuits (probably off their own back) the lottery / BC aren’t going to put any money in.

This has happened, repeatedly! The only thing that BC have done is step in to pay their fares to get to the world champs for said riders… A return flight to the Czech Republic, the entry fee, and a few days in shared accomodation must have broken the bank!

We don’t have any top level xc athletes worth funding and potential talent from other cycling disciplines isn’t crossing over.

We very much do… The problem is, they’re not stupid. They ride MTB year on year, self supported in most cases, picking up various national trophies along the way, top 10 finishes at World Champs and in World Cup’s, and they still can’t get a break cos XC isn’t important enough for the sponsors or BC to step in and help out! Little wonder that after years of trying, said XC riders who are often getting their shirt sleeves pulled by road teams with offers of a paid ride, they give up and turn to road racing!

I have a little inside info ( ) into lottery funding and if you start to slip in world rankings / designated events you lose the money.

Wow, very insightful! The closest I’ve come to any insight into how the lottery funding works is I’ve bought the odd lottery ticket in my time, but I could still have told you that’s exactly how it works! Do you know any elite level XC racers yourself that have been going through the struggle?

I find having bmx and MTB at the Olympics a bit odd… The amount of money spent to build two tracks where a total of four medals are going to be won seems a bit off.

Obviously more money and time will be invested in track as there are more medals on offer.

Why bmx is in the Olympics I do not know. Same for XC. If they are in it, and if F1 is being considered then DH should be included, too. I would hazard a guess that more of us can relate to DH than XC.

F1 isn’t being considered, and we had a whole thread earlier on whether DH should be included – the point made correctly there was that a small subset of people on a specialist forum might be able to relate more to DH (though what we actually need is a cycling event with rests at the top of every hill and a cafe stop in order to relate to what we do), but for the general public XC is much easier to relate to.

Why cant britain produce olympic or even world cup level XC racers

Because real XC racers aren’t interested in a brief pootle around a trail park.

They’re doing stuff like the HT550 and the TDR.

We’re well represented there.

So how many here have taken part in an XC race?

Surely if we need to boost its popularity taking part at grass roots would be a good start?

I do a few gorrick races a year. Plus few endurance events so I’m doing my bit.

I race all the Midlands, the Nationals, various other grass root races too – FNSS, Thetford Winter Series (RIP 🙁 ) etc.

Tiger6791 – Member

So how many here have taken part in an XC race?

did a few 20 years ago for some Scottish series on a rigid orange C16

I think that once british cycling get hold of any promising athletes they try and get them into track, they have done so to Shaniaze Reed from bmx, and even had rachel Atherton try out on track FFS!

They just don’t seem to grasp or understand any other element of the sport

With XC theres only one shot (well two – mens and womens) at one medal every 4 years and you don’t know what the course is going to be like and whether it will suit the riders you’re investing in til pretty late in the day. Its a very high risk discipline to invest several years of support in. BMX is similar – one shot and no matter how good you are you can just get taken out by someone else’s error.

The reason for the focus on track is theres multiple medals available not just for the team but a strong contender has a shot at more than one medal. So team GB focuses more on those multiple medal disciplines (track, rowing, martial arts etc) in terms of investment but theres also a programme within that about identifying talented competitors and steering them towards other sports or to disciplines within their sport where they’ll be more successful. Team GB will will effectively head-hunt people across disciplines to get them into a discipline where their physique best matches demands of the sport.

I though that watching the womens Track sprint and thinking the dutch rider Elis Ligtlee – all 6’1″ of her – would be rowing a boat if she was british.

if BC were serious about XC they need to make it cool

xc will never be cool, its just dull to watch.

What @epic says makes sense to me

Because real XC racers aren’t interested in a brief pootle around a trail park.
They’re doing stuff like the HT550 and the TDR.
We’re well represented there.

BC can’t make an International event “cool” – the rules are set by UCI and they would argue there are plenty of talented athletes from different countries doing the world cup and the Olympics

xc will never be cool, its just dull to watch.

I take it you’ve not watched any of the world cup rounds this year then?

But you’re not suggesting decent level roadies, you’re suggesting roadies who couldn’t make it. What makes you think they’d do better than the current top UK XC racers who would have made it onto a pro road team if they’d gone that way (oh, and can also ride a bike off-road)? There also seems to be a bit of the usual theme of XC racing not being technically difficult – you do realise that the days of riding around fields are long gone at the top level and the top XC racers would school all of you lot on anything technical?

This. The days of Roadies switching and doing well are over. The courses require technical capability. Only need to look how good Shurter is downhill to see that a roadie would have no chance.

A mtb rider is more likely to go to the road and be successful than the other way round. So that means you cant just get a pro roadie from Team Sky or whatever, give them an XC bike and expect them to be competitive.

You need kids from early on. I don’t think we have the racing series and amount of riders needed to find the best riders. And if they get there BC comes knocking trying to get them on a road or track bike and that means theres a chance they can make a living at it.

Be interesting to see how Sagan gets on but he is from MTB anyway.

everyone – Member
xc will never be cool, its just dull to watch.
I take it you’ve not watched any of the world cup rounds this year then?

Been helped alot by having a battle between to of the top riders ever.

Well since even STW can’t be arsed even putting up a report on the women’s race what hope is there. Only mention of Olympics XC on front page is a Press Release from Rocksox.

End of the day no media coverage means no one will sponsor riders and if you were say a 19 year old and offered little more than a free mtb or alternatively full back up of the BC Track squad or Sky then it is a simple decision.

UK mtb media must take a huge share of the blame IMO.

I agree more positive media coverage would improve numbers racing. The thing is cx doesn’t get any coverage either (unless the roadie media cover it?) but participation is booming apparently (only done one season myself). Guess that is due to interest at a club level?

More grass root events would be good but when regional/national events are barely breaking even I’m not sure they would survive. I’m trying to sort out organising a race with our club and it’s difficult. You find a good course in a good venue, feel really positive about putting something on and then get grief from non-racers, objections raised from all sorts of areas, logistical issues and it’s back to square one. It’s pretty demoralising and I haven’t even got to the formal application stage. Got a few other venues to explore though 😀

Xc is more interesting to watch than dh IMO.

I agree more positive media coverage would improve numbers racing. The thing is cx doesn’t get any coverage either (unless the roadie media cover it?) but participation is booming apparently (only done one season myself). Guess that is due to interest at a club level?

I wonder whether it’s easier to set up a cx circuit than it is to set up a xc circuit. And whether that has anything to do with it.
Personally I think that cx will continue to grow until they start pissing around with wheel sizes.

Some good points here, think the strength of the UK road scene vs the xc means it is much easier to a talented bike rider to live full time as a road rider. Countries like Switzerland have a superstrong domestic race calendar that attracts with skill based competition for young riders and the culture of racing at a club level is much more ingrained than over here

xc is dull to watch for the average bod in the street. Its a long procession of folk on bikes riding what looks like easy courses ( cos of the tv effect)

Little in the way of overtaking battles, doesn’t look spectacular. Its basically dull.

got to agree on mtb xc not being exciting to watch.

The ladies Olympic race yesterday being an example. My wife even commented it didn’t look like a proper race because they (appeared to be) were riding so slow.

I am hoping the men’s race will be better.

I think a few more close ups on the gnar and a bit of better commentary about how hard they were working would have helped.

It depends on the coverage, some of the world cups are quite exciting to watch because they’re filmed by people who know how to film bike races.

Same with the BMX, looks dull at the Olympics, but the UCI supercross series looks great.

TBH though, even if it was lottery funded, would we be much better at it? Outside of Schruter and Albason, are there any real* pro’s in XC.

Even if you could find a roadie (for the money) who can MTB well enough to podium, they wouldn’t be allowed to race MTB because the road team can’t risk their riders picking up uneccecary injuries.

I wonder whether it’s easier to set up a cx circuit than it is to set up a xc circuit. And whether that has anything to do with it.
Personally I think that cx will continue to grow until they start pissing around with wheel sizes.

It’s because the roadies need something to do in the autumn after the serious racing is over and before the Christmas break. Ditto track cyclists traditionally finish their season mid August too.

*As in factory supported, pit crew, sponsorship deals worth more than free stuff and a few quid and making a living out of it? 3rd cat domestic roadies get better deals.

I have to say the medias lack of interest in reporting on XC races has to be part of the problem.

I’m not saying wholey, because BC is results driven & the percetion is track is the best option in that respect, but not reporting on XC at all? Bit of a failure there – happy to report on DH & enduro but barely a sniff of XC…

How about a monthly round up of whose done what during the season?

We aren’t all roosting the gnar in our matching enduro colourways with optional comedy facial hair…

Unfortunately the men’s race has been very boring too.

Xc just isn’t very spectator friendly.

I wonder whether it’s easier to set up a cx circuit than it is to set up a xc circuit

Having raced XC & set up CX, I’d say CX is relatively easy to set up – all you need is a sloping field & a bit of tape. XC requires either ready made trails (so someone has been busy with a shovel) or you need someone to get out there with the shovel!

The editors clearly have no idea how many people are interested in where Sagan is 😀

I don’t think it’s boring but a shorter course would generate more overtakes.

Having raced XC & set up CX, I’d say CX is relatively easy to set up – all you need is a sloping field & a bit of tape. XC requires either ready made trails (so someone has been busy with a shovel) or you need someone to get out there with the shovel!

It was rhetorical, cx is much easier to set up and much easier for many people to ride, as there’s nothing technical, so is going to be more accessible (imo).

The press would be interested if we had someone doing well at international / UCI level

We do!

I think that once british cycling get hold of any promising athletes they try and get them into track, they have done so to Shaniaze Reed from bmx, and even had rachel Atherton try out on track FFS!

They just don’t seem to grasp or understand any other element of the sport

Track & BMX are actually very closely related, it’s not a case of nicking anyone who’s half decent and saying “here’s a track, you’ll be riding this from now on”. Good way of testing riders and by the way, Shanaze has been World Champ in both BMX and track – she actually prefers track as the chances of breaking herself are considerably reduced!

The late great Jason McRoy even had a try out on track, he was easily national standard in the team sprint although admittedly back then there was much less specialisation by riders.

One of the main issues facing the current crop of Olympic potential MTBers is the serious lack of anywhere to train. Olympic and WC MTB courses are governed by the UCI and need a certain amount of climbing per lap, x amount of technical, y amount of overtaking opportunity etc, it’s all carefully controlled which is why the courses have to be man-made. They’re also way more technical than the average trail centre so you can’t just send riders to Afan and say “here you go, practice this” partly because it’s open to the public (it’d be like practising rally driving on an open road) and partly cos it in no way replicates the courses they’d be racing on.

Track training is easy – there’s one right next door to the Team GB offices…

17th For Grant

Good lad.

It doesn’t help that the British commentators don’t seem to know anything about mountain biking – comments about average speed, soft tails and aerodynamics #facepalm

At least Chris Hoy did a good commentary on the BMX races (probably because he used to race them – and mtb by the way).
Reading this about the lack of British cross country racers made me think about the earlier MOTO GP race that a Brit won for the first time since 1981 (Barry Sheene) and there’s a lot more money in that !!

It’s true BC suck a lot of riders to the track but not the only issue. If you look at when XC and DH split it seems some nations got attracted to the gravity side and others to the endurance side. Switzerland’s depth of talent in XC is massive but not so in DH then look at the UK it’s the opposite. Switzerland actually TV broadcast XCO world cups it’s a big sport there.

Finally take a look at the British team that will be going to the DH world champs it is absolutely epic and something we should be proud of. Wish it could be and Olympic sport.

It doesn’t help that the British commentators don’t seem to know anything about mountain biking – comments about average speed, soft tails and aerodynamics #facepalm

I might have been listening to different commentary as I was on the iPlayer but I was hearing a South African fella and an Australian Women, don’t know who these British commentators were, maybe you meant English speaking?

Quite enjoyed having the XC finals on in the background, they can ride for sure! Of course they are professionals, but I was still quite impressed.
Who won in the end?

Schurter won pretty comprehensively.

Re. The media, only coverage of GF coming 17th I could see was on the Daily Mail!