[Closed] When to call it a day on a bike....

What exactly is the issue with it? sounds too big for you?

Its 100% not too big its a Medium Hightower.  Im 5'9 but have a very short inside leg.  It is an incredibly long wheelbase and being blunt on the local techy trails in FOD i struggle to manoeuvre it.  Plus when getting my weight back i have been known to actually get a tyre up my arse.  Appreciate its a technique and skill thing, But i never had any of these issues on my previous 650b's

I initially found the bike completely wooden feeling almost dead.  But sorted that by changing the rear shock to an X2.  Its obviously me and not the bike, i just don't enjoy riding it at all

Put 650b+ wheels on?

IMO, if you don't like it within 4-5 rides, it's not magically going to change to loving it in a month later.

Next !

I sold Mrs Weeksys dream Yamaha R1 after just 1 days riding "I'm not getting on with it" was her critique. This then stopped her booking more track-time on it..

Bought her a ZX6R and she loves it and has booked 5 trackdays now.

Take it on a skills course and see how you get on there? Might give you some pointers on setup and technique

Not ridden one in anger but had a quick bounce on an XL and I'm 5'9" it felt comfy not huge

Plus when getting my weight back i have been known to actually get a tyre up my arse

Old school technique on steep techie descents, nothing wrong with that.

A medium hightower?  Forget it, it'll never be right for you.  I'll give you TEN ENGLISH POUNDS to take it off your hands.

Have you tried it with plus wheels?

Have you ever had a situation where you haven’t bonded with a bike?

Yes. I used to have a Giant NRS. It was fairly quick, but I never managed to get it set up so I really felt at home on it.

I persisted for about 6 months with my P7 before deciding that it was too long.

I'm 6'2 and XL was the recommended size, but as all my height is in my legs the frame just felt too long on steep tech and I was feeling like I was being tipped forward whenever I had to drop the front end over a slow step.

Got a blue pig in L now and much prefer the sizing. So, yes, if it's not working, try something else.

I was at the FOD on my Bird Aeris 145 on the weekend. Even on the freeminers extensions there were a couple of tight switchbacks I really had to work hard at to get round. Is the Hightower of the new / long / low / slack variety?

If so but the Jeffry 29er (assuming hats what you had) was better you might find it’s not necessarily wheel size but a geometry thing. I believe the Jeffsy 29er isn’t as uptodate as a lot of bikes so might have been shorter / less slack and that’s why you got on with it.

Change of technique via coaching might be your cheapest first option. Since moving from a trail bike with around a 69 degree headangle and normal for 5 years ago wheelbase to the Aeris with a 65 ish headangle and looong wheelbase I’ve had to change how I ride.

You need to be more aggressive leaning the bike over into corners and you generally don’t get off the back as much - you need your weight more forward over the front wheel - then when you combine that with the lean it rips round corners. Just needs a different approach.

If it were me I’d try that first - a coaching day on corners / steep technical riding and see if you can reprogramme yourself.

If you can’t I’d go for something more conservative in both wheelbase and head angle as my next bike.

Yes, a Transition Smuggler. Everyone says they are brilliant and I'm sure they're right, but I just never got on with mine for some reason. Never quite worked out why, but it doesn't really matter. Life's too short. Sold it to another forum member who hopefully loved it and have just bought a FlareMax, which makes no sense on paper but works for me.The Hightower is a great bike, just not the right one for you by the sound of it.

<span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: #222222; font-family: 'Open Sans'; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 22.4px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;">It is an incredibly long wheelbase and being blunt on the local techy trails in FOD i struggle to manoeuvre it.</span>

It really isn't, it's actually pretty short, given the newer school design of long bikes. Even by standards of a few years ago, it's certainly not long at 1165mm.

I'd be amazed if it's a wheel size issue, plenty of people ride 29ers at your height.

It's probably more of an issue of just not getting on with a bike. I did this before my current. I spent about 9 months forcing myself to ride a Transition Patrol Carbon. On paper, it was pretty similar to the Reign I came off, yet it rode very differently. I was noticeably slower, and had to work noticeably harder to keep it rubber side up. Don't know what it was, but I got f*cked off with it, so sold it. In hindsight, I wouldn't persevere that long again.

Life's too short to ride a shit bike, or one you don't get on with.

I know I ride similar trails around FOD to you Russ and I don't find my Aeris too long or slack, and it's longer and slacker than a Hightower. In fact if it was shorter and steeper and I'd not want to ride all the FOD steep trails on it, but that's my lack of skills/confidence. Nor do I catch my ass on the rear tyre riding the steep stuff, but it isn't 29 and I don't hang that far back (result of skills coaching with Katy). Not gelling with the bike could be riding style or just preference. Either way I'd have been making the most of the demo days that have been on at FOD lately to try as many bikes as possible to find what feels right for you and what doesn't. Cotic are there on 23rd, so there's two 29'ers to try, assuming you're still keen on 29, and if not try the 27.5 bikes.

You might want to actually figure out what doesn't work for you.  Then you will know if its something you can change on the bike (tyres, wheels, shock, bars, stem etc.) of something you can change in yourself (riding style).

I've a Jeffsy 29'er and a Capra 650b, both different and both very capable.  There are subtle differences in how I ride them, but it only takes a few minutes to adjust.  Bars, controls and all touch points are set the same.

Once you figure out why it doesn't suit you, you may then avoid that mistake with your next bike, assuming you cant fix the current one.

I was initially disappointed with my orange segment but had no choice but to stick with it. Gradually chipped away at what I thought was wrong and have ended up really enjoying it.

I changed:

Increased fork travel

Offset bushes

Wider bars

Longer stem

Longer dropper

Spent a year on a 516 Spicy, I’d ride it and wouldn’t like it, look at the reviews which said it was the best thing ever and assume I was just bad at it. Continued until someone knicked it. Replacement was an older, lower spec 316, immediately went faster everywhere. Spec looked good on paper but the fork damper was shit and the wheels too light and XC like for an Enduro type bike.

+1 for adjusting your riding style a bit. I ride a geometron which is way longer than a hightower, and have no problems on tight stuff. It did take me a while to adjust to it though, and I still have to remind myself occasionally.

Big 29ers require you to weight the front, and use the bars, to almost force the bike where to go, and the back kind of follows. Try putting some stupidly wide bars on it, might pull you forward, and help with a bit more leverage.

So I have adjusted my riding style. But I never had these kind of issues on my old 650b bikes.

I have ridden and owned much slacker and longer.  My HT is running 160 forks so it’s pretty slack at about 65.5deg.

I have tried plus wheels and to be honest I’m sure it works for those of you who like it but I found that hateful!  Just not good at anything really!

@joe....there is nothing I would struggle with on the HT around freeminers! I’m talking off piste stuff up mallards pike or Staunton.  Which is pretty far removed from trail centre stuff at FOD.

Ultimately I would’ve binned the bike off ages ago if it hadn’t been my absolute dream bike.  Sounds like I need to give it another month.

or buy myself a second hand Banshee spitfire to remind myself how great that bike was!

Yep, several! First was a 456C, rode a mates and thought it would be great, bought one, built it up and within a few weeks was wondering why. Never have I ridden a bike that rode so harshly yet transferred so little power into forward motion. Geometry was good for the time, but it felt like riding a lump of wood.

My Foxy was a case of gradually falling out of love over an 18 month period. First rides were awesome, then it started to fall apart, then I realised it was just way too much bike and needed to be ridden 100% all of the time by a rider far, far more skilled and brave than I. Just as the bike felt like it was starting to sing, my mind just couldn't keep up with what was going on.

My T130 is great, it's not the fastest bike I've ever owned (the foxy easily takes that crown, both up and down), it's not the lightest but it works brilliantly, has been super reliable to date, toes a great line between fast and fun and has never felt out of it's depth or felt like too much bike. Working in the trade I got a stonking deal on it too, it will take something exceptional in all areas, ride, reliability and value, to prize it from me.

Yeah, sort of. I bought a Klein Palomino years ago which was a properly horrid bike. The geometry and proportions were weird and the monolink bushings last about two rides before self destructing. That said, sometimes small changes make significant differences. Stuff like a shorter stem, flatter, lower rise bars, wider/narrower bars, a shorter fork different tyres etc.

And then there's personal preference. I had a day out on a Trek Full Stache recently and while it was astonishingly capable in a 'I can roll over everything without you even noticing' sort of way, it not a bike I'd ever want to own. It was sort of too good for a habitual hardtail rider who actually likes to be able to feel what the tyres are doing.

But given that you seem to be talking about it feel too tall for you, I think, I'd be tempted to try tweaking the cockpit so the front end feels a little lower and shorter, which will also put a little more weight on the front wheel. Worth trying that sort of thing given that it's not going to cost you that much to do.

Another thing worth considering. I got my local bike shop to build a Tranny Smuggler last year. On paper it should have been amazing. Just couldn't get on with it, felt slow up hill and just sort of dead riding. Put the bike to one side for a while, and road my lighter hardtail, in the meantime I lost 2 stone. Well  suddenly the Smuggler is everything I could have wanted, its brilliant.True story and everything.

Not suggesting the Op needs to lose a few pounds but I would say its not always about the bike fatty.

Interestingly I have lost 5kg recently!  Not saying the bike is hard work to ride either!  Just feels dead a bit meh!

As mentioned above.. is the front end too tall? Have you tried it with a 140mm fork (as designed) and, if so, have you dropped the cockpit to compensate for the extra height from the 160mm fork?

I love my HT (I'm about 5'6" on a medium) but I definitely find you have to 'hunker down' over the bars to get the best out of it. I occasionally find myself sat on the back wheel but think it's mainly because I'm pushing to far back.. longer bike has it's centre further forward.

On the other hand.. maybe it just doesn't suit you..

I'm 5'10" but short legs....

Some makes (across the range from HT XC to Enduro) I've never got along with... though i perhaps didn't realise that at the time.

I still have a Giant XtC and hired a Reign... amazing how the bits that felt wrong transferred...

I'm sure both are cracking bikes... just not for me.

I ride the fod off-piste most weeks and love it on my XL s-150, which is an enormous bike.

However riding a 29er does take a while to get used to, I progressively lowered the front end around 20mm until I felt I could weight the front wheel well, and you need to change your line choices, looking to take outside lines and getting braking done before corners and then carrying speed through. It also needs more deliberate weighting on the front end but this is something that becomes a reflex after time.

I'd say stick with it, but don't try to ride it like a 27.5 bike.

Get another bike.

I'm going through almost exactly the same issue with a bike I bought in March. The handling characteristics are very different to previous bikes and I simply don't trust the bike on techy stuff because I can't predict how it will react.

All sorts of suggestions about changing / customising the suspension / different wheels / different dropper. By the time you spend the money on all the changes you could probably just sell the thing and get a bike that suits you more.

Don't let a bike you're not getting on with stop you from riding. It can sap your mojo.

I had a quick ride on a mates Hightower a year or so back ..( he is a Santa Cruz dealer) I thought it handled like a barge..and that was after one section of tight singletrack ..mind you I could say that of every 29'er I have ridden ..but that's probably down to my lack of skill rather than the bikes ..

If it's not working ..move on ..

Get the tape measure out and check out the differences in key measurements (saddle height/reach).

You'd ideally want these similar.

I have three road bikes that are all set up as close as possible (within mm) of each other - they ride differently, but are close in feel. Simple stuff like tyres can make a big difference.

I have a 90's rigid MTB and a 650b full suspension - both very different, but both ride fine - both similar speed at XC and uphill, but the FS is way better down. The FS is a big bike compared to the 90's bike - massive in fact.

Other reason is you might not have enough 'hours' in the saddle to get used to it. You may be so familiar with the older bike, this new one just feels weird.

Your riding it in areas of FoD that are pretty taxing for most riders and bikes.  Personally Id only use my Capra on those trails, not my Jeffsy 29'er.

So perhaps its actually the wrong bike for those sort of trails.  If your happy ragging round the areas you mention then I would suspect your a handy rider.  Therefore get a bike that's more suited to those trails.  Something more Enduro 'ish.

My Jeffsy is pretty bloody good, but the Capra is better for off piste in the FoD.  Whereas for chasing my mates round the FoD trail centre Id take the Jeffsy.

Other posters are right about weighting the front on the 29'er.  But perhaps its just not the bike for the area your riding.

Interesting... see, I'm one of those people (or might be the only one!) who mocks when people talk about tiny nuances of bikes  that they can feel (flex in cranks! flex in stems! bars too narrow! (etc)) cos I get on a bike, and as long as the saddle is comfortable, I like riding them. I've demo'ed shit loads of bikes over the years and obviously some have felt better than others, but I can only recall one single bike that I've returned thinking ugh! thats gash! (a Charge somethingorother).

Recently demoed a Plus bike (hence me posting after OP says he hated Plus) - I thought it was bloody amazing.. wanted one! The last bike I rode was a 650B carbon hardtail.. bloody amazing.. wanted one! I ride a med travel 29er as my main bike and it does everything I want of it beautifully. Apart from climbing maybe, but then I think thats just cos I'm not as fit as I used to be.

So, er, I don't know what I conclude, apart from its weird how some people can be so fussy 😀

Speaking as someone who loves 29ers, it sounds like:

1) It's longer than you're used to - you can get used to that but maybe something less on trend would suit you better (I certainly have a thing for short back ends regardless of all else).

2) If the big wheel at the back is getting in your way when manoevring, I can certainly sympathise. At 6' I occasionally rub shorts on the back wheel with 29ers when I'm really throwing shapes, which never really used to happen on 26ers, I can see how if I was a touch shorter a 29er could get in the way. A 79er would be the ideal but few places make bikes with different size wheels, a smaller wheel is really the only way around this.

I guess the thing is that most bikes these days are pretty good, mid range upwards particularly so, having niggles like that isn't something you have to live with, it just means your dream bike wasn't as good for you as your last bike. Also with it being your dream bike you're bound to be more fussy. Work out how much of each it is, and proceed accordingly!

Some interesting posts here.  I agree with most of whats said, but for reference i should point out that i have been riding 29er trail/Enduro's for the last 12 months.  I get the weighting the front wheel and am happy with my technique from that regard.  I'm no riding god..far from it, but can get a bike down a pretty technical trail normally.

The Jeffsy certainly felt more nimble than my Hightower, Even though they are fairly similar in terms of their travel.  Maybe its just a case of meeting your hero and i was expecting so much more from this expensive inanimate lump of carbon, kind of a reverse placebo effect.  Maybe i'm one of those weirdos always searching for perfection as a reason to justify lack of ability.  Who knows?  What I do know is I'm enjoying riding less since my HT purchase!  The only time i have walked away from it grinning ear to ear was on our recent lads trip to Inners and Golfie!  The bike was awesome there...God knows, however the wife is likely to start orbiting the moon when i broach the subject of changing bikes again to her.

Get rid!

I sold my Stumpy 29er 2014 and bought a new 2017 Orange 5 - expected it to be like my old 2012 model but more refined - it wasn't.....long, low, slack etc and felt like I was peddling through porridge; not the Lakes bashing machine I needed.

Got to the point where I couldn't be bothered riding but knew how much money I'd lose if I sold it so carried on as long as I could.

Just got rid of it and gone back to a 2017 Stumpy 29er - instantly felt back at home:)  Suppose some people just suit certain bikes better.

Aye, if it's not working for you, there's only so much you can try.

I came from a 29er Spectral to my current Bronson V2,  there is nothing, absolutely nothing that my 29er was better at that than my Bronson, faster up and down, stabler at speed, accelerates quicker, it's just a million miles better - mind you, it was double the price, so it should be.

There's far more to a bike than wheelsize, despite what the evangelists of any wheelsize tell you.

Get another bike 🙂 I sold my Rocket because it was too long and too baggy for the stuff I like doing, bought a (shorter) old shape BFe and bunged shorter forks in it and started having fun again 🙂

The only time i have walked away from it grinning ear to ear was on our recent lads trip to Inners and Golfie!

This bit perked my ears up though, so for those of us who've never rode FoD, what's it like? a bit tame compared to Tweed Valley stuff?....

yes it's tame in comparison, apart from a few terrifyingly steep chutes at Mallard's Pike.  The rest of it was fairly standard, not particularly steep, just rooty, swoopy fun.

This bit perked my ears up though, so for those of us who’ve never rode FoD, what’s it like? a bit tame compared to Tweed Valley stuff?….

Its different!  Certainly not tame, but that depends what you are riding at Fod (likewise Tweed valley i guess) Our off piste trails at FOD are much, much shorter as we don't have "proper" hills.  But there is some proper steep sketchy stuff, on a level with what i have seen in Tweed!  The trails at Staunton/Biblins are in my opinion the best and most challenging with Staple edge (Mallards pike whatever you want to call it) offering some really good stuff also.  The FoD is very natural and tight in places (hence why i think I struggle with my current bike there)  If i had a choice of the two i would pick the tweed valley!  But then that's because its new to me every-time i head up there.  It was also super dry and dusty when were were there earlier this month which meant it was unbelievable.

I will say if you are planning on riding FoD then team up with a local group or a descent guide to show you some off piste stuff well away from the trail centre and do some research.  You could easily spend a great weekend there and never ride the same trails twice.

yes it’s tame in comparison, apart from a few terrifyingly steep chutes at Mallard’s Pike.  The rest of it was fairly standard, not particularly steep, just rooty, swoopy fun.

There are steeper trails than Mallards pike, as Russ has alluded to. Technical too, not just steep chutes. Lots of rooty swoopy fun too. I like the contrast, makes for good riding.

Yes there are!  Even more terrifying when your pathetic little legs mean your ass an balls get torn to shreds by the back wheel of your 29er....ha ha

I stemhumped on the one with the mental compression and bumbuzzed on another.  I love my LT 29er, but it is taking me a bit longer to develop full committment on the super steep stuff.  For everything else though, it's amazing.

Hypothetically, if you were to sell the hightower, how much would you be looking for?

Riklegge, send me a PM buddy.  I wasn't trying to create a stealth ad!  Happy to talk