Moved home a few weeks ago and this has been happening ever since. Now doing my head in. Here’s the set up:

1 x non NTE5 box downstairs (let’s call it A) with router and phone master base attached via filter
1 x extension downstairs (call it B)
1 x extension upstairs

Router works fine when running off socket A, but as soon as we use any of our phones to make or receive a call, the broadband cuts off. Comes back on only after the call.

Doesn’t matter what combo of sockets, micro-filters and phones we try, the same thing happens.

Have tried four filters, one of which reduces broadband by half, so I assume that one’s knackered.

BT checker comes up with no faults. Have gone through online fault finder and it makes out equipment is at fault. But how is that the case if the phone(s) make calls and the router works, albeit not at the same time. Can’t have all four filters suddenly stop working.

Any ideas? Ta

What’s this “non NTE5” business? Is it a pre-NTE5 master or something else?

Disconnect everything non-essential (ie, extensions) and retry.

How are the extensions connected?

New installation or did it work before and has stopped? Sorry, just re-read that you’ve moved house, ignore that.

You know you need a filter before every device, yes? Ie, on the extensions as well as the master?

By non-NTE5 I mean a standard socket (but with BT logo and PCS labelling). No test socket behind the plate.

Feed comes into a junction box then splits 3 ways (star wiring?). I think this means neither socket is a master.

Have done the disconnect > reconnect devices one by one already. If I run the phone of its master base then it’s fine. But as soon as the router is fired up then the phone(s) can make/receive calls but the BB drops.

PITA.

😯 Tell me about this junction box. Is it a little lozenge shaped thing with “GPO” on it? A photo might help.

There should be something which demarks your wiring from BT’s. Are you certain there’s nothing else before the junction?

Piccy

This receives the feed from the telegraph pole … then splits it 3 ways (2 downstairs and 1 upstairs). Nothing else before the junction.

Gods, that’s horrific.

I’d be getting BT out to have that torn out and install a master line box if I were you. Then I’d fit an ADSLnation faceplate, and rung the extensions (if still required) from the filtered side.

https://community.bt.com/t5/Bills-Packages/How-do-I-get-an-NTE5/td-p/24146

The price to convert a hardwired socket to an NTE is £25.00 (exc VAT) £29.38 (inc VAT) no visit charge for the engineer is applicable. There are however some circumstances where BT will carry out this work free, [if you’re on benefits or disabled].

I’d pay £30 with joy in my heart and a spring in my step rather than have to get modern ADSL speeds working reliably over that j-box + extension combination.

Hmm, interesting find their Cougar. Ta v m. Am trying to find out some history from the previous owners with a view to getting onto BT. Not surprised their engineer didn’t comment on it when he first investigated days after moving in (and found nothing wrong).

Cheers

I had the same problem. It was unsolvable. So I abandoned the home phone.

Same problem as in junction box > star wiring > no master = phone cuts out BB?

Or same outcome but with different kit?

Did you ask BT to resolve it?

If that junction box is before the NTE-5, I’m *fairly* sure it’s still Openreach’s responsibility (their line of demarcation being the socket in the NTE-5.

I’d harangue Openreach (via your ISP) to get that mess sorted out.

Is it possible that one of your ADSL filters is damaged? I’ve seen similar problems in the past.

FWIW we have one of these antiques on the front of our house, with three extensions coming in.

Our approach to fixing the problem is to have phone/filter/router on one extension (as it happens, the one nearset the jurassic era junction box), and to never, ever, use the other two extensions. for anything.

Or, Cougars post about getting a pukka master and hanging the extensions from it.

I’d harangue Openreach (via your ISP) to get that mess sorted out.

and the very best of luck to you

Twitter @BTCare for advice they respond very quickly, twice they’ve even offered advice and help just picking up on me random twitting about BT without evening mentioning their twitter name.

and the very best of luck to you

Indeed. Will be much better when ISPs work out how to do without Openreach.

That star internal wiring WILL be causing you issues.. get onto your service provider and say they should have sorted out an nte5 when you ordered the line.

As a bit of diagnostics.. is your line crackly? Buzzy? Does your phone ring once and then stop.. but theres still someone there?

any damp around the sockets?

any yes’s here means your adsl will be suffering.

Indeed. Will be much better when ISPs work out how to do without Openreach.

..when isps figure out how to do without Openreach your broadband will no longer be amongst the cheapest in the developed world.

Hmm, more interesant.

As a bit of diagnostics.. is your line crackly? Buzzy? Does your phone ring once and then stop.. but theres still someone there?

any damp around the sockets?

Yes, the line can be crackly/buzzy. I even rang my mobile on it earlier, put the land line down but my mobile kept ringing for about another 20 seconds. Odd.

Can’t see any damp.

Our approach to fixing the problem is to have phone/filter/router on one extension (as it happens, the one nearset the jurassic era junction box), and to never, ever, use the other two extensions. for anything.

That’s what we’ve been doing, except when testing other ideas. But even with the phone base and router sharing a filter on the main socket we still get the BB drop.

Twitter @BTCare for advice they respond very quickly,

I’ll tweet them now and report back on my findings.

Ta

Consider yourself lucky, mine drops out without the phone even ringing, I put it down to the generally peepoor service we get anyway, recently it got to 300k in the evening. Dial up seems like a not so distant memory. I am very much looking forward to the alleged faster speeds we will be getting at the end of the year, please fibre, come to my village!

new filters solved it on ours.

..when isps figure out how to do without Openreach your broadband will no longer be amongst the cheapest in the developed world.

Only it will. By far the largest cost to ISPs is Openreach. And don;t forget that BT’s emphasis on copper means that, as a nation, we’re getting rapidly left behind.

Question: should all extensions have a microfilter attached even if they’re not connected to a phone?

Interesting read this, just moved property and have similar issues, its an old property so will have to check out the cabling.

From what i understand though you should only have 1 microfilter on an extension and it should be located at the broadband end, so the filter is after the extension if that makes sense, i’m not sure why or if it makes a difference but maybe thats your problem?

Ah.

Yes, the line can be crackly/buzzy.

Forget ADSL for the minute. Ring BT, tell them your line is crackly and they need to come sort it.

From what i understand though you should only have 1 microfilter on an extension and it should be located at the broadband end, so the filter is after the extension if that makes sense, i’m not sure why or if it makes a difference but maybe thats your problem?

Forget sockets, every device needs to be behind one and only one filter. Every time you plug something in, think “is this filtered?”

Typically, you’d just plug a microfilter into every socket and be done with it. What I’d do is filter it at the master socket and run the extensions from the phone half of that filter, so you’re only piping a filtered signal around the house and not the ADSL signal.

Actually, what I’d do is tear out all the extensions and just stick secondary DECT cordless handsets about the place instead. Hard to see why you’d actually need extension sockets for in this day and age, they’re more trouble than they’re worth.

Hard to see why you’d actually need extension sockets for in this day and age, they’re more trouble than they’re worth.

Agreed. Hence why I’m doubly confused as to why we’re having problems given we’re filtering both router and (main) phone base from a single source. It’s not like we’re having to patch additional base units into each extension, thus causing more room for faults.

Ring BT, tell them your line is crackly and they need to come sort it.

The noise is really only apparent before connecting. Whilst call quality isn’t exactly great at times, it’s not really that bad either.

Besides, I’ve already logged this before with them and each test comes up with nothing wrong “outside the house”. Oddly they did actually send an engineer round even though I said I wasn’t prepared to pay the callout fee should it be a fault “my side”. He had a snoop round, said he’d found a faulty “dis” connection up the road and it was job done. But the fault was back within a day.

I’m loathe to pay a callout as I’m not trusting anyone from BT right now.

For minimum hassle, I’d get myself an IDC tool, remove the BT78 (the white box by the window) and fit your NTE (the one with the yellow capacitor) in its place.

Temporarily relocate the router and phone to this location, try all your filters and see if you’ve rectified the fault. Once happy, reconnect your extensions, but not in a star fashion. They should be daisy chained.

If you get Openreach round and manage to avoid the charge, this is all they will do…the difference being you’ll get a modern socket but it makes no difference if you leave your extensions disconnected. The latest ones do additional filtering to help DSL work over low quality customer owned extensions.

spacemonkey – Member Question:

should all extensions have a microfilter attached even if they’re not connected to a phone?

Microfilters required only if something is connected to the socket. (sky tv for example)

I’ve read through all the posts I know its not helpful but it was a filter issue for me. I just purchased three new ones after some head scratching and it fixed it.

Find the diagrams online then don’t, whatever you do, rewire the socket properly onto a proper master socket. I never. Because it’s naughty.

Yes, definitely do not remove the junction box yourself, absolutely do not wire on a new master socket, and whatever you do, do not sort out the extensions into a normal daisy chain arrangement.

We’re certainly not planning on doing that at any point ever.

If you report the fault as a noisy line, its likely that if they come to the house they will replace the junction box with a new NTE5 socket to bring it up to the latest spec. They shouldn’t charge for this. When the engineer arrives talk to him, make him a cup of tea and explain what issues you are experiencing and before he goes ask him what he did and what problems he found and was able to fix them? Ask specifically if any of the work will be chargeable and after he’s gone, write some notes up.
The main problem I have with BT faults is most of my customers just point the engineer to their socket and let him get on with it.
I’ve also heard tell that Openreach engineers are under pressure to book as many faults as possible as “no fault found” or “customer equipment / wiring faults”, even when they aren’t at fault, so that the cost of the engineer can be booked to the customer. If they don’t then they have a “please explain” with their manager.

mrmonkfinger – Member

Yes, definitely do not remove the junction box yourself, absolutely do not wire on a new master socket, and whatever you do, do not sort out the extensions into a normal daisy chain arrangement.

We’re certainly not planning on doing that at any point ever.
Probably the best idea is to do it yourself. Its not complicated and theres plenty of info on the internet about NTE and extension wiring.

HERE
AND HERE

Well, the phone line is well and truly down now; can’t make or receive calls at all. Ringing out provides a dial tone but never actually connects. Ringing in does the same (home phone never actually rings).

BT tracker says they’re already on the case, so this might be them testing some stuff re my Twitter conversation last night. Hopefully a nice little engineer will pop along shortly and enthusiastically sort it out in exchange for tea or coffee 🙂

When we had a problem the nice little man from BT turned up and replaced everything from the ancient junction box (like yours) all the way to the otherside of the street via a couple of poles! There is no way it all suddenly failed but it looked a bit corroded so he thought he would replace it while he was here.
All the time drinking tea and telling me ‘version 3 of the Home hub is my personal favourite but the others have merit too…’ – and people call me geeky? 🙂