The reason you see damage from sudden rain is because the vegetation has been damaged leading to run-off that takes the soil away.

I really do wish you’d confine your comments to places you know TJ. The incidents I refer to are on ancient roads surrounded by well established fellside vegetation. I’ve seen 5 foot deep trenches cut overnight by rain

So why has it not happened in the past? Something has happened to allow the runoff to rip the soil away. If its an ancient structure something must have changed otherwise it would have happened before. Very simple. It might have been further up the hill, it might have been a change in the structure but something has changed for this to occur

I wish you would show some concern for the effects you have. You may be right in this particular case but you refuse to acknowledge that your actions can be detrimental in any way – both in persistent refusal to stick within the laws about access and in persistent refusal to accept that you can and will cause erosion.

Simon – your attitudes appall many of us – I just am prepared to speak out about it.

People who don’t consider the whole group when riding.

People who pop into Tesco/Spar/Sainsbury/Greggs rather than a independent local shop selling the same stuff.

So why has it not happened in the past?

for all I know it may happen every decade

I wish you would show some concern for the effects you have

and how do you know it’s got anything to do with me, or any other bikers for that matter ?

but you refuse to acknowledge that your actions can be detrimental in any way

most of the places where we ride are much the same now as when I started 13 years ago. As I said above, by far the worst erosion has been by sudden rain. Also, for instance on Walna Scar, erosion has removed ill thought out sanitisation to return the track to its former exciting condition (bedrock with boulders)

I just am prepared to speak out about it

from a position of deep ignorance:o)

You’re a strange bunch you mtb’ers. I think your foibles and insecurities come from the fact that cycling isn’t really a team sport. I would/will have a lot of fun with those of you that take yourselves far too seriously.

I think your foibles and insecurities come from the fact that cycling isn’t really a team sport

do you mean ‘competitive team sport’ ? When I go out for a ride, I think of us as all in a kind of team together.

Not to elbow in on someone else’s argument. But prolonged periods of rain generally cause much higher degrees of damage than sudden down pours.

I usually acknowledge other riders when possible and a polite return is nice and vice versa but I really hate it when I get blanked or stared at as much as someone who had just raped their dog or something.
**** off you miserable bastrds.

On my local fell used by large groups of mountain bikers, I have seen the damage, complete mess caused by riders in large numbers avoiding the correct path and either seeking ‘new rad’ lines, avoiding the mud or cutting corners. Some of the paths are now non useable to anyone be they bridleways, footpaths or cheeky trails, 20 riders or so in one group create havoc on some terrain, sorry but you are wrong Simon on most terrain has altered in the last 13 years, look at Longridge fell, altered massively in the last 3 years alone, riders cutting the trail in large numbers is not good. The thread was about what annoys you about mountain bikers, this is my bete noir, the ignorance of the damage that can be caused by large groups riding inplaces where the damage will not repair easily.

People who get in their car to drive to somewhere to ride when there’s plenty good riding on their doorstep, they just can’t be bothered with a few miles of road riding to get there.
People who spend all weekend riding their £2 grand bikes then get in the car to go to work monday to friday when its only a few miles away.
I think more people need to become “cyclists” rather than just “mountain bikers”, and realise that they can use their bikes to do really useful things as well as for fun, save time and money and help out the planet as well.

SFB you’ll have to make sure the group you ride with are all in a nice line just like a road biking club… 🙂

sorry but you are wrong Simon on most terrain has altered in the last 13 years, look at Longridge fell, altered massively in the last 3 years alone, riders cutting the trail in large numbers is not good

I’m talking about the places I ride, not everywhere else I cannot see. As for Longridge, I’ve been riding there for about 5 years. The only change I’ve noticed is the gully below Green Thorn which has widened from 12″ to 8′, but this is at right angles the the passage of bikes, so I think this is the effect of rain. I’ve also noticed devastation caused by felling.

SFB – You are the devil, I really don’t know how you sleep at night. Riding in large groups is equivalent to genocide or abusing small kids. Are you responsible for swine flu as well?

The bitching and soap box’s that seem to be on MTB forums in general…. Yes My bike, opinion and knowledge of Mountain biking is better than yours…. Oh and if you want Chocolate cake and tea after your ride.. There’s a queue dont jump it!

quote]I’m talking about the places I ride, not everywhere else I cannot see[/quote]
Simon, that why I chose Longridge fell not loads of people in the pics granted but this part of the fell has got loads worse due to large numbers of rider

jan

apr
[

sorry Simon but it is just irresponsible riding neither good for the fell or for mtbrs generally.
I do think people should be able to ride in a large organised groups but responsibly and with some respect for longevity of the surroundings.
Green thorn is that not a footpath? I admit to using it, Regardless opposite the farm the track to the left is now a quagmire due to overuse by bikers.
[/quote]I’ve also noticed devastation caused by felling.

ahh yes management of the natural habitat, where has that had an ill effect on the fell?

Thank you hicksville –

Simon – as for the effect of rain – generally its damage to the vegetation from bikes, walkers and animals that means that water runoff rips the soil away. Without that vegitation damage the water runnof does not rip the soil away. Water damage does not happen in isolation – otherwise tehre would be no soil in those places

I am not suggesting you should stop taking the groups out – I think that is a positive thing – just think about the damage that can occur and figure that into your route planning.

Cunning use of my pics 🙂 But that bit changes with the weather, sometimes dry, sometimes wet and muddy. It doesn’t get worse on average. The very worst part on Longridge is The Magic Porridge Pot, which is a BW.

Regardless opposite the farm the track to the left is now a quagmire due to overuse by bikers.

The section by Green Thorn has always been a mud wallow since I first rode it, though sometimes it almost dries out.

ahh yes management of the natural habitat, where has that had an ill effect on the fell?

Well, apart from looking awful, the trails have been ripped up by 2′ wide tyres 🙁 But it’s a plantation, so ‘natural’ is stretching it.

Without that vegitation damage the water runnof does not rip the soil away.

yes, you keep saying this, but in the places I’m seeing erosion the vegetation is undisturbed

Surely it’s not exclusively large groups of riders causing the damage though, but an increase in numbers generally. I’m not really sure how you could stop this. With reference to the farm track, is it not possible that the damage could be caused by farm machinery? In the woods near me some of the tracks are churned up by logging vehicles. I tend to avoid these until they have recovered a bit, mainly as they’re no fun to ride in that state.

If someone were to continue bending my ear I would just say “Please stop talking to me, I’m not interested”. But usually just ignoring them works fine.

Penny dropping sound 😥

Simon,pictures tell a thousand words 😀

places I’m seeing erosion the vegetation is undisturbed

see the pics above that bit in the pic very rarely dries out now, the pathe has widen massively…..I have ridden the fell for 15 years in that time seen it change dramatically and have been appalled by the damage in the last 3 years. If there are quagmires do not ride it…..let the plant grow back, let it dry out and replenish. Green thorn was not a mud wallow it has become onedue to the large groups using it.
Good luck to clubs and organised rides as long as they show respect to the environment, other riders, and understand the impact they/we have on the paths and the countryside. 🙂

Not large groups Hicksville, large numbers. People just like you…

Simon,pictures tell a thousand words

but the last time I was at the place in those photos (about 3 weeks ago) the mud had dried up!

edit – its no point continuing is it

its no point continuing is it

well, I don’t mind a bit of mud, I’m a mountain biker :o)

SFB, it seems you had better stop riding all together – otherwise there will be no lakeland at all in years to come! What tripe! I wonder if the ancient cumbrians protested when the romans constructed high street, even after the industrialisation of the lakes – the old quarry trails that litter the fells don’t seem to of had a detrimental effect to the long term flora and fauna.

SFB, it seems you had better stop riding all together

but in fact I shall carry on as usual, on tracks which are largely unchanged over the years

As said above, people who skid, widen trails by going round hard bits or shallow puddles, and moan about not being able to ride a section that someone else will clean easily. Basically riders who don’t consider how the trail they’re riding got there, and that someone might be going out of their way to fix and improve it for them. Might not apply to riders in Scotland or the Peaks, but certainly applies in places like Cannock and Bristol.

edit – its no point continuing is it

TJ lost for words – is this a first ?

Those who, at the mere mention of Llandegla in a subject title on here, have to be first to use the words ‘tarmac, bmx, shite, Glentress is better’ in their replies.

Bikers who when they first meet you say with a mutual friend, tell you how great they are and list all the places they have ridden.

and list all the places they have ridden

isn’t this just ‘biking related conversation’ ?

Those who complain about walker while illegal riding on footpaths. Even if said walker pushes them off.

while illegal riding on footpaths

it’s not illegal, it’s a tort, whereas assault is a criminal offence

Mud Nazis 😆

simonfbarnes – however you view it you and the bogmakers with you are selfish in your use of trails. You do not consider those that may want to come after you only your ride that day. You have thatcherite view of bike rides, “theres no such thing as other mtbers”.

You do not consider those that may want to come after you only your ride that day

correct, I’m only responsible for me and mine. But I usually take the time to converse with or at least say hello to other trail users and the response is overwhelmingly positive

… and you shouldn’t confuse my abrasive style with that of the club’s other members, who are all nicer and more friendly than me

TJ lost for words – is this a first ?

No – just given up talking to someone who wont listen.

simonfbarnes – Thatchers child.

I try and ignore him, seems to be the easiest policy.

He confuses making up his own mind with refusal to accept that anyone else has a valid point of view.

He claims to love discussion, but you cant discuss from a fixed viewpoint, you can only pontificate.

It’s hard to ignore him and the his boggy crew due to the damage that they do. He’s an enviromental distaster.