The meaning of Woke

Pretending you find Rosie Jones amusing

I had a conversation with him recently where he said he sees the world as very black and white – not the colour of skin but things are right or wrong; good or bad. I genuinely mistook what he was saying and thought he was admitting a failure. But he didn’t see it as that, this is a character trait he wears with honour. It’s something he is proud of.

Have you not been on any of the political threads?

“Woke” is an antonym of “thick racist”.

Anyone watch the Paris Olympics able to explain why TF I’m seeing so many “woke virus” comments on social media?

Mostly using a photo of what appears to be a questionable representation of Dionysus.

No idea, I fail to see how a metal band belting out some dirty riffs with excessive pyro with dancing headless effigies of Mary Antoinette is woke. It’s metal as f***.

People are just c***s.  Which is a far better descriptor of turd like behaviour. No matter your political allegiance.

I’d probably say that angrily calling literally anyone that gets tired of hand wringing liberal pc nonsense a ‘thick racist’ probably epitomises the sort of person that I’d define as Woke

Hand wringing liberal pc nonsense…. excellent almost a full house on the gammon bingo card there.

Proudly woke here, not least because it really winds the ‘common sense’ brigade up.

Haha, and we wonder why society is divided.

The way its used pejoratively makes it very difficult to understand what the people using it actually mean

To be fair, the people who use “woke” pejoratively are difficult to understand on a good day anyway. If they want to live here they really should make an effort to learn the language.

I would happily admit to being accused of being ‘woke’, I’ve spent my life doing my best not to be an asshole to other people, especially people who work in the service and retail industries, and getting a smile in return seems to indicate my ‘wokeness’ is appreciated.

I revel in being an asshole towards people who really desperately need an asshole in their lives. But I’d never do it based on skin colour or job role or sexual proclivity or any other demographic, rather I feel quite strongly that some people’s bullshit shouldn’t go unchallenged. It’ll get me hurt one day.

<woke virtue signalling> When I worked in an office, I made a point of knowing the names of all the cleaners who came in at close of business. That felt important. Discussing with co-workers, they’d refer to an individual as “the tall one,” I’d say “oh, you mean Elaine?” and they’d look at me like I was Derren Brown. </woke virtue signalling>

Pretending you find Rosie Jones amusing

She’s hilarious.

I fail to see how a metal band belting out some dirty riffs with excessive pyro

Gojira.

I’d probably say that angrily calling literally anyone that gets tired of hand wringing liberal pc nonsense a ‘thick racist’ probably epitomises the sort of person that I’d define as Woke

There’s probably a reasonable hit rate given that “woke” is inextricably linked with racial sensitivity, that’s literally what it means.  If you’re anti-woke then you are ipso facto racist.  And racists aren’t generally famed for their intellectual might.

Conversely, thick racists are almost universally tired of “hand wringing liberal pc nonsense.” Makes you think.

(It probably doesn’t, but never give up hope.)

I agree with comments above that when used pejoratively it is equivalent to what would have been “virtue signalling” in 2019. But I doubt that many who use it pejoratively are aware of its origins, so I would hesitate to describe them as ipso facto racist. One of the sick things about our language is that words evolve in their meaning (for good or ill).

I think being anti anti-woke is veering off course from being woke.

One of the sick things about our language is that words evolve in their meaning (for good or ill).

Nicely done.

Should I sneer at the self-declared woke like I do the self-declared foodies?

Do they also give themselves nicknames instead of  being assigned by their friends?

Are they more or less intolerable than the anti-woke?

The rules are so unclear.

Should you sneer? Probably not, no, if you aim to be more tolerant. The rules have always been unclear, except for when mistaken.

Afaik, ‘woke’ was a term that originated in the USA in the 1960’s.

It only applies to the struggle of African-Americans, the dialogue between them, and the ensuing change in consciousness as they transition from a ‘class in itself’ to a ‘class for itself’.

i despair when the term woke is banded around by white liberals like myself.

its possibly as offensive to people of colour as me referring to myself as a N*****, and devalues the terms importance as a component of academic discourse.

Applying it the term to anyone else is a major semantic snafu, as its been sufficiently elaborated in academia.

Yet, we rarely hear of people complaining about how ‘existential’ their gender identity is or how they’ve been ‘valorised’.

are there any other terms we’d like to misappropriate?

Makes me laugh when, as kids we’d hit out with words like ‘ravished’, when we meant ‘famished’. 🙂

Though tbh, none of us were anywhere near actual starvation!

“The rules are so unclear.”

That’s the point though isn’t it? We’re bombarded by an ever expanding suite of new words, phrases and acronyms that serve to bamboozle rather than explain.

My contribution to the confusion would be to introduce the term ‘Alt-Left’, so as to discriminate between the cuddly wokesters and those who seek to instrumentalize the suffering of one group or another to further their own ends.

I agree with comments above that when used pejoratively it is equivalent to what would have been “virtue signalling” in 2019.

Political correctness gone mad, are Muslims banning Christmas again this year?

But I doubt that many who use it pejoratively are aware of its origins, so I would hesitate to describe them as ipso facto racist.

You make a good point.  I suspect that most who use it pejoratively are too shit thick to know it’s origins, let alone care.  But I would bet my bike that the set of “people who use ‘woke’ as an insult” and “people who are raging racists” would not create a Venn diagram of two discrete circles.

Should I sneer at the self-declared woke like I do the self-declared foodies?

Do you meet a lot of people who introduce themselves going “hi, my name is Terry and I’m woke”?  Is this a bit like the “how do you know someone’s a vegan?” hilarious trope?

Regardless of topic, sneering at people speaks more about the sneerer than the sneeree.

The rules are so unclear.

They’re not, not really.

The “rules” as you put it are simply “be nice to people.”  That’s it.  Yet for some this is seemingly a complex challenge for reasons I cannot fathom.

“ Yet for some this is seemingly a complex challenge for reasons I cannot fathom.”

Coz your a woke innit.

I’m with Kathy Burke on this.

It’s a way of dismissing viewpoints that you don’t have any actual arguments against.

“Do you meet a lot of people who introduce themselves going “hi, my name is Terry and I’m woke”?”

On this thread?.. Yes. There’s literally dozens of you proudly self identifying as woke.

“Regardless of topic, sneering at people speaks more about the sneerer than the sneeree.”

Oh the irony, this entire thread has been an enormous sneer fest.

The “rules” as you put it are simply “be nice to people.””

Or else…

There’s a difference between people saying they think of themselves as woke on a thread specifically discussing the meaning of woke, and people bringing it up ab initio in conversation (still less using it as an introduction which was obviously not meant literally). I mean, I’m sure as a middle aged middle class white man I have limited perspective and certainly make mistakes but I do try – and having lived in Japan for a while, I’ve genuinely been on the other side minority-wise, though it wasn’t usually too bad. But I don’t think I’ve even used the term in face to face conversation.

On this thread?.. Yes. There’s literally dozens of you proudly self identifying as woke.

Pretty sure if you reread you won’t find that. I suspect what you’ll find are quite a few people saying they could imagine being accused of it (irrespective of what it actually means) by others as some sort of aggressive pejorative. As the OP, the very point of the thread was to try to ascertain what it actually means when used as a pejorative*. I e. – what is it about me that pushes their buttons….

*A few folk have tried to helpfully explain (again) where the phrase’s origins come from. For me, at this stage, it’s largely irrelevant. It’s what the word as used from the mouth of the accuser is shorthand for which is most interesting.

It’s what the word as used from the mouth of the accuser is shorthand for which is most interesting.

Given its distant and recent origins – a Jim Crow segregation era code word to begin with, rekindled during the BLM protests – I think theres something quite interesting in it as a choice to use it this side of the pond as a word, pejoratively, to typically describe someone white and liberal.

The only person I routinely hear describe themselves as woke – as ‘an unappologetiic woke commentator; – is Danielle Moodie. Circumstances as they are in the US black people really, really need to have their wits about them and being woke in that original sense is probably a necessary political and social survival skill. She uses the term quite correctly in terms of the role she plays in American political commentary

But theirs a white/right, usually male, use of ‘woke’ to describe every thing thats wrong, everything that gets in the way of the things they feel they deserve. Apparently the free market went all woke and spoilt all Liz Truss’s plans for instance.

It sort of seems like its something other than just being ‘a bit too nice’ when applied to white liberals. Maybe by blithely adopting the language of an American race and culture war the term brings with it a label of someone being traitor to a cause.

In terms of modern pejorative usage it’s just the new version of “political correctness gone mad” isn’t it? No more and no less. Anything that limits the ability of white men (mostly) to be as offensive and entitled as they want without fear of repercussions.

On this thread?.. Yes. There’s literally dozens of you proudly self identifying as woke.

It’s “literally” the thread subject so if true (it isn’t) then that shouldn’t come as a surprise. I meant day-to-day.

Or else…

If your response to “be nice to people” is “or else?” then, well, I’ve got nothing. Do you only aspire be a good person when threatened?

“If your response to “be nice to people” is “or else?” then, well, I’ve got nothing. Do you only aspire be a good person when threatened?”

Well, at least you admit that the ‘be nice’ meme is a threat!

Do you only aspire be a good person when threatened?

Isn’t that how Christianity works?

the ‘or else’ is the threat.

Be nice is no more of a threat than ‘eat your peas’, ‘put your shoes on’, or ‘don’t forget your wife’s birthday’

Well, at least you admit that the ‘be nice’ meme is a threat!

I have no idea what you’re referring to here, sorry.

I’m perplexed as to why people misappropriated a term that applied exclusively to the African-American struggle, when the existing discourse within gender research is already awash with terminology?

Perhaps they didn’t get your memo that it could only possibly be used in one specific and limited context.

Shame you weren’t awake to that possibility.

I’m awake to the fact that the English language is fluid and nuanced, depending on context.

but in the case of academic terminology, surely there’s some kind of intellectual copyright at stake.

No sooner than someones bust their guts for years to attain their doctorate, and some cerebral pansy plucks their hard won concept for their own divvity agenda.

“This washing machine incorporates cold-fusion technology to ensure your garments are sparkling white” .

us that fleischmann type cold fusion, or merely a cool wash?

Some reyt bollocks being spouted in this thread, that’s a fact

I’m not sure what a discussion of academic terminology has to do with the word “woke”. If it had been first coined by an academic with a specific and precise definition, you might have a point. But it wasn’t.

full house on the gammon bingo card

I do find it ironic how people who presumably consider themselves anti-racist, anti-sexist, etc, are very happy to be openly racist sexist and ageist about those they disagree with.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woke

the catchier version: