I take a passing interest in the game – generally around now before the TDF starts, so I’m no expert, nor do I have any opinions on the sport, but…. Why is the UK so determined to produce an endless supply of mediocre players?

I read something the other day that suggested Andy Murray would have won a major by now if he was in a different generation. So?

How much lottery funding has the LTA received?

Centre Court is looking nice n green though.

Nobody does mediocre better, not even the Belgians.

It’s not a mass appeal sport, there are not many facilities and any decent ones tend to belong to private and expensive clubs. While Wimbledon may get the media and the middle classes spunking over their strawberries once a year, it just doesn’t translate to a mass uptake of the sport, or any interest at all beyond that 2 weeks.

What MSP said.

Henman was 4 in the world for a while, so it’s not that bad.

Doesn’t matter how much lottery money you get if 3 players are better than you! Are you mediocre playing at Wimbledon? Similar to the English football squad they are very good just you only get one best.

I am more interested in the rules re shouting out. At the French Open someone was deducted points for crying our in pain ( a woman if I recall correctly) and yet today there was Sciavone against Robson with service shrieks that my wife claimed sounded like F888 Me! How is that not cheating?

I wouldn’t say Andy Murray is mediocre, he’s very good – just not quite good enough to win major titles.

Tennis players get past the QFs though! Well ok, two men and some doubles pairings.

Why is the UK so determined to produce an endless supply of mediocre players?

I read something the other day that suggested Andy Murray would have won a major by now if he was in a different generation

Isn’t that a bit contradictory?

Also, isn’t consistently being ranked in the top 5 in the world for the last 4 years (and 2nd for a while) a bit better than mediocre?

I tend to agree MSP, although virtually every school/municipal sports centre has a tennis court painted on a playground surface… perhaps the LEA’s can’t afford to buy the nets?

In answer to my own question….

Apparently, the LTA is receiving £27m from government and lottery funding over 4 years from 2009-2013. Not too sure what they received before then.

I suppose that given it’s lack of mass appeal means that nobody is accountable for the £27m spend as no one can be bothered to ask.

Why are (nearly) all of the best women players of Eastern European descent?

slackalice – Member
I suppose that given it’s lack of mass appeal means that nobody is accountable for the £27m spend as no one can be bothered to ask.

🙄 as if.

Because they ship themselves over to Bolletierri to have their childhoods taken away in the quest for tennis glory??

Really don’t mind too much about the nationality of the pros on the telly as long as they are entertaining to watch. If the LTA spend their lottery money increasing the number of people playing recreational tennis to improve our general health and well being I’d be happy enough. Same in our sport (mtb not interweb surfing!) – there’s a big gulf between what’s needed to make us a fit and healthy nation of recreational mtbers and what’s needed to make a few elite racers. I’d rather have the former.

I read something the other day that suggested Andy Murray would have won a major by now if he was in a different generation. So?

that was just a reference to the fact Nadal and Federer are around – who are both phenomenal players.

Andy has actually put Nadal under a lot of pressure in matches before when Nadal was playing well – but he seems to resort to a defensive style of play against him most of the time – and lets himself get pushed around – and Nadal has gone up a level again since then.

He is not the only guilty one though – Federer has let himself get pushed around by Nadal shamefully and lost matches he should have won.

Andy is actually extremely consistent and plays at a very high level and, considering the lack of competitiveness in this country (his mum sent him to spain I think to progress), he should be congratulated.

Compare his match attitude to previous British tennis players, it is a lot better.

Federer is fading, Nadals knees must surely give up soon, and Djokovic is not actually much better technically than Andy. If Andy attacked Nadal as much as Djokovic, which he has done and could again, he would do a lot better as Djokovic exposes that Nadals style of playing off the back foot is a bit flawed and makes him look slow.

It is also a shame than Andy is not a bit better technically – anytime he plays someone with a single handed backhand I find myself rooting against him.

And we should can grass as our national surface…

I guess globally tennis is a pretty rich and well followed sport. Through a historical quirk one of its most prestigious tournaments is held in England every year. This pretty much guarantees it will get coverage in media. This is turn draws people into the sport so there will always be people in the UK trying to make a living from playing tennis. I think Murray is a bit better than mediocre to be honest just not the very best

There are other racquet sports that we are good at that get virtually no coverage. I mean Britain is much better at Squush for instance but it gets nothing like the coverage of Tennis.

Not sure how elitist tennis is – my lad messes about with a club here in the middle class, Guardian reading liberal paradise that is Ilkeston, most of the kids there I would put on the “scroat” end of the demographic scale and play in footie tops, but they seem to enjoy their tennis, which is the importtant thing

I played a bit of tennis when I was at school and managed to nick a couple of games off the U16 European #1.

I was told that unless I was prepared to put tennis before everything else in life, I’d never be good enough to make a decent living at it. I wasn’t, so I didn’t.

I suspect that a lot of Brits just aren’t motivated or passionate enough about it to put in the graft. Just like me.

There is no doubt that Andy Murray is currently amongst the very best players in the world. Where are the others Brits? Yes, we do have a couple of women on the tour as well I think.

For a spend of £tens of millions, can we be satisfied with that level of return on investment?

I also feel that anyone who chooses to become one of the very best in the world in their chosen field of sport will have to exclude pretty much everything from their life apart from their quest to being number 1.

A huge part of tennis is mental strength, there’s no one to take up the slack you’re having a flaky five minutes and that can be all it takes to turn the tide of a match. Lots of technically gifted players on the circuit who just don’t have what it takes up top. Technically Murray is probably the best player out there, but he’s prone to lapses, sure he can improve on that but probably never eradicate it. If Murray had Djokovic’s mental toughness he’d probably be unstoppable.

Technically Murray is probably the best player out there

huh – technically better than Federer ?

He’s actually technically inferior to a lot of players – they just don’t have his mental strength.

Think part of the problem is perhaps natural talent too.

You only have to look at the career earning of some of the top Brits to see they’re not earning large amounts of cash, and definitely not enough to live on post tennis career. If at a young age you are not going to make it consistently in the top 50 then perhaps the attitude is why bother.

Like many above I think to describe Murray as medicore is a bit harsh. Even people like Baker, Ward etc are amazing at tennis but the gulf is so vast between a top 10 player and someone around the top 250 or so.

as a teenager, it’s pretty easy to sneak onto unattended private courts and have a knock around on a summer’s evening without paying the fees that your paper-round pay won’t stretch to.
I used to play a lot at our local municipal concrete tennis courts, and that was in Middlesbrough (Prissick Base, if anyone knows it) which is universally known as a poverty-stricken forgotten hell-hole.

Sorry? Aren’t we mediocre at most things?

(PS – COME ON WIGGINS!)

Murrays shots from nothing are superb, middle of a rally….neither player looks like hitting a winner….then Murray plays a winner from somewhere on the court he shouldnt, or with a choice of shot that is ambitious at best and foolhardy if it doesnt come off…in that respect he’s awesome to watch…but i agree that Federer plays the most technically classical shots.

Technically Murray is probably the best player out there

huh – technically better than Federer ?

He’s actually technically inferior to a lot of players – they just don’t have his mental strength.

Think schrickvr6 was referring to Murray’s technique… which is widely considered as being up there with the best*

*according to my mate who is a bit good at tennis 🙂

I was told that unless I was prepared to put tennis before everything else in life, I’d never be good enough to make a decent living at it. I wasn’t, so I didn’t.

I suspect that a lot of Brits just aren’t motivated or passionate enough about it to put in the graft. Just like me. This is one of the reasons that it’s so hard to get to the top.
How can say Murray is Mediocre? He’s in the top 5 in the world!.

If you happen to be good at say football, there is every chance that a club will spot your talent and place you at a young age in a club, where they’ll throw money at you, provide you with the coaching, equipment, money to train etc.
This is not the case in tennis.
For a tennis player to succeed they must start at a very young age and virtually get little (or in some cases no help). Endless weekends going through tournaments, exercising and training most week days, often ending up missing out on some schooling.
It’s difficult to say the least.

If you happen to be good at say football, there is every chance that a club will spot your talent and place you at a young age in a club, where they’ll throw money at you, provide you with the coaching, equipment, money to train etc.
This is not the case in tennis.
For a tennis player to succeed they must start at a very young age and virtually get little (or in some cases no help). Endless weekends going through tournaments, exercising and training most week days, often ending up missing out on some schooling.
It’s difficult to say the least.

So what has the £tens of millions to develop British world class talent been spent on? Is basically what I’m asking.

It is a very hard decision for kids and parents to make. My sons both played tennis at county level from an early age. Right from the start it was clear that coaches’ expectations re training and matches was not compatible with their schooling. Plus we went to Bollettieri a few years ago and watched the young E Europeans including Sharapova and the top two girls in the world at the age of 7 (already sponsored by Nike!!). Their family commitment to the cause was total – they all moved to what is a pretty dull part of Florida with one goal in mind. Few of them make it and for the many that fail the loss of a childhood is a heavy cost to pay for your dreams. The reality is that the more likely return on effort it to be a tennis coach which probably doesn’t bring the career or financial rewards that most began their journeys with (no offence to any coaches out there BTW!).

Most UK children probably make the correct choice!!

Well put teamhurtmore.
[/quote]So what has the £tens of millions to develop British world class talent been spent on? Is basically what I’m asking.

I can’t answer that question as I really don’t know.

Brad Gilbert’s pension?

Let’s not forget Murray is a Wimbledon Champion.

i live in a town with a 6000 seat football stadium but has only 2 dilapidated tennis courts with no nets and no fence.

Is the £27M there to develop world class athletes or to develop the sport in general?

A tennis court takes up a lot of room for two to four players to play on and costs a lot to maintain nets and lines etc. 7 to 15 pounds per hour to hire the court. Same price to hire a five aside pitch shared between 10 people. One hours coaching approaching 30 pounds. Hitting squads 15 pounds for 2hrs approx 4 kids to one coach ratio. To get a child up to a decent county standard they will be playing 7 to 10 hrs a week minimum with maybe two of those hrs one to one with a coach ( 50 to 60 pounds). It’s cheaper to buy a house! It’s simply to expensive. The major tennis developmental period is when the children sit their GCSE’s 13 to 16yrs. How many parents will risk their child’s education for a minute chance that they will have a competitive tennis career that will be able to support them in later life. Small example my son 9yrs old needs tennis trainers every 8 to 10 wks at 40 pounds a pop because he wears through the soles, he doesn’t outgrow them, it breaks my heart and my wallet. If your child wants to be a tennis player persuade them to do something else or you’ll never get that full suss 29er you’ve lusted after or anything else!

As Inbred456 says, its a money+class thing. How many top class brits do you see from what looks/sounds like a middle class background? From all that I can remember, they are well spoken chaps that probably had a pretty wealthy upbringing.
I used to play a lot of tennis upto age of 16/7, it then started to get too expensive for my parents. Coaching cost a fair bit and I would have had to have moved my coaching to the South Hants training courts which were a 35mile round trip. I heard of 12 yo kids at the time being coached at £100/hr – this was 1989-90! fk knows what it is now.

I now play squash, its shed loads cheaper and less cliquey

Read ‘Bounce’ by Matthew Syed to see why so many E.Europeans came throught he ranks in the last 20 years. It’ll also explain why we don’t produce many top class players – we don’t have the devotion to the game that some other nations do.

I suspect that a lot of Brits just aren’t motivated or passionate enough about it to put in the graft. Just like me[b]EVERYTHING[/b]

.

Very much a summer sport too. How many school weeks are there available for tennis given that the 1 term out of 3 where it’s really possible is the one where most exams are.

And in those same few weeks they have to squeeze track and field, the school sports day, cricket, etc. too

I reckon we may have played tennis for maybe about 4-5 games lessons in total.

Oh and 4th in the world is not “mediocre”.