Tatty Old Britain

Since the pandemic I’ve noticed places look a lot tattier than they used to. Weeds everywhere, things left overgrown and maintenance that used to be done isn’t getting done.

Reminds of those twelvty billion trillion megapixel images of European cites that were all the rage. I looked around the one of Bucharest and what struck me was when you looked past the well maintained facades, the back portions of buildings were crumbling and not maintained to same standard. Anywhere off a main street was riddled with weeds sprouting out of every nook and cranny. Seems we are heading in the same direction.

Weeds everywhere

This isn’t a bad thing. Nature is great.

Depends on the strain.

It’s urban wildlife enhancement initiatives.. or something like that.

Our local church does a similar spin..  the grass is chest high in the graveyard because it provides food for the bats.. forget that you can’t actually see the gravestones.. there’s maybe some extra long grass and weeds diversity ?

I only go to the UK every few years and I do notice things looking less well maintained. Reminds me of being on holiday in Italy in the 90s – crumbly.

Road signs that are obscured by bushes, etc or are just dilapidated. Maybe nobody uses them anymore anyway as the GPS tells you where to turn anyway.

Our local church does a similar spin..  the grass is chest high in the graveyard because it provides food for the bats.. forget that you can’t actually see the gravestones…

How many of those graves actually get regular visitors though…? Ever visited Highgate Cemetery in London?

All the same area, guess which bits get the visitors…

Personally, I love the way it’s being allowed to get overgrown, this half is fully accessible by the public, the rest, on the other side of the road, is only accessible by appointment on a guided tour – probably because it would be easy to get lost, from what I could see through the gate.

Not everywhere is tatty! Rawtenstall’s civic pride continues to make my town a great place.

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/24483119.pictures-britain-bloom-judges-descend-rawtenstall/

Not everywhere is tatty!

Obviously there are plenty of manicured parks and events for public consumption. Not all are equal though.

Edit: We are not talking rewilding either.

Councils have entire teams of people whose job it is to find things they do, that they’re not required to by law, so they can stop spending money doing it.

Road signs that are obscured by bushes, etc or are just dilapidated. Maybe nobody uses them anymore anyway as the GPS tells you where to turn anyway.

I noticed this when I was there in May

Councils have entire teams of people whose job it is to find things they do, that they’re not required to by law, so they can stop spending money doing it.

I entirely believe you, but I’m surprised that obscured road signs are legal

Thats something i noticed and commented on many years ago. There was a story of the Washington monument, and i noticed there were weeds growing about the place and it all looked a bit unkempt.

I think at the time i made a comparison that its the first sign of the empire crumbling, when they fail to look after their monuments and architecture, as in theres less money being put into maintenance

Have it manicured and boring roll out the AstroTurf  and concrete over everything but nature will suffer.

Maybe you should get a life or do something positive to help nature. Why should everything be neat and tidy?

Grrr.

Since the pandemic I’ve noticed places look a lot tattier than they used to. Weeds everywhere, things left overgrown and maintenance that used to be done isn’t getting done.

It’s the litter that gets me. Everywhere is riddled with litter – once you actually look around to specifically notice it you can’t unsee it. Roadside verges are particularly bad. You look around other European cities and they’re clean! Nowhere else I’ve been to has anything like the litter problem that the UK suffers from.

Maintenance and cleaning comes from revenue funding (as opposed to “build shiny new thing” which comes from capital funding) and one of the main results of austerity was a complete cliff edge of revenue funding. We can afford to build shiny new things but not to then maintain them, so within a couple of years whatever has been built (usually to the lowest cost possible) begins crumbling, there’s weeds and litter, it all looks a bit rundown and that’s a catalyst for crime and antisocial behaviour which feeds into a cycle of decline.

The worst seem to be the the small, washed up, seaside towns! very depressing looking at how dishevelled they now look. Very poor maintenance now in the UK, most road drains a full of sediment and not working, litter everywhere and many places in desperate need of a paint and some TLC. Yes, the UK looks and is now very backwards when compared to Germany, France, Spain, Portugal etc. Councils don’t really have maintenance teams as such anymore, it’s all contracted out to private companies, meaning the money does not go far.

Welcome to Austerity Britain.

Its all efficiency cuts.

Government has removed the funding, they’ve sold off all the assets that they can, they’ve run out of reserves and whats left gets concentrated on what is legally required to be provided (and in many instances not even that can be delivered hence why at least 6 Councils in England are on the verge of bankruptcy).

HTH

A lot of the weed spraying was cut because of the silliness around Glyphosate which gave council’s and excuse to stop controlling the weeds. Trouble is it does come back to bite then when the weeds rip the tarmac up and drains get blocked.

As above keeping the place tidy is not a statutory requirment for councils, the bast majority of there money is spent on a small but growing number of people who need help to function, the old fashioned services the rest of use like highways, parks, bin collections, librairies, leisure facilities etc. just get squeezed.

RON is right, Rawtenstall has a fantastic volunteer group keeping the town looking spectacular, the council have had the sense to provide  money for plants etc. And get a lot of committed labour for free. Bacup at the other end of the vally also has a good civic pride group which considering its demographic shows theres good people everywhere.

As a country we are also good at finding lots of money pet projects but then never consider the on going maintenance. Trail centres are a good example.

I agree that there are issues around litter, agree that some of the lack of maintenance seems pretty important (obscured road signs, public buildings all have leaky gutters etc etc). Also issues of graffiti, but then a lot of feeling run down is due to a combination of lack of money and damage/vandalism by a few numpties.

But I’ve no problem with longer grass, more tees and shrubs etc.

Our council and BEAR on the A9 are now just mowing a wee strip alongside a road, saving a fortune in grass mowing.

One of the things I dislike about public services culture in the UK is the amount of ‘notices’ stuck all over doors, windows, walls. Our doctor a few years ago decided to do away with them and put them all on one noticeboard – and lovely art and photos all around the surgery. It just feels really nice.

Like others, we’ve a brilliant Development Trust
https://dunblanedevelopmenttrust.com/what-we-do/environment/

First time in the UK in seven years this Summer.

Weeds don’t bother me, there are more everywhere due to the reduction in the use of Roundup. However I was surprised by the number of houses with grass in the gutters. No litter in Devon, south Brum or rural Leicestershire.

The people were less hostile both on the roads and in person than during our last visit. Some were friendly and helpful – and interested.

The housing stock looked surprisingly run down given the exhorbitant prices. Half a million £ houses with cracks and in need of repointing. There were exceptions which looked well-maintained, new heat pump and EV socket, but on the whole they hadn’t been touched in seven years.

Traffic worse than ever, very few bikes or people on foot. We walked a mile through through the Brum suburbs to the shopping street and didn’t see another pedestrian before ALDI car park. It seems people only walk anywhere if they have a dog.

I reckon the average Brit has put on 500gm every year since I left in 1987. We had the impression of big cars and big people.

Next stop was Amsterdam – the big difference was visible people. We stayed in the suburbs and people were out and about on bikes, cafés had a terrace. Many of the houses were scruffy despite even higher prices than the UK.

Then Berlin. Berlin in Summer feels more like Spain with people living outside, a really nice atmosphere. Scruffy, dirty, litter, but a great place to be.

And home to SW France. Green as in the colour. People have plants and trees in front of their houses rather than block paving. Brum in particular felt very mineral in comparison. No two houses are the same here which I prefer, there’s some litter which I pick up, some houses are scruffy, people are more visible, lots of weeds. And there’s a lot to do – good swimming pools and sports facilities, free concerts in the park most nights in July, clubs organising walks, runs and rides with posters on lamposts.

“And as things fell apart, nobody paid much attention…”

I’ve no issue with letting vegetation and wild flowers grow unhindered in a lot of places. Older buildings too – often have more character if they are a bit crinkled around the edges like a well-thumbed book. So long as they’re not dangerous.

What does look shit, though, is post WW2 construction, largely concrete, which has been allowed to stain and crumble and be covered in graffiti. In this regard, Britain’s towns and cities are now probably below the average standard in all of Europe.

But this is the frog being boiled. If you step back and look, there are things that would be perceived 20 years ago as “needing sorting” but are now just left. Missing ceiling tiles, cracked windows, wobbly paving slabs, potholed roads etc. The country is manifestly poorer than it was 20 years ago – largely due to austerity and Brexit. The effects were never going to be visible overnight, but they are obvious if you take a longer view.

And there’s a lot to do – good swimming pools and sports facilities, free concerts in the park most nights in July, clubs organising walks, runs and rides with posters on lamposts.

I think a lot of that is related to the climate though.

If the UK had a comparable climate I think it would be a quite different place.  It’s risky putting on outdoor events when you know there’s a decent chance it could be raining!

Plus, everywhere looks worse when the sky is grey and rainy.

Maybe I am wrong but I think part of the problem is possibly a sense of loss of community and pride following years of politicking and finger pointing from government. People seemed to be more keen to tidy up in front of their houses and the surrounding area but it now often seems like there’s an attitude of ‘well, it’s not my job, somebody else will do it’. Its seems to be a fairly common attitude that it’s ok to just chuck things on the floor rather than find a bin or take it home. A lot of car drivers, for example, seem to think that it’s ok to just open the window and drop fag ends, empty cans and crap. ‘Why should I give a shit when politicians obviously don’t?’ It’s a downward spiral. And it’s **** depressing.

Well do something about it.

Litter pick.

Collect all the Macdonalds or KFC crap from the area round their drive through and give it back to them.

Action speaks louder than words, stop complaining from the drivers seat of your range rover.

Get out and improve something.

Half a million £ houses with cracks and in need of repointing.

Try getting someone to do repointing! Trades are still a nightmare to get hold of and “little” jobs like that seem to be the worst to get people to do.

Traffic worse than ever, very few bikes or people on foot

Time it right / wrong on my commute into London and you’re pretty much in a peloton of proper cyclists, nodders and ebikers all the way in.

You can see it everywhere you go in the world if you want to look for it. Just because the touristica parts of large European cities are nice and neat – Central London is equally as pretty, get out to the suburbs and there’ graffiti weeds and litter all over the place, and TBH I know a couple of profs at Manchester who’ve had a good 30 year career looking at pretty much exactly the same stuff left behind a few thousand years ago by the slobs of Pre and Roman Britain.

Agree MrSparkle – there is a lot of that.

Well do something about it.

Litter pick.

Collect all the Macdonalds or KFC crap from the area round their drive through and give it back to them.

Action speaks louder than words, stop complaining from the drivers seat of your range rover.

Get out and improve something.

I’m not sure if that’s aimed at me or not but I do. I litter pick in our local area. Also, I don’t have a car. let alone a Range Rover. I cycle or take the bus.

Well do something about it.

Litter pick.

Collect all the Macdonalds or KFC crap from the area round their drive through and give it back to them.

Action speaks louder than words, stop complaining from the drivers seat of your range rover.

Get out and improve something.

Discussions like these are always the same – very few people actually go and do something about it. My thread is pretty much a lone voice nowadays.

https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/spring-clean/

I completely agree with mattoutandabout.

The litter is dreadful (mostly thrown from passing vehicles), worse than ever. Dog owners throwing their dog mess bags along the canal, pavements and even in built up areas, school children on holiday discarding cans, sweet wrappers and crisp packets.

But we do need the weeds, possibly not growing out of chimneys, gutters or from other parts of buildings. Our neighbour pulled up some poppies the other day, arrggh.

But on the good side there’s a window cleaner in our area, who goes from sign post to sign post cleaning them, taking off the moss and trimming around. I’ve done the odd litter pick and will do some more when I can.

It’s a fine line between allowing nature in, letting weeds and wild things grow, to keeping a place looking neat and tidy. This can be done but I think we can all play our part.

It’s the litter that gets me. Everywhere is riddled with litter – once you actually look around to specifically notice it you can’t unsee it. Roadside verges are particularly bad. You look around other European cities and they’re clean! Nowhere else I’ve been to has anything like the litter problem that the UK suffers from.

Look around you at the average Brit, they’re the ones littering – lazy ****!

It’s a shame that people equate plants growing with tatty. Always makes me a bit sad when people mow roadside verges to neat lawns. What is the point of that? We’ve recently been working on a project in Ireland. There is a strong tradition of keeping your property neat. Anybody not mowing the lawn and keeping hedges manicured will get grief from the neighbours. We’ve been encouraging kids to nag parents and grandparents into keeping an area wild. You need a “area kept wild to help wildlife” sign to keep the neighbours at bay.

Litter on the other hand is a menace to all. No excuse for that. Just been out and it’s bin day, bin contents everywhere. I wouldn’t say I do my bit but do have a couple of areas locally that I try to tidy. Little and often as any rubbish just attracts more.

I’ve been recently ‘trimming’ a plant that’s completely overgrown the path on my commute – covers the whole path and people have to push through it or go on the road. But, the council, after at least 2 years have been and trimmed it right back.

PS the wet summer hasn’t helped with the extensive plant growth.

There is a field behind our house. When we moved in, nearly 30 years ago, it was a manicured football field for the local school – which is about 3 minutes walk away. The field was originally donated to the community from Crown Wallpaper, when they had a factory their (all gone).

As the school has used it less, it’s been allowed to wild over, with just a ‘cut’ path around the perimeter for people to walk dogs. The rest is just a wild meadow. It’s great for us as there has been a significant growth of trees and blackberry bushes behind our property.

Councils have entire teams of people whose job it is to find things they do, that they’re not required to by law, so they can stop spending money doing it.

Actual Councillor here, this year in my district we had to find £2.5 million of savings, almost entirely due to government cuts, council tax caps and inflation.

We legally cannot submit a budget that isn’t balanced and the majority of the money we spend are on statutory services that we legally have to provide (bin collections etc) we basically had 2 options.

A: Cut everything non-mandated to the bone and jack up fees for everything where we can, using that funding to try to keep popular major local facilities open so they can survive long enough to see a return of sensible government funding and we don’t lose them for good.

B: Go pop, which is considerably worse for everyone and will mean we do lose all those facilities.

I can assure you none of my colleagues (well, maybe the Tories) stood for election because they wanted to see public services get worse and things get tattier but there… is… no…. money. It’s all been spent on Brexit and dodgy PPE.

public services culture in the UK is the amount of ‘notices’ stuck all over doors, windows, walls

Yup, because when we don’t over communicate in this manner we get furious ‘you didn’t tell me you were going to do ‘x’!!’ type letters.

Even when we do stick notices up everywhere, put out press releases, mention things in our regular newsletters have all the info online etc we still get these objections but at least this way council officers can point out that here was was a physical notice up there for a regulation period.

It’s CYA behavior but entirely driven by some people’s tendency to have only two settings; Total Obliviousness and OUTRAGE!

Plenty speed limit and other ‘safety critical’ road signs and dangerous junction sight lines obscured by foliage.

Many town and city centres are starting to look a bit like 28 Days Later.

I don’t mind certain green spaces being left to nature, but I don’t think highstreets should have weeds growing from the cracks in pavements, edges of buildings, rooftops etc.

I also don’t see road sweepers and litter pickers out as much as I used to.

Thing is, without Roundup keeping weeds down is very labour intensive. A month of holiday and it took two of us an hours to weed our drive and the pavement outside our house.

I also don’t see road sweepers and litter pickers out as much as I used to.

Which is a direct result of the 40% reduction in Local government funding in real terms over the last 10 years and legislation capping council tax rises at below the rate of inflation, making them real terms cuts.

Street cleaning is a statutory service, but if your council is short on money they will employ fewer people and each area gets swept/cleaned less frequently.

Agreed that there is a huge long term issue over local council funding – which is massively down. Hence mrs_oab losing her job and many other cuts to ‘vital’ services.

That said, I am intrigued why my local council who had to save £13m+ have a nice 24 plate cctv van with some gert big extending mast on it….?