Roits in Manchester?

I honestly don’t understand what has happened to the Daily Mail recently. As the Daily Telegraph appears to slip further into the gutter with every passing day the Daily Mail keeps surprising me with reasonable reporting which I don’t expect from them. Have they had a change of editor?

Yesterday the Daily Mail appeared to castigate the Chief Constable of Manchester for releasing what they called a “tone deaf statement” on airport fracas because he claimed only ‘some communities’ were upset by the ‘stamping’ video.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13677351/chief-constable-manchester-police-airport-statement-investigation.html

And today they publish a perfectly reasonable report about today’s Tommy Robinson led demonstration in London actually leading on the counter demonstration rather than on the “patriotic demo”.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13678889/Anti-racist-counter-demonstrators-tommy-robinson-rally-London.html

From the perspective of someone who was on the counter demonstration I thought their reporting was extremely fair. I particularly like how they describe us as “anti-racists” rather than a left-wing mob or Marxist thugs, and I also like how they describe Stephen Lennon supporters chants as islamophobic rather than as patriotic slogans.

It’s all a bit strange!

For all we know there could be a badly injured cop, made that way by the guy who got kicked in the head. Their colleague was angry/distraught and did something terrible in the heat of the moment. Or the cop is just a thug and kicked a tasered man in the head.

Either way still potentially criminal acts.

Some of you just don’t get it, when you’re a uniformed, trained and empowered individual who is authorised to use force you have to meet higher standards.

Force must be proportionate and justifiable to the perceived threat and you should be trained and conditioned suitably to operate in that function and manage the risks that you will potentially face.

Some of you must have had some pretty shitty experiences to be that jaded.

Maybe, or some have concerns at the perceived lack of scrutiny and transparency. Or  actually have an understanding of the responsibility that comes with legally carrying firearms and being empowered to use force in varying degrees.

I’ve had varying degrees of interactions professionally with the police in the UK, from scooping up errant troops who’ve been dickheads to conducting Op Temperer patrols and supporting their training and I have the utmost respect for the profession, however I’m more than happy to call it as I see as when they fall short, be that aggressive kicks to the to the head, of fat useless pricks who are out of breath getting out of a car.

They must be accountable at all times for their actions, and maybe some of these recent issues stem from a lack of appropriate resourcing and selection and training, but  I hold the same opinion of my former profession and cringe every time some **** goes rogue and ends up taking a massive shit on the hard work and professionalism of the whole.

Errors in judgement happen, but you don’t get to walk away from the consequences of that with a shrug of the shoulders, even more so when you are empowered to carry firearms.

I honestly don’t understand what has happened to the Daily Mail recently. As the Daily Telegraph appears to slip further into the gutter with every passing day the Daily Mail keeps surprising me with reasonable reporting which I don’t expect from them. Have they had a change of editor?

Yesterday the Daily Mail appeared to castigate the Chief Constable of Manchester for releasing what they called a “tone deaf statement” on airport fracas because he claimed only ‘some communities’ were upset by the ‘stamping’ video.

The Mail has always had spasms of good journalism here and there – best known example was its dogged pursuit of the Stephen Lawrence killers. But it’s like seeing the occasional fish jumping out of a river of shit.

If it is indeed the case, thankfully the police federation have a very generous compensation plan in place which is between £12,990 and £28220 for a broken nose, as it is classed as a severe injury.

If theres a moderate case of PTSD from it, we can add another £10,000-£30,000 on top of that. Moderately severe it starts at 30k and goes up to 70k.

I know you hate the police and especially women but why make stuff up? She’ll be lucky to get anything.

Turns out its not as told

First footage emerging of what led to the Manchester Airport Incident… pic.twitter.com/tuxzhd23LP
— Football Fights (@footbalIfights) July 27, 2024

Well that’s pretty incriminating. Not sure about the ‘not as told’ claim though, what were we told?

Whilst not in any way excusing the kick to the head or the pepper spray, that puts somewhat of a different slant to it.

Funny how different it all looks when an independent view is shown. I presume this is airport cctv.

Let’s hope those attacking the police get charged and convicted

That’s quite spicy..

They should definitely get charged for that. Doesn’t condone the following behaviour but it explains why Andy Burnham didn’t immediately come out and condemn the police (though did describe the footage as shocking from memory). Can only assume he saw this footage at the time.

More than happy to adjsut my view on seeing that, higher degree of ambiguity now and a very rapid escalation by Punchy McPuncher in the blue.

Taser has been deployed and used so looks like the cop had two choices to maintain control; physical force or a firearm.

Looks like he chose the less lethal option as uncomfortable a watch as it is.

Doesn’t excuse the kick but sure as hell explains it. I think the kick happened a second or 2 after that clip ended, adrenaline must have been pumping and as I said scroaty mcscroat face wasnt actually restrained at that point, just incapacitated by the taser. He recovered use of his arms and legs 10 seconds after this if you watch the other footage so I’m guessing the kick / stamp was an inappropriate  attempt to keep him down given the ferocity of the way he assaulted the officers.

Doesn’t excuse the kick but sure as hell explains it.

I now think it does-ish.

The situation wasn’t contained and I’m sure that cop will argue that he felt if that individual got up there’d be a continuation of the assault. He used ad-hoc less than lethal as he’d deployed his taser.

I’m more than happy to do an about turn after seeing that footage, it’s brutal and uncomfortable but I can think of a number of countries where the fella in blue would be perforated for that conduct on a cop.

Can now see why the family are calling for calm and not blood.

Makes the compo face tiktok seem even more ridiculous now.

I know you hate the police and especially women

Not sure where you’re reading that from, I dont hate women, quite the contrary, especially nurses. Perhaps you are not astute as you like to think you are.

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And I again disagree with you again, I respect the police, though I’ve had my run in with a few.

That said, I will say I have a deep disregard for authority, but only when it’s being misused or abused.

But what interests me here is why do you want to make this thread about me and how I feel about anything.Perhaps you should just stick to the topic at hand.

“Yet some that be that take delight
To judge folks thought for envy and spite,
But whether they judge me wrong or right,
I am as I am and so do I write. ”

Not sure where you’re reading that from, I dont hate women, quite the contrary, especially nurses. Perhaps you are not astute as you like to think you are.

Umm…

Really,  I presume that is a joke?  I’m not sexist, I love women as nurses.  Not as cops obviously, they just wind everyone up.

Doesn’t excuse the kick but sure as hell explains it

Definitely

Doesn’t excuse the kick but sure as hell explains it

I agree, I hope they throw the book at the guy in the pale blue shirt. Still can’t have police officers doing that and getting away with though, he’s got to go.

Not the two brothers in the face kicking head stamping incident, they were released without charge.

Somehow I don’t think that’s true is it? Maybe wait for the facts to surface in future before making statements that you can’t verify.

I honestly don’t understand what has happened to the Daily Mail recently. As the Daily Telegraph appears to slip further into the gutter with every passing day the Daily Mail keeps surprising me with reasonable reporting which I don’t expect from them. Have they had a change of editor?

Tip top tip. Don’t read the comments section though.

Looks like the guy in grey chinned his mum

This shows a couple of seconds after the X video above. Sky blue guy grabs the male cop from behind and then seems to be tased by one of the other cops. He falls to the floor as the cop gets to his feet, then sky blue moves to get up or something and cop immediately kicks him, as relapsed_mandolorian says, as ‘adhoc less than lethal’.

I thought this looked really bad for the cop, but the original video was cut to start just as sky blue hits the floor after attacking the officer, to make it look like he was kicked out of the blue, when the officer who kicked him was actually being held in a headlock by the same guy less than 3 seconds earlier. Now I think it’s actually justified. Cop had just been attacked by multiple people and had to keep one of them on the ground by any means necessary.

Looks like the guy in grey chinned his mum

In fairness she lost the ticket.

That MEN video gives even more context, I’m now OK with what the officer did, he tasered the guy in blue from the floor I think, as soon as the officer got upright he kicked him to make sure he stayed down as the guy in blue was not restrained and clearly running on adrenaline at the very least given the brutality he displayed without provocation.

Tip top tip. Don’t read the comments section though.

On the contrary I like to. For a limited period of time – it gets too much after a while.

Unsurprisingly the comments can sometimes be rather critical, from a right-wing perspective, of the way the Daily Mail articles are written

then sky blue moves to get up or something

I honestly can’t see that. Do you mean he lifts his head up very slightly? He arms and legs don’t seem to move at all.

The key thing for me is that this wasn’t a case of officers turning up after an alleged assault on police and dishing out some extra judicial revenge. The stamp and kick were very much part of an officer who was still in the mindset of defending himself from multiple attackers.  Sky blue wasn’t lying ‘complying’ on the floor, he had been felled by a taser just seconds earlier after putting all three officers on the floor with punches. I think it’s reasonable for the officer to have believed that if he got up he would have continued the attack.

Blue shorts and grey? are certainly handy enough. But the police went in hard to begin with. Certainly didnt seem to be any can you explain this sir, or can you come over here sir, policeman just grabbed him and tried to force him too the floor, and it all erupts from there.

But as before, the officer kicked him clearly out of frustration from losing the battle. Tasering should have ended it, and I think we’ve seen that happen often enough to know the standard is they back away and get the individual to comply, or they get another charge. not step forward and kick then stamp on his head.

Plus all officers know what happens when they use the taser on someone, and how stunned they are. So that was no check he’s down and was more an angry kick cos he lost the fight and got a fair old thumping.

Anger+Adrenalin.

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Im sure though others might interpretate that differently.

The Police must have had a reason for approaching that as they did. They were obviously then getting battered by a couple of very handy guys and reacted. Even in my youth many, many years ago when I was quite good at martial arts I would have thought of using it on the police. But we really dont know the back story to this

But as before, the officer kicked him clearly out of frustration from losing the battle.

I’m not sure about that. Lots of documentation of Tasering not working, or only working for a while, so the police officer really didnt want him getting up again.

Those guys chose to kick off, but we dont know why the Police chose to intervene initially so strongly.

Also I thought firearms officers weren’t supposed to get involved in close stuff so there is something really odd about this. Lack of resourses?

But the police went in hard to begin with. Certainly didnt seem to be any can you explain this sir, or can you come over here sir, policeman just grabbed him and tried to force him too the floor, and it all erupts from there.

Are we not learning anything from making assumptions. Have you seen what happened directly before this or have any idea why the police ‘Went in hard’ again, why don’t we wait for the full story before making sweeping statements.

Lot of armchair critics here.

Best wait for the full story – we already know that what we do know is not the full story..,

mrlebowski
Free Member

Best wait for the full story – we already know that what we do know is not the full story…

There’s no “full story” that makes it OK to kick the guy in the head, is the thing. Like has been said up the page, it can explain, it can’t excuse.

Any word from their ‘lawyer’?

With my son being a noobie cop that’s just really unpleasant to watch.

It’s never ok to kick someone in the head. It’s never ok to punch a woman in the face either, which Sky blue had done seconds earlier.
If I saw a female friend or colleague of mine punched in the face by a bloke I might well kick his head a few seconds later, to prevent him doing it again if nothing else.

There is no acceptable level of violence. If you kick off at someone don’t moan about the consequences.

But the police went in hard to begin with. Certainly didnt seem to be any can you explain this sir, or can you come over here sir, policeman just grabbed him and tried to force him too the floor, and it all erupts from there.

It’s funny how people see things differently. And it shows how eyewitness accounts can be so contradictory

I see coppers approaching a guy paying for his airport parking at a machine, he is unaware that they are there until they grab him with presumably the intention of putting handcuffs on him, apparently they have been told that he is a violent suspect.

He initially doesn’t seem to resist, possibly because he has been taken by surprise. Then the one in grey intervenes and it all kicks off.

I have no idea where you get the “can you explain this sir, or can you come over here sir”. Why on earth do you think that is the way to arrest a potentially violent person?

I think most of the arrests  I have witnessed have distinctly lacked the “excuse me but would Sir like to come this way please”. Most of the arrestees are lucky to remain in an upright position

There’s no “full story” that makes it OK to kick the guy in the head

Would it have been okay to hit him in the head with a truncheon?

If so why?

Edit: Actually on reflection that’s not really an appropriate question as the amount of force used is the issue imo. I think a light blow might be justified in certain circumstances where a full force definitely would not. Same probably goes to kicking someone in the face – a light kick to the face could do less damage than a punch. I guess that I was trying to gauge whether it was the fact that it was a boot rather than a truncheon that was the problem, although both could be, depending on circumstances, be unacceptable

I think he had a warrant for arrest on him? Wasn’t that reported quite early?

If you kick off at someone don’t moan about the consequences.

Thats pretty much where I am with it, having seen the somewhat inevitable prequel to the kick in the head. It’s no different from your average provincial town centre on a Saturday night outside a kebab house at 3am. Same rules apply.

If go in, fists flailing, punching everyone in sight in the face, especially including women (what kind of bloke punches a woman full on in the face FFS?!) , then you immediately forfeit your right to complain about any subsequent shoeing you end up on the receiving end of.

Those lads didn’t exactly look like they were newbies to the kick off, did they?

It’s no different from your average provincial town centre on a Saturday night outside a kebab house at 3am. Same rules apply

Yep. Been on both sides of that particular coin.

Also, the Swiss police were pretty nasty when street fights got going.

Why on earth do you think that is the way to arrest a potentially violent person?

Everybody is a potentially violent person Ernie, but do we ask our law to arrest people, or to go hammer and tongs into someone before any facts have been established.

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Why in heavens name would you think that is an acceptable way for a policeman to act Ernie ?, when at that point he is facing no threat.

Thats the kind of reasoning we read in the Daily Mail comments section.