He is such a talented driver but no helmets ,the M4 at its limits so anything gives way they would be lucky to walk away

Yeah, but still.

Imagine you’re running a ‘ring Driving School and Robert Kubica turns up and ask for a go!

He’s a nice guy and surprisingly human (for an F1 driver).

They’re wearing masks. What’s the problem?

Nordschliefe is a public road, no helmet required IIRC. I suspect the reason you always see TV presenters wearing them is an insurance issue.

It is the ring so no helmets required and he is a talented driver and was driving well within his limits and I’m sure the car was capable of more on a proper glory run. Just because the car is squirming a bit doesn’t mean its near its limits. The fancy diff’s on modern cars induce allow a bit of lateral movement to improve agility and turn in, but in reality well within the grip of the chassis and control law’s of the electronic diff. Robert was probably just having a bit of fun and trying to impress his passenger by inducing a bit of instability.

I love the way he looks so composed and taking it all in his stride.

I suspect the OP was thinking more along the lines of life after a big off rather than a legal requirement to wear one. Kubica had approached another local supplier of vehicles/tuition who wouldn’t let him take one of their fast cars with one of their instructors….they needed to know he was capable of driving such a vehicle….If only they’d asked for his name and perhaps checked who he was.

You could tell by the way that he was being respectful to the traffic that he was nowhere near 10/10ths. Properly good to watch though, reminded me of when playing Gran Turismo you had to just pound away at the beginner races with your modified car to get enough credits for a new one. Find the shortest, easiest race with a good prize payout and just do multiple races lapping everything.

they needed to know he was capable of driving such a vehicle….If only they’d asked for his name and perhaps checked who he was.

Yeah I enjoyed that.

And him talking about having to get a license to race in whatever cup he was talking about “FIA Super Licence? Nah, it’s ARDS for you mate” ha ha.

I still stand by the helmets , he is pretty well flat out downhill, a wee tyre blow out and your history
His rallying career much like Kimi fast but usually rolled out but entertaining in the M4
Most owners of M4s would have written it off trying to emulate

These guys presumably spend most of their race car driving hours wearing custom fit helmets of varying types so it seemed odd that neither was bothered. Hardly an encumbrance and presumably they can be miked up for conversation purposes (instructor > pupil video recording for example).

Didn’t look like he was pushing very hard, surprising nonetheless that they’re in a car with a cage and no helmets though. Might just be a cage on the rear half, can’t make out.

I still stand by the helmets , he is pretty well flat out downhill, a wee tyre blow out and your history
His rallying career much like Kimi fast but usually rolled out but entertaining in the M4
Most owners of M4s would have written it off trying to emulate

I get what you mean and understand your stance.

We can debate the danger level all day, trying to balance Kubicas skill and experience v the speed v the track/road v the other riders etc. You’d need to be at Trump levels of nonsense to try to claim it wouldn’t be safer with helemets.

Let’s be honest though, STW has been accused of hand-wringing one upmanship in the past for good reason. They’re committing a victimless ‘crime’. One of the greatest drivers in the world, just by virtue of being an F1 driver, not the fact that he was in his prime one of the better ones, and a Guy who lives and breathes the place. Either one, or both could have worn a helmet if they wanted to, but they didn’t need to, and they didn’t want to.

The world is shit enough, why not just enjoy it.

Having driven on the Ring on a couple of occasions, there are quite a few moments in that video that made my ass clench. On some of the faster sections at speed, the surface is really bumpy and it completely unsettles the car – doing that into a braking zone is terrifying as it’s all over the place on the initial application of the brakes. His commitment through some of the sharper corners where there’s nothing but a sliver of grass and then a barrier on the exit is incredible. Those bits always terrified me as if you get even a piece of a wheel onto it, even if you manage to not immediately spin the car, its hard to get it back on the circuit – brake and you hit the wall, accelerate and you hit the wall, steer too much and you hit the wall. I grazed the wall in my car on one of my first laps doing this.

Might just be a cage on the rear half, can’t make out.

Yup, just a bolt in half cage, so no additional crash structure up front. If he rolled it into a ball of snot a helmet wouldn’t help much. And he doesn’t appear to be at his limit in that video.

Consenting adults, etc. They’re not putting anyone else at risk and I don’t think he was really pushing it to the limit anyway, so I don’t see anything to worry about. Kinda boring video really.

There was “Aftermath video” on same channel which had some interesting bits, I skipped most but besides obvious stuff after 36 laps (tyres, oil) the wheel bearings needed change too and some transmission bearings were so hot that grease had vaporised. Rear body panel was partly melted near exhaust. As he was driving without traction control the rear brake pads were not badly worn unlike front brakes.

breadcrumb

Yup, just a bolt in half cage, so no additional crash structure up front. If he rolled it into a ball of snot a helmet wouldn’t help much. And he doesn’t appear to be at his limit in that video.

Yes I agree, but just to be clear I meant because with a full cage normally a helmet & harness is a requirement because you could hit your head on the bars above the door etc 🙂

I wonder if the car is standard (aside from a cage or half cage – I havent watched the video)? I’ve got an m4, and while I havent driven it on track, I have driven a lot of other cars on track ,including my old v8 m3, and I’m pretty sure that a standard m4 would very quickly , like within a lap or 2, start to overheat things like brakes, tyres and gearbox/diff like pretty much any other unmodified road car when driven even moderately hard by an amateur let alone a pro.

The presenter mentions in the video it has special take pads at the rear,I think when they’re driving there and it’s squeaking. I’d guess the car is prepped for fast track use and everything is serviced accordingly. At the price they charge for a lap I’d bloody well hope so!

Agree with many of the above comments – he was taking that relatively steadily. If anyone here has been out with a half-decent racing driver (ie, not just some guy with a Focus RS) you will appreciate just how fast a production car can go in the right hands. I have done a little bit of driving on closed circuits over the years and thought I was okay. A couple of years ago I went out with my brother-in-law (who regularly races at LeMons in the USA) in his Elise. I got out shaking head to toe and was relieved to be in one piece. He told me he was taking it pretty easily as he didn’t know the road :-O

I don’t think anyone is going to argue that a helmet would make it safer. But it’s not required and they are experienced drivers so I imagine are making the decision with some knowledge and thought. eg in the sections that have speed limits Robert went slow, in the YouTuber’s other videos I’ve seen him obey the rules and slow down. So I think they have thought about safety and are not being reckless.

If I was there for sure I would be wearing a helmet but these guys are massively more experienced than I am and they know what they are doing and it was within their comfort zones.

Its a bit like when I watch a mtb video of some person riding a cool trail and launching off what I would consider huge jumps and drops, railing around corners faster than I go on straights and all ridden on a trail bike with open face helmet as if they were just out having a laugh. While I would want a full DH bike and full face helmet and pads etc …

Not everyone is being reckless, just some people are more talented than others and have a different comfort zone so to you and I it can seem crazy but to them its fine.

Helmets not wearing when maybe 160 mph is a wee bit like on the open sea the kayak canoeing ones not needing to wear a boyancy aid due to being such good swimmers or someone going down the Fort William downhill no protection as they know their limits won’t fall off .Life can bite you in the bum sometimes eg the snake guy Steve from Australia, possibly our own Colin best ever rally driver

possibly our own Colin best ever rally driver

Do helmets help in helicopter crashes? Should his passengers have worn them as well?

Gee-Whiz that was a bit nippy wasn’t it. Also proves I have nowhere near the required talent for an M4

Life can bite you in the bum sometimes eg the snake guy Steve from Australia, possibly our own Colin best ever rally driver

Agreed, but accidents can happen anywhere (take Michael Schumacher for example). In the OPs clip, the driver was driving well within his limits and wasn’t taking particularly big risks that would be likely to result in an accident. I would bet that, had he been going for a record lap time, he *would* have been wearing a helmet.

7.10 bridge to gantry isn’t exactly taking it easy.

7.10 bridge to gantry isn’t exactly taking it easy.

I wonder what Kubika’s heart rate was though? I wonder how close he was to his limits?

Fudd
Free Member

7.10 bridge to gantry isn’t exactly taking it easy.

Yeah that’s **** quick in fairness. It really didn’t look like he was pushing that hard though!

F1 drivers must have a lot of extra capacity in the bank to be able to fiddle with brake bias and engine mode switches etc while on a hot lap

Here’s mishas (apex taxi) response to the original vid regarding the wear/what needed repairing to the car after kubicas 30+laps in their M4 with practically one fully functioning hand after his accident, i follow misha charoudin/apex taxi on youtube and their vids are fantastic to watch.

Some of you guys would love seeing the fastest bike lap of 7:10 then

possibly our own Colin best ever rally driver

With an impressively casual attitude to flying regulations.

I wonder what Kubika’s heart rate was though?

I imagine less than mine, in the same car, on the same track, on a PlayStation…

Some of you guys would love seeing the fastest bike lap of 7:10 then

With a clear trck he was hopeful for a sub 7min. It never happened

That looked so much faster than the Porsche record. (I know its not but blimey he really used track limits with safety buffer.)

Interesting to see the mods:

-half cage
-slick tyres
-very upgraded suspension
-upgraded pads and discs (on front) but stock calipers
-big wing on back
-nearly completely stripped out interior

Surprised at using stock calipers, but those tyres, the suspension,the brake pads and lack of weight will make that a fairly serious track car. As I said above I doubt a stock m4 would manage 1 or 2 laps at near that pace.

Good vid though, and interested to see the bits that needed replacing

I think he was pushing it a bit; used 50% of the brake pads (With no traction control) and destroyed the wheel bearings after his session! Also went through a few sets of tires:

https://jalopnik.com/heres-how-much-damage-an-f1-driver-does-to-your-car-1845227615

Interesting watch, that. Really drives it home just how quick he’s going with the rate he closes on other cars.

Good to see so much awareness and yielding too. You built something like that in the UK, your average Scooby driver would see that Beemer coming, thing “right then” and 30 seconds later you’d be picking what’s left of them out of the wall.

Great vid – would love to have him chauffeur me round, real quick but well within his limits. Never realised how **** his wrist is – can’t be much better than driving single-handed. Section from 10:00 seems most on the gas to me!

The Rental That Got Away reminds me of a story from long ago, where a magazine had a loan Lamborghini and lined up Thierry Boutson to test-drive it, but it got cancelled as the insurer was unhappy about an F1 driver being behind the wheel. I mean – by any measure, he had to have been one of the very best drivers on earth, but they considered him a risk. Bizarre – I’d be far more worried about a journo than an F1 driver! 🙂

…the insurer was unhappy about an F1 driver being behind the wheel. I mean – by any measure, he had to have been one of the very best drivers on earth, but they considered him a risk.

Can you imagine what the payout would be like if a current F1 driver sustained a career ending injury…

As for the bike video, that must be ten years old now and he was riding a modified 2006 R1. Bikes have come on a fair bit since then and I’d love to see what an equally committed rider could do on modern tackle.

Bizarre – I’d be far more worried about a journo than an F1 driver! 🙂

It was a journo from the Guardian who famously shifted down a couple of gears rather than up to top that destroyed an XJ220. £415,000.