Plutoline hot wax newby

Late to the party, trying Plutoline for the first time. I know there are already multiple threads, but some are pretty old now and the advice across them is mixed.

Plutoline website offers no info, and the tin doesn’t either.

My specific questions:

Deep fat fryer or slow cooker?

Temp setting or thermometer? What temp?

What us the process? I assume heat wax and dip the chain, but us it worth preheating the chain, or leaving it a while? How much excess should be removed? Wipe with a rag or brush it?

Plutoline

Are you taking the Mickey?

Heat the wax until its nice and runny.  dunk chain for a few minutes.  Take chain out and hang it up to drip.  Once its cooled run it thru a rag.  I normally refit it first

Thats the principle.  I do it on the stovetop in the tin

If you can be bothered, Zero Friciton Cycling – http://zerofrictioncycling.com.au – is a comprehensive resource on chain waxing generally, however Putoline is somewhat different from lubes like Molten Speed Wax and the Silca stuff, was originally developed for motorcycles and plays by its own rules, so that’s possibly of limited use to you.

TJ is the high priest of Putoline and will doubtless be along in a bit to extol its virtues and the best way to apply it, which seems less finnicky than the other wax-based stuff.

I did mine on a camping stove but I think I overcooked it.
Got a second hand slow cooker for GL F wax.
Prefer the slow cooker, really gently melts the wax and safer if a garage full of combustibles.
GLF super clean but needs doing almost as much as regular lube. I’ll try Silca next. Putoline lasted ages but was messy, but probably because I overcooked it.

For those that are running Putoline, how long or how many miles do you find it lasting you? Started using it last Autumn but in wet Peak District conditions it didn’t last as long as I’d have imagined it to, between applications.

Over summer, well what we’ve had of summer, it has been better but still only managing around 200 miles between applications before it starts getting noisy and annoying me so I re-wax it.

I would definitely use a slow cooker set to low (on my Argos cheapy that’s almost 90C).

I sit chain on top of solid wax and revisit every so often to check until wax is fully melted, this can take easily up to an hour so I’ll just do it whilst pottering about house doing other things.

Swish/agitate chain a few times, I prefer ‘dunking’ on the basis that it flexes the chain links about the rollers which I like to imagine draws more wax in.

I used to then turn slow cooker off to try and let the wax cool as much as possible before taking chain out, to avoid runny molten wax just dripping back out of the links. Have no idea if this was beneficial or not.

For those that are running Putoline, how long or how many miles do you find it lasting you

A great many on the winter road bike and winter gravel bike, I don’t track it but several rides at least. I’m still suspicious of certain chains though, e.g. the gold coated YBN chain on my gravel bike seemed to shed an application of Putoline in 50km!

Edit: actually 200 miles sounds about reasonable. I’ll get maybe 300-400km on the road bike (in fact probably more) and maybe 200-300km on the CX bike which obviously gets muddy more often and hosed off more often.

however Putoline is somewhat different from lubes like Molten Speed Wax and the Silca stuff, was originally developed for motorcycles and plays by its own rules, so that’s possibly of limited use to you.

I’ve just switched form Putoline to a DIY mix of 60C Paraffin wax, WS2 and PTFE.  First impressions.

Parafin melts to the viscosity more like brake fluid / baby oil it’s very thin once melted even at 70-80C , putoline never got that runny even running the DFF upto it’s max.

In it’s solid state putoline remains a bit ‘greasy’. Based on this observation I think Putoline is a different product entirely.  I think it’s probably a blend of  heavy oils, wax , and Calcium-sulfonate to bind it together. Like a grease made from EP90, graphite and Calcium-sulfonate?  Calcium-sulfonate is better than lithium at high temperatures, but does break down eventually so that’s probably why it doesn’t like getting too hot. Nothing to do with smoke points which is what I previously assumed.

For those that are running Putoline, how long or how many miles do you find it lasting you? Started using it last Autumn but in wet Peak District conditions it didn’t last as long as I’d have imagined it to, between applications.

It depends, it can last hundreds of miles but I’d probably say the Peak is one of those cases where it won’t, that place eats drivetrains!  I work on the assumption that Putoline lasts at least 4-5x longer than anything that could be applied wet, so if it’s lasting for example 2 rides, then that means it’s at least lasting more than half the first ride, and it’s those lube-less miles at the end of rides that kill components.

Deep fat fryer or slow cooker?

I’ve switched to a slow cooker, as above I think my putoline went ‘off’ in a DFF.

Paraffin wax is cheap (it’s the additives that cost ££), about £5/kilo from craft suppliers. So if you want to experiment with a “wax” rather than Putoline to see if it works better for you then it’s a cheap experiment, it’s just won’t have the fancy friction modifiers.  I know a lot of people blend a bit of oil in to soften the pure wax which helps it stick to the outside of the chain better rather than chip / flake off.  My plan (having made 4 batches of ~250g of a a ‘recipe’ I found that used pure paraffin wax is to blend it with the old Putoline to make something that’s just the right consistency.

Also worth noting, I’m sure the Putoline recipe changed, I’m sure the new stuff is softer and not as long lasting as the stuff I bought 15 years ago.

I used to heat it gentlely on the stocked in the kitchen but now I use a mini fryer for mine. I turn it on and leave the thermostat at minimum. To bottom of the wax melts super quick but it takes a good half an hour for the rest. I give it a bit of a tickle with a scraper to move it around a bit. Idea being not to overheat it as I’ve read that can damage the wax.

While I’m waiting for the wax to heat up, I take the chain off the bike and give it a clean with some boiled water in a bowl. Basically, just shove it in and give it a bit of a shake. Most of the crap just falls off. Rarely I’ll give it a scrub with a brush.

Once the wax is melted, the chain goes in the basket and the basket into the wax. Leave for ~ 10 minutes.

Give the basket a good shake and then dunk it back in for a another few minutes.

I hang on the side of the fryer for a bit to let the molten stuff run off and then tip the chain out flat onto some paper towel. I blot the outside with paper towel to remove as much was as possible from the outside, this seems to minimise the amount of gunk that builds up on the chainring and jockey wheels.

Longevity wise, I tend to redo it after 150 (off road) miles which tends to be 3 or 4 rides. I used to leave it until the chain went a bit squeeky but I’m pretty sure that’s what killed off my chain and cassette last time so now I just do it routinely.

Over winter, I might do it every other ride.

I’ve had the same wax for about 4 years now and it does seem different now from when it was new. It seems to be stickier. Either I’m imagining it or I’ve overcooked it at some point. I’m pretty sure it doesn’t last as long as it did when it was new either but I do t really pay enough attention to be certain

Remember to properly clean a new chain first. That seems to be very important if you want the wax to stay on a long time.  I have a series of pots of solvent that I move a new chain between to clean it.  Sounds a lot of faff but it’s super easy

I’m terms of longevity, I don’t quite know.  500k ish I think on my gravel bike.  I just redo it when it starts to get squeaky or if I’m working on the bike anyway.  If I don’t have time to do it properly I might throw some wax from a bottle on just for that ride then to it properly when I get home

In it’s solid state putoline remains a bit ‘greasy’. Based on this observation I think Putoline is a different product entirely.

Yeah, that’s my impression. Paraffin wax-based stuff like MSW is solid and very clean at normal temperatures, no marks, greasiness etc. Putoline seems more like some sort of solid grease that you melt into your chain. So I’m not sure how applicable basic tenets of wax application are to Putoline. I’m not even sure you need to clean the factory grease off the chain before dunking, but with wax that’s a crucial first step.

I know chain wax and Putoline sort of get lumped to together, but I suspect they’re actually fairly different things that happen to share a similar means of application, but I guess if it works, then fine. One of the things I like about actual wax like MSW, is that it’s so clean. If you drop a chain, for example, you can simply pick it up and stick it back on the chainring/cassette and still have pretty much clean fingers.

It’s odd the Putoline doesn’t come with instructions though. I think of it as the chain lube equivalent of Buffalo pile/Pertex clothing.

Never mind, Plutoline – I’ve heard it’s a bit of a dog.

Blutoline works well, but keep it away from Olive Oyl.

Single serving (1l) deep fat fryer with thermostat set to low – 100C or under.  The basket is really handy.

Putoline seems more like some sort of solid grease that you melt into your chain

I reckon its half way between boot polish and lard.  You can vastly minimise or eradicate the mess by fitting the chain, riding around a bit (or a full ride) then spraying WD40 on a rag and rubbing the excess off.  It will last all summer like this, and somehow seems a little more durable in winter – no idea why.

It’s a tricky process, but not hard to get it right.

The key is to planet all out carefully.

 I’m not even sure you need to clean the factory grease off the chain before dunking, but with wax that’s a crucial first step.

Me neither with putoline but I’m just always done it so far as it’s so easy. Might be worth experimenting but I would doubt that Moto riders mess around with solvents first and I think it’s a Moto product

I find that in Peak District offroad winter rides where where everything is dripping wet (or, this year, all rides…) Putoline will last two or three rides max. Saying that, I’ve been having my deep fat fryer set at higher temps than others seem to, more like 120-130deg, so maybe I’l drop that down and see if it makes a difference.

Anyway, my basic method is melt, dunk in basket, leave for a bit, shake basket, leave for a bit, shake basket, lift, shake basket, get as much dripped out as poss whilst it’s in the basket, lift out of the basket with some needle nose pliers, hang on an old nail, give it a few wipes and let it cool.

I think putoline only suffers when it’s raining / very wet for most of the ride and that does make it last one or 2 rides – if it’s dry it’ll last ages

Saying that, I’ve been having my deep fat fryer set at higher temps than others seem to, more like 120-130deg, so maybe I’l drop that down and see if it makes a difference.

I think that it’s more a case of the power / construction of DFF’s that’s the problem rather than the temp settings.

An 800W element bonded directly to a thin aluminum pan will be heating the base upto hundreds of degrees regardless of what the thermocouple attached somewhere up the side says. Fine for a liquid oil where convection sorts out the temperature distribution, but not for melting wax.

Whereas a slow cooker is a heavy ceramic bowl with a 100W element under it takes ages to warm up the wax and it has time to melt more evenly.

My hypothesis is that putoline is a low melting point grease of sorts, which would mean it’s basically oil with a soap mixed in to thicken it and bind it together (grease is halfway between an oil and a wax with a defined melting point, it’s more like jelly which is water bound together with gellatin).  The soap (a calcium or lithium based compound) is what’s broken down by the temperature.  Once it’s degraded it’s gone and you’re left with a softer grease.

My DFF died a few months ago so I’ve been researching / experimenting a bit.

I think you’re right, but then what happens when it’s used on motorbikes? They’re ridden in the rain quite a lot right, and I’d imagine re-Putolining a motorbike chain every ride would be a bit of a faff, so what am I missing?

For putoline I’d probably just use an old saucepan and set the tin in it, maybe put some water in the base of the saucepan to spread the heat, a slow cooker may not get it hot enough and they also live up to their name.

Just on some previous points in this thread on the different types of waxes, putoline is a softer wax/grease, that means it will provide longer lasting corrosion protection, that’s what a lot of riders mean when they say it lasts longer, the downside of this being that it attracts contamination which looks dirty but also works its way into the chain and causes it to wear faster.

Products like GLF (others are available) are designed to be dry on your chain and a hard paraffin that resists contamination, it also contains an additive that burnishes onto the inner surfaces of your chain, improving the chain surface and preventing metal on metal contact. It continues to lubricate way beyond what we think of as dry and needing relube. Unfortunately the only downside to this is that you need to rewax if your chain is wet after a ride but you can do this with no degreasing, maybe rinse with boiling water if it’s really dirty but I rarely do.

Its a much better experience with a small multi cooker on slow cooker setting, takes 30 mins total and you don’t need to do anything other than place the chain on your wax while it melts, give it a swish under the wax after 30 mins and leave it to dry, job done and your chain is perfect again

Over winter, I might do it every other ride.

Comments like that make me think it’s not saving me enough time and effort to be worthwhile, which is a shame, as I want to be a believer.

Over winter, I might do it every other ride.

Well, in my worst conditions it’s been 3-4 rides.  What you have to remember is that in those conditions regular lube doesn’t last a ride, it lasts a few minutes into the first muddy trail, so you are riding the rest of it with grit grinding your chain away.  This doesn’t happen with Putoline as the muddy water just beads off.

Comments like that make me think it’s not saving me enough time and effort to be worthwhile, which is a shame, as I want to be a believer.

What you have to remember is that in those conditions regular lube doesn’t last a ride, it lasts a few minutes into the first muddy trail, so you are riding the rest of it with grit grinding your chain away.  This doesn’t happen with Putoline as the muddy water just beads off.  I’ve got 3 MTBs and a road bike and since going to Putoline ooh, 4 years ago? I have bought maybe 3 chains and no cassettes.

It’s brilliant being able to finish one filthy ride with a smooth quiet drivetrain that doesn’t even need a clean – I just hose the mud off and put the bike away.  And it’s ready next time.

Fine for a liquid oil where convection sorts out the temperature distribution, but not for melting wax.

It does.  My DFF melts a thin layer of wax and heats it up to temp in seconds at which point the thermostat turns it off and the block of wax sits in a small puddle of what is now oil and slowly melts.  It takes a while, but it can be sped up by increasing the set temperature, of course.

{EDIT for the typo} grease is NOT halfway between an oil and a wax with a defined melting point, it’s more like jelly which is water bound together with gellatin.

I think you’re right, but then what happens when it’s used on motorbikes? They’re ridden in the rain quite a lot right, and I’d imagine re-Putolining a motorbike chain every ride would be a bit of a faff, so what am I missing?

It was designed for MX / Trail bikes so I imagine a similar level of maintenance to MTB’s is acceptable (they’d be cleaning their air filter and changing the engine oil every ride anyway.  They’re also physically bigger chains, I imagine it’d take a while for water to get all the way in and flush it all out.  Modern road going motorbikes don’t use Putoline, they use O-ring/x-ring chains so each roller is in effect it’s own little factory sealed bearing.  You only have to apply a light lubrication to the outside so it doesn’t wear against the sprockets.

Comments like that make me think it’s not saving me enough time and effort to be worthwhile, which is a shame, as I want to be a believer.

We’re talking the sort of conditions where you question your sanity being outside and get through multiple sets of brake pads on a ride.  Most winters I’d probably only do it once a month (and do 2-3 bikes at once assuming my riding was slit between the SS, road and commuter).

And if it doesn’t work out on a trip, just drip on whatever wet lube you normally use. It’ll wash off in 5 minutes but it at least reminds you how good Putoline is

Over winter, I might do it every other ride.

It depends on conditions. When it’s dusty and dry I get a couple of hundred miles out of the MTB and rather more out of the road bike.

In the very worst of the winter it can be as little as one ride to keep the chain feeling/sounding good – but for comparison in the same conditions a chain lubed with Squirt would sound awful before half a ride in the worst of the Surrey Hills grinding paste.

Yeah, so when I said,

Over winter, I might do it every other ride.

That’s the type of winter rides where it’s rained solidly for days and doesn’t stop all day while your riding (until I get back to the car and then it usually brightens up…). 

Everything is wet and your in danger of losing the bike in the puddles. Surrey Hills and Peak District would be the type of riding so it’s really the worst conditions for a drivetrain as a few people have alluded to above.

Local (non gritty) rides through winter I’d probably get hundreds of miles before it needed waxing again.

I could probably do it less often than I do. ‘every couple of rides’ would be 80ish miles. I could probably stretch it yo 100+ but I’d rather wax it every 2 or 3 rides just to be on the safe side. Realising that it’s gives dry 5 miles into a 40 mile gritty ride isn’t a good feeling. If I was just off for a local ride for an hour or so, it’s not the end of the world to find out that it needs redoing half way through.

Given the cost of even a mid range cassette and chain these days, I’d prefer to give it some fresh wax more often to try and keep it from wearing out.

I get that it seems like faff but with normal lube, you still end up faffing having to clean and degrease the chain every time it needs relubing which tends to be  after pretty much every wet ride. With putoline, I literally just chuck the chain into a bowl of boiling water and all the crud just falls off.

I guess the only non faff way would be a cheap cassette and chain work some drippy lube and just replace it every 6 months

Plutoline hot wax newby

This is amazing! It’s like “we set our ChatGPT model to generate as much engagement as possible on STW” 😀

But seriously, definitely worth it. Deep fat fryer apparently is undoubtedly the good way to do it, but if you can dodge the OH, it’s perfectly easy to do it on the kitchen stove and dunk your chains in the tin itself.