Orange bikes, love or hate?

it’s an estimate of the cost difference for making a frame in britain vs taiwan.

although, you’d need a very skilled welder, £10/hr wouldn’t do it, you’d need to pay more like £20.

but i suspect the taiwanese welders earn slightly more than £1.25/hour.

i’m not sure that bikes are made in taiwan because it’s cheap, i suspect bikes are made in taiwan because they’re very good at it.

it’s an illustration/estimate of the cost difference for making a frame in britain vs taiwan/china.

simplified to the point of absurdity – making it a pointless illustration

however

Orange 5’s are not expensive because they’re made in britain, they’re expensive because people will pay for them

is correct

If I had to try and put my finger on it i think many peoples objection to the stereotypical Five owner is probably based on the Balls they read in the various comics the Five is a bike that the likes of MBR and MBUK ‘journalists’ consistently seem to get a Fruity Lob on for; as these Mags are primarily targeted at the “Audi driving, IT Managing, South East dwelling, more money than sense” **** it’s quite understandable that peolpe have made the connection between Product ‘A’ and Target audience for crappy Magazine ‘B’ and decided that owners of ‘A’ Must Read ‘B’ ergo they are more than likely to be a complete ‘C’…

Obviously the rule to apply is; Never let actual Facts get in the way of a good Stereotyping/hate campaign…

out of interest Where do we stand on ownership of a 224? or a new style Patiot is there a corelation between the Owners Twatery and the suspension Travel and newness of their Orange? ie:

2012; 224 = Total Cock wand.
2011; Patriot = a complete Tit.
2009: five = common or garden IT Wankist.
2002: Sub 3 = Not so bad, could stand them for an hour or two
1996: Rigid clockwork = Alright bloke, I’d probably buy Him a pint
Owner of the original prototype P7 = “Here, have my left kidney even if you don’t need it, just in case…”

Is that the sort of scale we’re working on?

I’m not going to read all the posts in this thread, obviously …

… but I like Orange bikes

… I also dispair of this forum sometimes

I quite like bikes that are orange, as for Orange bikes; I like that they’re made here but haven’t ridden one. Judging someone on the brand of their bike seems a bit…. meh to me. Not the prettiest bikes, but I quite like the industrial look.

As above I can’t be fannied to read 5 pages of STW hair splitting.

Are you aware that an average chinese/taiwanese aluminium hardtail frame has a more expensive paint/decal job than the cost of manufacturing the bare frame itself? ’tis true.

I cannot disagree that the far east are indeed very good at manufacturing frames. They’ve had years and years of practice making millions. I cannot however, agree that Orange are expensive because people will pay whatever price for them. I’m sure they are trying to be competitively priced as possible but they’re never going to manufacture as many bikes as the big guns, therefore they’re not going to be equally priced.

Out of interest, If Orange Fives were made in Taiwan,China, Cambodia, Vietnam or whatever, and they were let’s say 20/30% cheaper, would things be different or would people still have their issues/opinions?

Cookeaa, stop it, I’m crying with laughter! 😀

Thing is, if it’s taking them more than 4 hours to weld up a frame, they’re doing it wrong.

Tell you what, I’m feeling generous, give ‘em a day.

8 hours x 9 = £72.

Treble it for taxes and hidden costs and extras and things.

£216.

Orange 5’s are not expensive because they’re made in britain, they’re expensive because people will pay for them.

Good luck to them, they’re doing well.

So when you treble it for the “hidden costs and extras and things” I take it your including the R & D, Marketing, Wages – not just the welders but Accts department, marketing team etc then there is also general building costs such as electricity, building rent, insurance etc plus let’s not forget they’re a business so they’re actually trying to make a profit and then after all of that the bike shop has to make a profit it as well because they also have the same overheads as Orange minus the R & D and I would assume and this all comes to your “generous” £216? 🙄

SC moved production to the FE (early nomads were built in the US), the move had no effect on the price of the bike and very little impact on its desirability.

Like most products manufacturing costs have little impact on the list price which is driven by marketing. There is a waiting list for 5s so their pricing is obviously bang on.

My brand new Alpine 160 frame with CCDB cost me a smidge over a grand. Pretty good value compared to the competition 8)

teadrinker – Member

So when you treble it for the “hidden costs and extras and things” I take it your including the etc…

R & D? – Orange?

but anyway, sort of, yes.

i wasn’t trying estimate the cost of making a frame in britain, but trying to estimate the difference in costs between a ‘made in britain’ frame, and a ‘made somewhere with labour costs £9/hr cheaper’ frame.

on the rough guess that: for every worker you have welding, you’ll have 2 workers doing HR, cleaning, admin, etc…

prahran – Member

Out of interest, If Orange Fives were made in Taiwan,China, Cambodia, Vietnam or whatever, and they were let’s say 20/30% cheaper, would things be different or would people still have their issues/opinions?

I cant speak for everyone, but for me, if they were cheaper, I wouldn’t think they were expensive.

This thread’s gone from bad to worse! Now you are slagging off the 5 Spot which just happens to be the other bike I own along with a Five!

I’m not some pretentious **** though who just buys status symbols. I bought the Five second-hand for a very good price when it was less than a year old and the 5 Spot I also bought second-hand as a bare frame again for a price it would have been rude not to.

I bought the 5 Spot as a bike to build up for my grandson and he absolutely loves it, as I do the Five. I think all of the generalisations on here are completely pointless but do agree the thread has been amusing…

Good work cookeaa, you tell those imaginary riders! They’re so full of themselves!

Well my Hemlock’s got about 50 bearings, but they don’t need replaced often, and when they do it takes an hour and about £20.

Actually, on another note. Some frames seem to be right sods for this, really could never be arsed with the ones on my Meta. The Five has the two with little allen key split jobbies, really quick job I’m assuming, certainly looks less intimidating/risky.

Seems like a very small plus to nit pick on, easier has to be better than harder and requiring a variety of weird sized drifts? 🙂

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/sooooo-hemlock-owners-any-tips-to-shift-these-bearings

I love mine, I just wish it was a wee bit easier to change the wee b*****d bearings! Grr, aargh.

😆

LOL @ 10ph for a welder of that calibre LoL

What a thread!
There are hardly any Oranges around here. It must be a regional thing as has been pointed out.
I’ve had a Sub Zero and a 224 and now have a Blood.
I’ll see myself out.

1,350 for a Five frame.

That’s quite a good price considering other companies charge a small fortune for single pivot frames.

nah, thought better of it… I can’t be bothered

Well played Toasty- as it turned out, what made it so difficult was a bit of crap advice I’d been given, doing it this time was a different story. Live and learn eh.

The main pivot’s easier to swap than on a Five btw 😉

Erm Cookeaa. Where does that put me?! 😀

What orange need to do is have someone high up in design or marketing on this forum answering questions/posts.
This would cut down on the negativity and there would be loads who would then jump on the leave them alone bandwagon.
I’m sure I’ve seen it working before!

A friend of mine owns an Orange P7. He’s always wanted an Orange since he was a boy. He finally has his dream bike and in two years he’s ridden it three times. They’re just the sort of bike people lust over.

I’ve never ridden one myself but would like to try some out. I think the 5, Patriot and is it Alpine are really nice looking bikes. Those sharp straight lines look nice compared to a lot of these funny looking hydroformed jobbies.

Like the britishness.
Don’t like the aesthetics of the FS bikes much.
Don’t give a hoot about who else rides one or that they (probably) drive a diesel Audi.
I would buy one if I was in the market and it was the right tool for the job (also applies to Audi)
Well done Orange for apparently succeeding in manufacturing in.the UK
Not sure how you can hate a bike company anyhow. I can understand being disappointed with one

I’ve just balls’d it up but, wheheyyy 224 post’s!!! 😆

Oranges are nice
Oranges are nice
And if you buy them from Asda
They’re quite reasonably priced

what made it so difficult was a bit of crap advice I’d been given, doing it this time was a different story. Live and learn eh.

Clearly all those other people in that thread, and the bike shop you had to resort to taking it to when you failed yourself, all had that bad advice. It’s not that it’s just really hard or anything.

Claim to win the internet:

when they do it takes an hour and about £20.

Truth from previous thread:

I gave up on it and took it to the bike whisperer, who said quote “That was a total ****er of a job” I think eventually he dynamited it out. But all was well after that.

Priceless.

Oranges are nice
Oranges are nice
And if you buy them from Asda
They’re quite reasonably priced

Yeah but they’ll most likely be rotten by the time you get home, you have to check the date on stuff in there, you’re lucky if most of their fruit & Veg has more than about 24hrs to go till it use by date…. Sorry slipped back into STW litteralist pedant mode…

Buy a bike, ride a bike, bicker on a web site…

Ignoring the obvious character flaws of those who buy Orange for a second, where does the great STW Hive mind stand when it comes to the associated personal value and lifestyle statements that go with ownership on various other Brands of bicycle?

Another (Utterly baseless) Proposed scale is needed perhaps:

Giant = An utterly dull Human being, probably works in insurance, fantasises about killing co-workers and/or customers.

Specialized = Party animal, serious drinker, may have been involved in a hit and run.

Canyon = Cheapskate, secretly harbours racist views.

Ellsworth = Gambling addict, significant personal finance issues, may be involved in people trafficing

Kona = Serious anger managment issues, a ball of seething rage, seems ok but could flip at any moment, Has Killed more than once without provocation (and avoided prosecution) Avoid at all costs!

Yeti = Sexual deviant, carrier of at least one STD, sexual contact best avoided.

Santa Cruz = Drug addled monster Coke-head, may start fitting halfway through a ride…

—————————-

I have to say that lot make Five owners seem relatively acceptable….

I think it is a regional thing…

At Easter i was riding the CRC Marathon at Builth Wells and along the way got chatting to a pleasant Welsh chap on a borrowed Giant (he’d broken his own bike earlier in the week) and we were talking about the terrain in our varoius locales and he asked what bikes were popular up by me. Orange 5’s i told him, you can’t hardly ride out with seeing on on the hills – he was quite surprised as he said he only ever saw them at a Welsh trail centre when he paid an occasional visit to such. Apparently where he rides Giants are really popular.

Spot on cookeaa 😆

Cookeaa… brilliant.

Yeti = Sexual deviant, carrier of at least one STD, sexual contact best avoided.

😀

I have three for four mates with Yeti’s… just the thought makes me laugh. They couldn’t be further from that description but hilarious anyway!

cookeaa PMSL 😀

muddy, some of the local variation may come from club/shop affiliation. Cyclepedia in Cardiff effectively run the popular and successful JIF club (alumni include a certain G Thomas). Cyclepedia are a big Giant dealer, regulars get a discount there, people see their mates on bikes and/or borrow them, hey presto you get a group of 20 all riding Giants.

I live in Halifax and funnily enough don’t actually see that many orange bikes out and about round here.

It probably depends what you want from a bike and where you ride. There is a reason they are proular up here in the lakes…….they are great on the rough stuff!

This comes from a 1×5, 2xp7 household 😀

Toasty – Member

Clearly all those other people in that thread, and the bike shop you had to resort to taking it to when you failed yourself, all had that bad advice. It’s not that it’s just really hard or anything.

Seems quite probable- the bad advice was repeated in the thread after all so at least one othe rperson had it, and I passed it on to the bike shop where it also caused problems- should have left them to get on with it tbh.

But, as I said, I’ve just done it again and it took about an hour, so.

I’m pretty fond of mine…

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Pfft mincer…. Pre jump 😉

What a pathetic topic, no wonder people slate this site, full of ****.ride what you want, ride what you can afford but more importantly don’t judge people for the bike they ride or the car they drive.too much typing and not enough riding,prob due to lack of skills.

What a pathetic topic, no wonder people slate love this site

fixed that for you!

Audi in grey – check
Sub Five – check
C-16R – Check

Living the dream.