On balance, would we be better off if the current Labour party were in power?

THM I went to the lib dem article and here is myth 1 – my bold

Myth 1: UK public spending is reducing

So keen has been the Coalition and Labour (for their own different reasons) to talk up the extent of the Government’s spending cuts that the reality has been forgotten. Public spending is going up year-on-year under the Coalition, rising from £690bn in 2010-11 to £744bn (+8%) by 2014-15. If we allow for inflation, there will be a modest reduction: from £690bn to £668bn (-3%) by 2014-15.
I dont think the word myth means what they think it means and if you want sense like that then you are welcome to it.

Its hard to argue there have been no cuts given the vast swathes of redundancies within the public sector and the number employed may be a better measure of cuts than actual budgets.

In truth we’d be a whole heap better off with consensus politics rather than the pendulum swing back and forth between two opposing doctrines. A term of 5 years is simply not sufficient to do anything of real note which will give long term benefits.

Until we get that we are doomed to a situaion where one shower gets in and tries to undo what the previous shower did, then the other gets in and only to reverse it all again.

A massive shame that the last election and the events prior to it did not manage to shoulder charge the established status quo off the ball and give us all an opportunity to rewrite the rule book and have a go at scoring.

I live in hope of a middle of the road politico developing gonads and actually grasping the will of the vast majority of British people who are surprisingly moderate and turning that will into some common sense policies.

JY – it is hard to argue indeed as it means focusing on facts not media-led rhetoric. Look at the facts in front of us, including those that you have emphasised in bold. There will be a modest reduction in real terms by 2014-15 (although I thought this was actually starting in 2013 but hey ho!). Of course, there have been cuts in some areas (my family has been affected directly) but that does not mean that one can conclude that the current recession has been caused (or even exacerbated) by either austerity or large scale cuts in government spending. It makes for convenient headlines and silly debates on here/elsewhere but does little to solve the problems faced in the UK, Europe and elsewhere. Hence the LibDem conclusions that I chose to highlight.

The UK and other governments are making plenty of policy mistakes but that doesn’t give us the excuse to accuse them of things they haven’t done, as pleasing as that may be for lazy analysis/headline writers.

To repeat:

It suits the political parties, and it suits the media. But as a result myths are taking hold — that the Coalition is embarking on ‘slash and burn’ austerity, or that the national debt is being wiped clear — which distort the reality of the situation. And this only makes it harder to begin grappling with our problems.

Its also worth pointing out that the line “If we allow for inflation, there will be a modest reduction” is very much dependent upon predicted inflation levels, actual rates of inflation may well differ, leading to a potential situation where there have been no real terms cuts at all…

JY – it is hard to argue indeed as it means focusing on facts not media-led rhetoric. Look at the facts in front of us, including those that you have emphasised in bold. There will be a modest reduction in real terms by 2014-15 (although I thought this was actually starting in 2013 but hey ho!). Of course, there have been cuts in some areas (my family has been affected directly) but that does not mean that one can conclude that the current recession has been caused (or even exacerbated) by either austerity or large scale cuts in government spending.

Lots of government departments/agencies etc have anticipated the cuts that have been announced but haven’t come in yet though, and are already laying off staff, cutting back on outsourcing contracts, reducing budgets, not replacing people that leave/retire etc – so that it’s not all happening in one sudden jolt.

Are you really trying to suggest there is no possible impact on the economy from any of this, especially in areas where the public sector (and businesses with large public sector contracts) is a big share of overall employment?

No, of course not. Merely pointing out that this is not the principle reason for the problems we are in. One should not confuse micro cuts with macro ones across total government spending. However, there is no doubt that anticipation/expectation of this has an effect in advance.

The Tories try to pretend that they are cutting the deficit and the Labour Party pretend that the government have cut too far, too fast (sound familiar). Both are being economical with the truth (if you will pardon the pun).

But lets put the current fiscal policy into perspective (despite it being looser than that proposed by labour) and focus on the far more difficult challenges of triple deleveraging and the crisis in Europe (our major trading partner). Massive monetary easing proposed by C/LD & Labour have very limited impact in that context and yet that is the major thrust of all party consensus policies. Hence the title of this thread!

so the myth of cuts is in fact true then despite what they headline said in the report you expect me to read….not impressed and not reading further – i did skim though [ the article not your post ..I hang on your every word 😀 ]

There will be a modest reduction in real terms by 2014-15 (although I thought this was actually starting in 2013 but hey ho!). Of course, there have been cuts in some areas

I would be delighted if you explain the employment rates within the public sector to further show the extent of “modest cutts” what is 1/4 million? More? etc

leading to a potential situation where there have been no real terms cuts at all

A quick check of inflation rates since 2010 would tend to suggest that is just staraw clutching..it could happen but it wont given the inflation rate

Its also worth pointing out that the line “If we allow for inflation, there will be a modest reduction” is very much dependent upon predicted inflation levels, actual rates of inflation may well differ, leading to a potential situation where there have been no real terms cuts at all…

So if government spending is not going down, despite reducing funding to the NHS, increasing tuition fees, cutting benefits and making thousands redundant, then what was the point of all that, and where is the money going?

C’mon JY – there is no confusion between reduction in spending in some areas (that always happens) with increases in the total. You were an economist (with a good grade if I recall correctly at A level) so you can understand that. If you dont want to read the article to see what it says, then that’s your choice/loss 😉

Rising UN is not proof of cuts in government spending. The real issue is the fact that the government overestimated (vastly) the ability of the private sector to absorb public sector job losses. But that is a different story altogether – albeit an on-going one.

Read the article on the drivers of UK growth 2000-09 and them take Labour’s comments on a balanced economy with the correct level of scepticism. What exactly happened to the balance of the UK economy under their watch. And to manufacturing……?

So if government spending is not going down, despite reducing funding to the NHS, increasing tuition fees, cutting benefits and making thousands redundant, then what was the point of all that, and where is the money going?

no point and to the increasing number of un and underemployed?

l. You were an economist (with a good grade if I recall correctly at A level)

i have an A at a level and rarely understand what you are on about. But having said that I was taught be Jaqui Smith so might have been nu lab brainwashed!

anagallis_arvensis – Member
i have an A at a level and rarely understand what you are on about

A-A 😀 😀

So you are a Worcesteshire Lad? I never knew that JS was a teacher and H of Economics. Adding up expenses and keeping balance of income and expenditure should have been easy for her. I wonder what went wrong? 😉

West Midlands or Worcestershire depends on how posh i want to be! She taught me at high school in Hagley, she was a good teacher too.

😀 Ditto for me but with the “bear and ragged staff” across the border!! West Midlands really doesn’t have much of a ring to it, does it!! Driven down the Hagley Rd from B’ham towards Worcs home of my g’parents many times!!

Both red and blue teams amount to much the same thing.