Mercedes experts assemble

I need a car to replace my T5 van with something for occasional bike lugging, kids camping and carrying stuff.  Very limited use, less than 10k miles per year but each trip will be a minimum of 60 miles more like 250.

I recall when someone asked about a wafting car there were some Merc experts on the forum.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?sort=most-recent&advertising-location=at_cars&body-type=Estate&make=Mercedes-Benz&maximum-mileage=80000&min-engine-power=250&model=E%20Class&postcode=tw165ha&price-to=12000&flrfc=1#202405029285495

Would any of these fulfill my requirements?  I would like to run the car into the ground and get 300k miles on the clock before diesels are banished from the world.  I don’t really like driving so would like some luxury.  I definitely don’t want to drive into City centres, I have utility cycles and a motorbike for  short journeys and personal transport and I prefer traveling by train and boat.

Thanks

For under 10k miles, wouldn’t a petrol be better than diesel?

I am in a similar position. I am thinking something like a petrol Passat, but I am adding in some trips into ulezs to the brief.

Petrol c class Merc with the 1.8 turbo will do 40mpg on a run. Beware the timing chains though, they tend to go around 100k miles and it’s a 1k bill

See also Volvo V70, you’ll get the bulletproof D5 engine and galvanized body for similar cost/age/mileage to the Mercs. I have two Volvos with 200k+ on each and still going strong.

If you seek waftyness I would not go for the AMG versions. They also can be more problematical and wxpensive to fix.

220SE with 9 speed gearbox is waftalicious 😉  50-60 mpg is average on long runs depending on adherance to speed limits etc..

Petrol c class Merc with the 1.8 turbo will do 40mpg on a run. Beware the timing chains though, they tend to go around 100k miles and it’s a 1k bill

1k bill if you catch it before it takes a shit.

My colleagues jumped the chain 2 weeks ago. He’s got a new engine going in 1300+vat for supply and his tame garage is fittingm don’t expect much change from 2k on that 106k miles.

PS gearbox oil and filter pan sevice should be done around 80k.

PPS also bearings on camshaft follower thingys were pants, replacements that last are not expensive. if you leave them to tick away they will eat the camshaft.

PPPS camchain is an engine out job, 10- 15 hours labour likely…

I’m sure someone on here has an older e class , or did. They said avoid the big wheels.

Ive got a 2019 e220d. It’s got loads of space, bigger, brighter cabin space than equivalent BMW.

Handles ok for such a big heavy car. Does between 47-60mpg. Engines go on forever

2019 car not as well screwed together as equivalent BMW

On the OM 651 4 cylinder diesel, the timing chain tensioner might be a problem and if you ignore the rattling on startup long enough it will break the guides and the engine might need to come out. If you get the rattle and catch it early then it’s just a new redesigned tensioner £400.  Even if the chain wears it can be changed without the engine out.

However the cars in that search were all v6s which don’t have this issue afaik.

AMG sport is just a body kit, less comfortable wheels and flappy paddle shifters. The engines are the same. The actual AMG car would be the E63 with 580bhp petrol V8.

I felt I needed to change the suspension bushings on my very similar car after 100k, possibly because it has spent most of that on stupidly skinny tyres.

Great car though.

I have a 08 E class . The 3.0 ltr V6. Chain is still an issue. Imo it’s the extended service interval that gums up the tensioner and the chain goes slack and jumps or snaps .
Tensioner is on front of engine on mine but it’s still dismantling the front end for a chain swap.
40mpg is achievable on a decent run
The injection seat seals also are an issue, not as common as the 4 pot engine but still occurs .

If you buy one get one with parking sensors, heated seats , small wheels and maybe power boot.

CLS350 owner here. It’s far more comfortable and better built than the BMW 5er it replaced but that waftiliciosness comes at a price if you like to make progress. It drinks more than Oliver Read so I’d get a 2.1 if I was buying again.

Thanks all for your help.  Can only see 2 V70s with similar mileage one is 2003 and one part service history.

Are the Merc’s galvanised ? Do they suffer from rust.

On thirsty and diesel cant imagine it will be any worst than the T5?  Again timing chain no more problematic than the VW belt?

So is that big fat wafty yes from the Forum ?

Rear subframe issues on c class from 10 and E class from 11 my.
Idiot producer stamped hole in metal for drainage but did from outside to in . So there was a few mm radius lip which meant they didn’t drain .
Rest of the car pretty good .
Be aware 08 vintage Volvo is a Mondeo with possible a PSA 2.0 engine. So get a D5 if going down that road.

I’m getting rid of my E class as it’s at the point of needing big service , probably chain plus some gearbox work as it’s harsh for the first 2 minutes of driving plus it short shifts through a gear.
Blue motion Passat is way more economical but also rusty in weird areas that you would not expect a 12 plate vw to be eaten by tin worm

Anecdotally the subframe issue is covered by Mercedes, even without a full MB service history.

Yes this is true, mine ( 61 plate CLS) was done for free by the local Mercedes dealer, although the problem only reared its head when the car failed its MOT, I had to wait three months for a subframe, Mercedes would not lend me a car in the meantime so I had to borrow cars from friends, if you buy a C, E, CLS or SLK from around 2010 onwards check the subframe has been done or get it checked by Mercedes, if it’s spannered they replace it free of charge,  a friend of mine had his actually snap so a proper safety issue.

Are the Merc’s galvanised ? Do they suffer from rust

Mine seems to be.  I have had my sub frame checked by Merc and they say it’s ok, but I’m a bit disappointed as now I have to remove it and swap all the suspension bushings (for that new car feel – they’re not actually failed) whereas I could have got it done for free if there’d been rust.

They are replacing them for free if there’s an issue. Anecdotally on some cars (C-class of a certain age I think) they aren’t even checking, but on some they check.

some gearbox work as it’s harsh for the first 2 minutes of driving

Mine is slightly clunky at first, then the changes get a bit mushy. I actually think this is the flex discs getting sloppy – I’ve got some more to fit, I’ll let you know.

I’ve considered a C estate, E estate or even one of those fancy pants CLAs but decided against, for some of the reasons above.
Obvs the E has air suspension which will fail and sag at some point. The newer E class estates had a mandatory software update due to MB having to satisfy a legal requirement over their hooky emissions data, which meant that cars with the update can’t reach top gear within the legal speed limit. You can manually change up but then the software will change down again, unless you speed up to nearer 80 (as that’s many drivers’ default m-way speed it mightnt be a problem but still). Lots of v pi$$ed off owners putting a car in for a service, getting the update, and now finding that at 70mph their engine is revving higher and burning more fuel as it won’t shift into top. So much for saving the planet.

C class, just not enough boot space, as an estate buyer I want maximum practicality.

Lots of quality moans and niggles on the owners forums.

I’ve got a little Mercedes and things like replacement wing mirrors are horrifically expensive, and things break more often than you’d expect, so much for German engineering.

Also, a bit of a snobby image, unless 10 years old +

Lots of v pi$$ed off owners putting a car in for a service, getting the update, and now finding that at 70mph their engine is revving higher and burning more fuel as it won’t shift into top

Can’t say it’s pissed me off.

Does only change in to 9th gear at about indicated 76mph, but then it will sit there at about 1,200rpm doing nearly 60mpg

Molgrips, just an FYI if they replace your subframe you still have to pay for any bushings, suspension arms etc that need changing, although I realise that obviously it’s the labour costs that are going to sting, alternately just wait a year or two, your subframe will have rotted by then 🙂

if they replace your subframe you still have to pay for any bushings, suspension arms etc that need changing

Yes, for the arms and whatnot, but there are a load of bushings that are pressed into the subframe, and they all come as one part so they’d be part of the freebie.

I’ve been under the car preparing to remove it today.  For the record, whilst there’s surface rust on the suspension parts the actual body looks really good.

So much for saving the planet.

Comprehension fail.

I have a T5 and a c180 c class estate. The car was bought just to be a car but it’s a lovely thing to waft around in. Only thing I’d change it would be an e class or a CLS estate. First Merc and won’t be the last – totally taken by them.

whooo woh woh! What’s all this about rear subframe rot?

We’ve got a 2012 C250 CGI, 1.8T petrol, AMG line auto estate and I’ve never heard anything before.

It’s a great car, really easy to work on and cheap parts, even direct from Mercedes.

What should I look for?! I’ve had the rear bumper off a couple of years ago when I fitted a towbar and it all looked pretty average for a 10 year old car with 105k on the clock.

Your, worryingly.

@mintyjim what you just experienced it exactly the problem with the internet. The people who shout loudest, are the ones who are heard. Dont worry.

*Some* cars are affected. Many, many, many others are not. And even if yours does become affected, Merc change it for free (not warranty, ‘goodwill’, but they have been doing them). Do not panic about it one bit. Yours, Multiple Mercedes owner.

As for the OP –

I have had lots of very fun, exciting, sporty and ‘petrolheady’ cars but I maintain that this is the best overall car I’ve ever had at just being ‘ a damn good car’. Very reliable, huge, fantastic to drive, plenty of power (OM642). I miss it hugely. Possibly even more than the plastic one. You’ll get a great one for 10k I bet (make sure its got 6 cylinders and Avant Garde Spec/17″ wheels!)

I’ve a e class 220 estate 63 that’s done about 105k. It really wafts along, it’s got enough power for me.

It had the rear subframe done when it failed it’s mot this year, by merc free of charge. It also has an intermittent leak in the rear air suspension so some mornings it’ll be squatting – currently it’s not annoying enough to get it fixed – you sit for a couple of mins on start up and everything pumps up to normal. I think I’d get it fixed if I had any long journeys (scotland/ france) planned.

Fix it yourself. I did mine . If you don’t you will kill the compressor pump . Then it won’t drive anywhere .
I will help you if you’re south of England based.
I bought a £90 Chinese airbag and it’s been perfect ever since .
The solenoid seals fail up the top of the solenoid itself gets tired.
It’s a mornings work . You will need a pp9 battery and a twin plug of a stereo.

How do you access the connector at the top? Inside the car? I cannot see mine from underneath.

What should I look for?!

I will send some pics later, mine is in bits atm.  Not that the suspension bushings have failed, I just like the car enough to spend the effort keeping it in like-new condition.

EDIT looking at the spares my air bag does not look like it has a connection on it, just an air line. There’s a cluster of connectors with air lines which might be valves under the rear bumper, I wonder if it’s been moved off the air spring on my car?

EDIT2 yes it has.  The valves are in the block behind the bumper.

@molgrips as far as I’m aware thats the normal setup – single airline to the airbag, and a small solenoid/valve block central connection, controlled by the ride height sensor. Pump in, 2x airbags out.  Certainly thats how mine was. Dissasembling, cleaning and re-making all the connections at the valve block solved the occasional sag on mine – its not always a leaky airbag.

It may be that cars with full airmatic (front and rear with lift/driver control) have a difference setup to the regular estate rear self levelling.

One of the biggest things I miss on my current C compare to the E.

Ah right. I’ll try the 9v battery on the connector then, if I can work out which pins are which. I bought the service manual thingy but I need to find somewhere to install it as my PC doesn’t support virtualisation.

You power the pins to deflated the bag .. so it goes floppy and you can withdraw it from the swing arm

Even easier than that. The air lines are right behind the bumper, I just undid them with a 10mm spanner – pssssshh

On the subject of rusty subframes, I just had my 2014 80k mile E class inspected and they found no concerns or any rust that looks bad enough to develop into a problem anytime soon.

On the subject of rusty subframes, I just had my 2014 80k mile E class inspected and they found no concerns or any rust that looks bad enough to develop into a problem anytime soon.

I recall looking at this a few months back and it does seem to be there’s not really any obvious clustering of which cars are affected or not so it’s hard to work your way around it with clever buying.  My biggest worry would be catching it before it’s unsafe so there’s time to get the replacement frame in before it’s unusable. With Merc seemingly standing behind the repairs I’d just be wanting to get it checked regularly if I was buying one.

As for the OP’s suggestion I just looked at the insurance group on the V6 wagons… 44E that’s going to be a little spendy 😬 even for the restrained, middle aged among us.

My biggest worry would be catching it before it’s unsafe

It’s a very well known problem though, so you can ask your MOT tester to take a look or you can take it to Merc who know exactly what to check for. They will probably charge, but it might be worth it for peace of mind. They didn’t charge me because turns out there was a recall on some bolts so they did that and checked at the same time.

If you buy a car and it’s deemed good, you can get it rust-treated for £300 or so at a specialist place.  They will probably know the score as well but just check with them that they spray in the sub-frame holes.  If they go they go from the inside out, but this is a totally common problem on classic cars for things like sills etc so there is a large body of knowledge still out there regarding rust prevention.

As for the OP’s suggestion I just looked at the insurance group on the V6 wagons… 44E that’s going to be a little spendy

Wait til you see the fuel bill. They are pretty inefficient it seems.  Doomanic on here has the same car as me but with the v6 rather than my twin turbo 4cyl and he seems to be using 50% more fuel on a trip.

My car is only worth £1500, so my V6 insurance is £360pa. Fully comprehensive without protected ncb. 12000 miles a year social and commuting.
OBC currently reads 39,3 average mpg . Not horrendous but switching to a Passat TDI which will be nearer 70mpg , noticeably better.