What are you, personally, going to do to try to make the government act meaningfully on the climate emergency?

I’m going to cause some serious disruption and glue myself to the wine aisle at Waitrose

It’s a desperate, angry, last-ditch attempt at getting governments to do *something* to save the planet.

Indeed and it’s poorly conceived. Because public opinion will go against them, and that makes it very easy for a populist government to ignore because it will side with the majority public opinion.

As to what I’m doing? Nothing, because I really have no idea what to do. I would be doing stuff like this if I thought it’d work though.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but shouldn’t that Range Rover be equipped with active safety braking etc etc. Probably is, but given the number of electrical faults these have, the woman is lucky she could actually get it off the drive, oh and then to be stopped.

I think there is sometimes a minimum speed required for it to activate, as demonstrated numerous times at press launches when they run over the journalist.

Well I’m going to go against the stw grain and and say I have zero sympathy whatsoever for the daft prick sitting in front of the car.

Having read the initial comments I had assumed she’d driven hard at a protester. I watched the video, it’s a small nudge. No way she’ll get done for dangerous driving , and rightly so.

As for their cause… i agree with it but their methods are doing far more harm than good. They lost me at the point I saw a video of a woman pleading with them to let them through so she could visit their ill mother in hospital. They point blank refused.

Places that wealthy people, typically men, frequented were also burnt and destroyed whilst left unattended so that there was little risk to life, including cricket pavilions, horse-racing pavilions, churches, castles and the second homes

If Insulate Britain switched to those as targets I’m sure their actions would gain more popular support…

I think disrupting the road network as a tactic is a mistake – people don’t vent their frustration on the government for not giving in to the reasonable demands of IB, they just vent their frustration at IB and make it easy for the government to divert all the media attention and blame to IB.

That said I don’t know what would be effective, years of reasoned debate have proved largely fruitless so some sort of direct action is really the only option left but direct action against government (e.g. disrupting the Houses of Parliament) isn’t really an option these days

Nothing, because I really have no idea what to do.

Maybe get an idea, before criticising those who have decided to do *something, anything* while they still can?

protesters need to remember that they need to change and influence popular opinion if they want to actually effect change. I’m not sure how blocking roads actually helps with that objective

Exactly this. Stopping people going about their every day business, isn’t really gathering support for the group, even if many people agree with the cause. Not everyone in their car is a lazy entitled person willing to run people over on a school run. Some are missing hospital appointments, medical emergencies and the like. The protestors need to be a little more inventive IMO.

Because public opinion will go against them

You keep saying this, Molgrips, until there are opinion polls it’s far from given.

I’ve been pleasantly surprised by how much popular support there is for protest movements in France and Germany. Opinion polls told Macron which of the gilets jaunes’ demands had popular support and those were the ones that were acted on by the government.

The German withdrawal from nuclear was very much driven by protests and popular demand. If Germany goes back into nuclear it will be in response to popular demand not against it.

I watched the video, it’s a small nudge. No way she’ll get done for dangerous driving , and rightly so.

@piha – I’m sure some were to start with; I’m sure others joined the thinking as the issues were discussed and debated. Why were those issues so regularly debated? Because women were chaining themselves to stuff, throwing themselves in front of horses etc. If all these men were ardent supporters of women getting the vote, then why did women not have the vote? The first (?) campaigns for womens votes started in the 1860s. Even when some women got the vote in 1918 it was some ten years later before they were able to vote on equal terms – that doesn’t seem like an issue the every husband and father of a woman had as their no 1 priority!

There are analogies here – people have been politely lobbying for climate action for years and getting lip service. The majority of people agree government should act – but (along with other governments) they do little of substance and show no leadership, credible opposition parties don’t seem to have more substantial proposals. How then do the citizens get this on the agenda? Lobbying? V’s commercial interests? Creating their own political party (in a country who’s politics are biased around a two party system)? Or by making their voices heard in the media? You can of course argue whether that is working or not – but it’s probably at least causing some special advisor or junior minister to take a look… albeit the response seems to be how can we ban these inconvenient people rather than how can we resolve the issue.

You keep saying this, Molgrips, until there are opinion polls it’s far from given.

Of course not, but this is my feeling on the subject.

Protestors need public support. As I said, if you start protesting on something that there is already latent support for OR you can piggyback some other reservoir of support or sentiment then you are already onto a winner. That’s why WWF use pandas, leopards, elephants and other cool animals on their posters because people love cool animals and it gets support. People are already wary of nuclear power so you can exploit that if you want to reduce nuclear generation. Even if you are actually secretly promoting coal.

Insulation doesn’t have the same emotive content, so when you start doing something that pisses pepole off and gets into the news, and other people read it and sympathise with the motorists instead of the protesters, you’re just wasting your time and possibly even setting your cause back, which is the opposite of what we need.

25% of tory party donations are from the construction industry. The explains how they are still getting away with creating shit boxes that leak energy like a sieve, despite insane house prices.

I’m going to cause some serious disruption and glue myself to the wine aisle at Waitrose

You are Ollie Smith and I claim my £5.

watched the video, it’s a small nudge. No way she’ll get done for dangerous driving , and rightly so.

I beg to differ. There’s no way that intentionally driving a vehicle to cause contact with a pedestrian doesn’t meet the legal definition of dangerous driving (all the more so if you are angry at the time and the pedestrian is sitting down and unable to quickly get out your way).

I have no doubt that the law will consider the protestor to be a pedestrian.

Now whether the protestors will be willing to complain and risk possible contempt of court proceedings (I’m unclear exactly what the court order stops them doing) or other charges may be a different issue.

when you start doing something that pisses pepole off and gets into the news, and other people read it and sympathise with the motorists instead of the protesters, you’re just wasting your time and possibly even setting your cause back, which is the opposite of what we need.

Exactly. And this discussion is mainly about the nature of the protests, not the reasons for them, which kind of highlights their failure to communicate their message as effectively as possible.

I have zero sympathy whatsoever for the daft prick sitting in front of the car.

But ‘daft pricks’ like that are kind of the reason why you enjoy many rights within our society. Such as free speech…

You keep saying this, Molgrips, until there are opinion polls it’s far from given.

Available polling suggest unpopular getting more unpopular. There are very few things you can get more than two thirds to agree on.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2021/10/08/three-weeks-motorway-climate-change-protests-publi

Edukator – are you confusing Britain with the functioning democracy of Germany or the emotional passion of France?

protesters need to remember that they need to change and influence popular opinion if they want to actually effect change.

Maybe they consider that they are not at the point of influencing popular opinion and are just trying to get the issue of insulation into peoples’ skulls.

As for alternaive tactics, well XR tried singing songs and being nice this summer, and the police targetted their musicians and the Beeb refused to report on their protests, so IB clearly felt they had to be more extreme to get the message out.

Thanks for the poll, Tomd, even if it is YouGouv It’s interesting that support has declined. Perhaps an indication about how the media are playing it.

It smacks very much of “gotta support the troops” propaganda in the Iraq war. In that case people against the war were duped into supporting the troops (which meant they were supporting the war they were against). In this case supporters of environmental issues are being duped into objecting to protesters because of the inconvenience they cause (which means they are against Insulate Britain, a cause they are in favour of).

Whatever the methods insulation is now an issue the public is more aware of. A burning tower block because of sub-standard materials has given insulation a bad press, it’s a subject that needs a higher profile.

In this case supporters of environmental issues are being duped into objecting to protesters because of the inconvenience they cause

I don’t think anyone is being ‘duped’. Insulate Britain’s actions are just pissing loads of people off, not actually highlighting their cause very effectively. Same as how some XR protests ended up being counter-productive, as I’ve mentioned earlier. Some people will have lost jobs as a result of XR protestors actions; it’s all well and good supporting a ’cause’ from a position of privilege or where you aren’t personally affected, but if you’ve lost your job etc, you aren’t going to be very sympathetic. As before; people have bills to pay, appointments they need to get to. Hindering them in their progress isn’t going to win hearts and minds. So they need to come up with a better solution. I think all such actions will achieve, will be even more clamping down on the right to protest. So we’ll all lose. Should we allow a tiny minority to be allowed to damage all our rights?

As for alternaive tactics

This. Distributed disturbance of every day life is exactly the way to get noticed now. All other forms of protest are being shut down, muted, legislated against, or just ignored. I hate this kind of protest because it effects people indiscriminately, but they have arrived at it for a reason… the more we criminalise protest, and the more we shield legislators and the public from traditional protests, the more we push protestors to use these kinds of means.

I am 100% against anyone sitting in the road.

If their actions affect others livelihood then they get all they deserve as life is already hard as it is.

So you’re quite happy for someone protesting by sitting in the road to be murdered by someone driving a car? After all, “they deserve all they get”.

What’s worse are the people cheering on her assault and the fact that the police won’t do anything. This woman would almost certainly be prepared to knock you off your bike if she deemed you to be holding her up in any way.

Made me feel sick watching that video and the fact that you’re condoning the physical injury of a peaceful protester is disgusting.

Should we allow a tiny minority to be allowed to damage all our rights?

Hook, line and sinker. You’ve swallowed all the narrative. If you were talking about the Tory party and their lobby group mates you might have a point.

Some people will have lost jobs as a result of XR protestors actions

I believe this to be a load of wheelbarrow content, if you’re moving bull manure from one place to another, in a wheelbarrow.

What are you, personally, going to do to try to make the government act meaningfully on the climate emergency?

I can’t force the government to do anything but I do the following:
I walk much more than drive as much as I can now for short journeys. My current car is a very economical small engine. I don’t use the heating at home unless I’m still cold with all the windows closed and layers on. I recycle everything that I can.

Some people will have lost jobs as a result of XR protestors actions

I think its far worse than that since the protesters have been blocking ambulances too.

Is it just me that sees the irony of an overweight parent driving a huge polluting RR on the school run, objecting to environmental protesters???

“Ive got to get buy 11 y/o to school!!” Walking obviously not an option.

I can’t force the government to do anything but I do the following:
I walk much more than drive as much as I can now for short journeys. My current car is a very economical small engine. I don’t use the heating at home unless I’m still cold with all the windows closed and layers on. I recycle everything that I can.

Exactly the point – your actions have precisely zero effect, hence the need to do something with wider impact. Hint: a strongly worded letter to the local paper probably isn’t enough.

But it’s not precisely zero effect is it? Clearly he is reducing his CO2 footprint by a measurable amount. We just need more people, particularly those will some decision making ability to do the same.

poly

I beg to differ. There’s no way that intentionally driving a vehicle to cause contact with a pedestrian doesn’t meet the legal definition of dangerous driving (all the more so if you are angry at the time and the pedestrian is sitting down and unable to quickly get out your way).

I have no doubt that the law will consider the protestor to be a pedestrian.

Now whether the protestors will be willing to complain and risk possible contempt of court proceedings (I’m unclear exactly what the court order stops them doing) or other charges may be a different issue.

meh she can just say she ‘has no recollection‘ and walk away free

But it’s not precisely zero effect is it?

Sure but the question was actually

“What are you, personally, going to do to try to make the government act meaningfully on the climate emergency?”

so reducing his CO2 footprint by the square root of bugger all doesn’t really do anythkng in terms of government action.

Oh look a poll by you.gov, beyond risible. They are a Tory front organisation and they poll in a way that supports the status quo. Mori or any other polling company would be more believable but no one from the government will commission them as they may not get the answers they desire.

They are disrupting the lives of the wrong people. It’s Westminster They should be blockading, not the people going about their normal lives.

You have noticed that the current Government are trying to “silence” protests, and can effectively prevent people from protesting in numbers outside Parliament right? It is inevitable that these sort of protests are going to impact “ordinary folk” because they vote for the very politicians who have placed barriers around themselves so they are not inconvenienced by protesters.

Places that wealthy people, typically men, frequented were also burnt and destroyed whilst left unattended so that there was little risk to life, including cricket pavilions, horse-racing pavilions, churches, castles and the second homes

If Insulate Britain switched to those as targets I’m sure their actions would gain more popular support…

How do you think that will work out? There will be Police and more even more justification for private security firms to “protect” property…even in previously public areas.

The story is about insulation…insulate to help the environment, and the increasing layers of insulation the politicians and the wealthy will use between us and them.

The irony of course is the whole heat pump/ban gas boilers “policy” that the Government announced a few days ago would make more sense to the public if insulating homes was also part of it. Its almost as if they just chose heat pumps because they didn’t want to be seen siding with insulate Britain.

I know that I’d much rather sit and have a chat with the protesters than the chubby chav in the Range Rover.

Question … can we only attack annoying protesters if they are on the road? Or can we assault them wherever they are holding their protests?

I missed the bit in my driving theory where it said you can slowly drive into a human if they are on the road for a reason you disagree with.

Its almost as if they just chose heat pumps because they didn’t want to be seen siding with insulate Britain.

Insulation is old hat and the overall concept/process/product is run of the mill. Heat pumps and the like are more ‘modern’ and thus more open to entry from ‘consultancies’ and new entrants who can shape the rules or refuse to invest. Venture capital and the like. Much more to the ENP’s liking.

And don’t forget all the plucky little startup legal firms cold calling ripped off customers in five years time when they start breaking down.

Deregulate to accumulate.

it’s a small nudge. No way she’ll get done for dangerous driving , and rightly so.

You’ll be ok with someone in a car/bus/HGV giving you a small nudge next time you’re out on your bike then?

To be fair, subsidies for heat pumps (no matter how small) should help with scaling up and reducing prices long term. But it’s a side issue compared to legislating and funding the refit or replacement of social and private rented homes, and updating planning for new builds so as not to add to the problem.

Look at scandinavia.

Why the resistance to doing something? Why wouldn’t you want a more sustainable home?

Because it costs more money? Well it doesn’t after the payback period does it?

Why are are all so short termist?

Protestors need public support.

Neither the Suffragettes or the Mass Trespass had much public support at the time.