Done a couple of enduros this year and really enjoyed them.

On my own local trails I feel pretty good and looking at Strava times I’m up there on most descents (both steep stuff and longer pedally stuff).

But racing I’m up against some seriously quick sponsored etc riders. Now I’m well aware I’ll never be troubling the top places but comfortably breaking into the top 50% from being 2/3 or 3/4 down the field would be nice. Overall it seems a case of making up a minute or two over 4/5 stages.

So… how?
– training/getting fitter? I’m good at longer rides but short intervals where its giving 101% for a few minutes absolutely kills me. How do I improve on that? Just go out and plod and then give it all for a few minutes before goig back down to plodding pace? I’ve started doing a bit of running as well – same with that? Sprinting 100m every kilometre/mile?

– skills? I feel reasonably competant on the bike and the skills course I went on a few years back I didn’t feel I learnt an awful lot on as it was more focused on normal riding than racing. Looking at the lines some of the fast guys were taking at the weekend just gone, it seems that I need help with spotting lines. Does anyone know someone who actually races and provides skills courses as well? Agreeing with Mugboo at the weekend about this but when we ride, we ride for fun so look for stuff to jump etc whereas I need to be more focused on getting down a trail in the fastest time rather than the funnest.

– the bike? Currently on a slackened, late 26″ Five with Devilles, 1×10, dropper etc. I suspect the bike is fine and its maybe more about my tyre choices. I’m generally the type of person that will get some tyres and leave them on all year round until they wear out. Currently running On-One CM/SB tyres which are great all rounders but for racing I guess something maybe a bit thinner/lighter? I need some new wheels as well and as per my thread a few weeks back, Crossmax Enduros (yellow = faster), my Hopes built onto some Lightbike carbon things are all up there so I’ll be shedding some rolling weight there…

Anything else? Brighter clothing rather than my usual black? Goggles and a POC helmet?

Dave

IT seems to me the answer is, race more, train like you’re racing…

The guys at the pointy ends are guys who ride day in day out, mile after mile, be it commuting, fun or just road… they ride lots… they ride hard… the more they ride, the faster they get, the faster they get the harder they push….

Abit of loopiness. Think about driving – drive faster, when everyone else is braking, brake far far later, carry more speed, take more risk?

Hit a section flat out, whereas you are on the brakes thinking about it…thinking. Alot of the top racers- don’t think. They just do it. You think about it.

So no matter how fit you get, if you don’t have that edge where you don’t even think about injury, pain, loss of earnings etc then you’ll be slower.

hora – Member

Abit of loopiness. Think about driving – drive faster, when everyone else is braking, brake far far later, carry more speed, take more risk?

Hit a section flat out, whereas you are on the brakes thinking about it…thinking. Alot of the top racers- don’t think. They just do it. You think about it.

So no matter how fit you get, if you don’t have that edge where you don’t even think about injury, pain, loss of earnings etc then you’ll be slower.

Riding with faster rides will do this. You’ll try harder than you otherwise would, trying to keep up.

Apart from that, train and race more I would say.

Balls, big, big balls. Think about how late and little you can brake – Learn to carry the speed through sections and pedal like hell when you need to get the speed back up. Use the bike to its potential and learn how to maximise the travel to maintain speed through twisty sections and pick lines that encourage the bike to flow rather than stop / start.
Fitness will play a big part, but this should get better the more you ride.
I find that sessioning sections on my local trails (and trying to avoid using the brakes) has added so much to my riding skills. I’m looking forward to training for next season now!

I’ve ridden with way faster riders. They leave me dead (either that or I keep up and come off).

Just face it- no matter how good we think we (or are friends) are- there are always those who are on a massive other level.

Early mid-life crisis OP? 😉

for me, based on sundays experience on the enduro1 in the quantocks, being fitter would have helped massively as I would have got to the top of the stages with enough time to recover rather than riding straight into stages knackered. As a result I was coasting where I should have been pedalling and and not really letting it go through the tech sections as I was knackered.

I was at the UKGE Dyfi round this year, I noticed a few things:

1) the top guys donoghue, atherton etc were all spending a lot of time walking the stages, then riding sections over and over then pushing back up.

2) They’re a load better on a bike than anyone i’d ever seen before, there didn’t appear to be any ‘thinking time’ between seeing a new obstacle that wasn’t there before (in this instance, me, sprawled in a heap) and just whipping the bike round in a muddy root fest at 20mph.

Oh and they’re all insanely fit, nach

I’d go for fitter first. You spend a lot more time going up.When group riding you spend a lot more time waiting at the top of the hill than the bottom. That and ride more, everything will improve if you ride more.

Kind of half agree with hora.

But it has to be fun. Push yourself to go into corners and off drops faster/without braking/with extra pedal strokes on the way in. Make this a gradual process so you can give yourself scares rather than big crashes. I’ve been doing this on my local trails. No idea how I’d be in a race, but it’s great fun and a great feeling progressing from daring to do a drop to daring not to brake to putting in as many pedal strokes as you can fit into the run up… You want your friends to think you’re mental but to believe you are in total control in your head

Even if you have to shout quite hard at your inner coward, do this because you logically know you can go faster, not cos you know logically you are taking a massive risk. It stops being fun if you’re too scared or if you injure yourself.

WRT tyres, unless you are prepared to take 3 sets and be prepared to change them depending upon the conditions on the day, stick with one set. I don’t think thinner sidewalls would necessarily be the way to go. IMO you want to be fully committed, with as little fear as possible. Nursing thin tyres around the course will not help this!

Ride more often to get fitter. If 3 min sprints are whats killing you keep doing it, it’s better to be in pain while training, it will make the stage that bit easier. Nothings worse than having a sprint and feeling f****d going into a technical section.

Ride with faster people and compare cornering technique, lines etc.

Don’t worry too much about the bike, the biggest improvements will be made through training and getting better technically.

As per my question, I’m well aware I’m not going to be at the top but making up a minute or so over 5 stages I think would be achievable for me.

As daft as it sounds I may need new brakes. I think the last time I had confidence in brakes was about 13 years ago when I had some Hope DH4s on my Bullit. I know its quicker to just stay off the brakes but I reckon I’d be happier doing that if they actually stopped me when I needed them to.

Yes hora, its all just an excuse to buy some yellow wheels really…

Riding with faster riders is a great suggestion if you can do it.

Just seeing what is possible in terms or line choice and speed that you can carry through corners, obstacles etc. Try to hang onto their back wheel as much as you can, you’ll soon find your self riding quicker.

Theres no alternative for just getting fitter, power is my weakness so when out on the bike (road or mtb) try to force my self to sprint sections and generally keep the pace up.

That being said if you watch the quick guys, they’re generally the ones who look relaxed and not giving it 110%, try carrying speed where you can, using the terrain to generate more speed and only pedalling where necessary, no point sprinting out of one corner just to brake into the next one.

Oh, and deffo get some more yellow. Like red cars, it’s just faster.

what brakes/pads do you have ? what rotor sizes ?

Practise is something I need. I usually have one run down a section and thats it. Come race time its about trying to remember whats next let alone thinking about lines and stuff. Need to get out of the mentality of just getting down a stage being a success to getting down a stage much quicker being a success…

Brakes – SLXs (old style ones) with 200/180mm rotors. Pads I go through all sorts but it may be time to just get them into a LBS and get them to try and set them up properly…

Hora is spot on in his last statement, …its the edge that is most difficult. Self preservation is a bitch.

The eternal question…

If (and it’s a big if at times) I manage to stay on my bike racing enduro’s I hover around the top 10-15% of my category, however like you, would like to go faster.

I can put it down to a few factors. First, don’t worry about the bike. It’s plenty good enough to ride up at the top end. Don’t over analyse whether changing X will improve your riding etc.

The biggest single difference you can make IMO is fitness. I rode a lot last year, albeit with little or no structure and it really brought my riding on. You need a good, solid base fitness so 5-6-7 hours on the bike at a reasonable pace doesn’t wreck you. You can spend the next few months working on that, time is just the issue there (and trying to ride slowly).

Get practicing your sprints. You have already highlighted its a weak point. So work on it. Intervals, intervals & more intervals. Pyramids. Go & download some Sufferfests & try to turn yourself inside out on the turbo. These are massively important – your ability to put in pedal strokes (and meaningful ones) where others are still trying not to have a heart attack is a huge advantage.

Being able to go consistently hard, every stage is vital to doing well. Basically, you won’t be able to do enough of this, no matter how much you try – so get used to it.

It’s also worth doing some strength work on your core & general other bits, last thing you want is flopping around on top of the bike at the end of the day if you haven’t got the strength to hang on properly.

Riding. Go and race some DH on your trail bike. I race a fair few local regional bits, it puts your head in a place to ride flat out, and get wild on a little bike, which is where you want to be. Plus its fun p*ssing off all the riders on DH bikes you can smoke, because you can pedal. Do this lots.

Go and ride your bike too, get your base miles in now, try and ride trails differently, take different lines, see how it feels, do some crashing by taking stuff too quick, try gaping sections of trail, try riding sections off the brakes & see what happens.

Try riding sections as hard as you can – and then go & do the same in spring, it can give you a good basis for comparison.

Oh, and try to have some fun – we’re not pro’s, nor are we going to win the EWS!

For sure, get some bright clothing too, that’s sure to help.

In 6 months, you will be an Enduro Wizard 🙂

One run should be enough, just stop and look at any technical bits or areas you feel line choice could be key. Watch some riders come through any section you’re not 100% on.

I don’t think anyone is going to be able to remember every inch of every stage (some series have blind stages too) but try to remember the important bits where getting the line/braking/gearchoice right will make as big a difference as possible.

take your brakes off.

Some folks are just naturals and have been doing since they were 2. Others have no sense. Most ride way more than us weekend warriors. I bet most of the dudes above you either young lads of serious racers. When you’re 17 you can go 50% quicker just from stupidity alone.

I know it’s completely not the same thing, but I did a few club races on a 125 this year and the first round in March was on a track I’d never been to so most of the time I was learning the line (and a new-to-me bike) and got spanked. I went back to the track in May and knocked ten seconds off my lap time, then when we went back last month I knocked another three seconds off my times, just by going round in circles and getting the line and braking points right(er)*. I’m still propping up the back of the pack, but now it’s from less of a distance away. It’s amazing how much you can get away with as well- you think the limit is >here< whereas in fact it’s waaaaaaaaay over there >> but you can get to it.

Racing in itself makes you faster, and makes you want to go faster. Progression, I think it’s called 🙂

* still not right, as such, more less wrong than I was.

I did one of the Empire Enduro’s in Llantryd as a bit of light relief from racing xc all year.
Practice and 2 stages saturday and was feeling pretty comfortable and quite quick.Ended up 10 seconds back on each one (3-4 minutes long).Not overly happy I decided to go for it on the sunday.Rode first stage flat out/scary/uncomfortably (xc lid-no armour) and was only 1 second back off the fastest time.IT WAS NOT FUN IN THE SLIGHTEST!I suspect with more practice (I don’t ride the ‘big’ bike much) I’d get more comfortable with riding that close to the ragged edge but (at 41) it’s not what I class as enjoyable.So I went back to riding at 90%,coming mid table and having a giggle.
There are always close battles throughout the field.Focus on racing them,not the boys at the pointy end and you’ll enjoy yourself a lot more.

Had this same conversation with myself last week and have decided to work on my fitness over winter, mainly being able to lay down 100% for a minute or two and not then need to take a break.

Soooo, on last nights road ride every time we spotted a village sign/speed limit sign we sprinted to it. Was blooming knackering and felt like my lungs were going to burst. If I keep that up over winter reckon it will put me in good stead.

I’ll also be working on my cornering speed. I drag my breaks waaay too much and need to work on getting my speed right as I go into corners and staying off the breaks. Easier said than down.

Good brakes definitely let me ride faster, they just remove an unnecessary layer of anxiety from the whole situation. Shimano Zee are really good for control and very powerful.

I’d be wary of going lighter than those tyres, especially if you wanna ride faster. Maybe swap the rear to an Ardent Exo? Still a risk of holing it but usually OK for me.

Have you got a road bike? Doing lots of short to mid sized hills and flat sections of about five minutes might be beneficial? I’m similar place in the pack to you but have improved my fitness a lot for enduro-style efforts by that means (though unfortuantely didn’t get to any races this year to test myself).

The Raffertys race at elite level and offer training via Pro Ride Guides, not used them but I like their approach in their magazine articles.

Random leftfield (and possibly stoopid) suggestion – do you have a BMX and a BMX track near you? Sessioning a BMX track leaves you blowing out your arse, increases sprinting duration, stamina, leg strength, bike control, makes you pump every bit of ‘free’ speed out of the bumps and corners and is amazing fun. Also its something different so will feel fresh and it will have an impact mentally. Worked for me, getting a BMX has made a massive impact to my MTB speed and fitness.

hora – Member

I’ve ridden with way faster riders. They leave me dead (either that or I keep up and come off).

And that’s just how you learn. If you’re crashing trying to keep up then you’re probably pushing your limits. You generally won’t arrive at them on your own. Or you can give up.

Just face it- no matter how good we think we (or are friends) are- there are always those who are on a massive other level.

Regardless of the level, very few riders just emerge from a bubble a fully fledged racing machine. Most guys have someone to push them, or someone older and wiser to guide them. It’s pretty hard to compete with yourself.

So I’d re-iterate my point and say, riding with faster riders is one of the best ways to get faster.

It’s a real eye-opener when you follow someone fast. Even more of an eye-opener when you realise the person you thought was untouchable is top-30 Enduro, rather than top-10.
I found I can keep up on straights/roots/rocks, but corners are just a mystery to me. I think I’d benefit most from practising cutties/slashes/skids endlessly – the kind of thing kids are doing in the woods every day over summer.
YMMV – fitness and strength are always going to help though.

Or you could just repeat this daily:
“Be like water making its way through cracks. Do not be assertive, but adjust to the object, and you shall find a way around or through it. If nothing within you stays rigid, outward things will disclose themselves.

Empty your mind, be formless. Shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.”
? Bruce Lee

As others have said, do what it takes to sort your brakes out, not having reliable brakes will play on your mind.

Identify and work on your week points.

Practise is something I need. I usually have one run down a section and thats it. Come race time its about trying to remember whats next let alone thinking about lines and stuff. Need to get out of the mentality of just getting down a stage being a success to getting down a stage much quicker being a success…

If I can be a bit more Zen… Not only do you need to practice more. You need to practice practising.

Identify and work on your week points.

Tuesdays, for me

Monday>Friday are my week points.

My weak points though I think I’ve identified.

Cheers Guru Brant 😉

Right then – brakes sorted first. Need some knee pads as well. Very few people without them when racing so it’d be nice not to have to think about my lovely knees getting hurt.

Then increase yellow levels and practice loads more.

You can get serious power improvements with regular, relatively short, but very intense intervals – google ‘Tabata’ – it won’t be the whole answer, but it’s a quick and painful way of getting physically faster very efficiently. Just ‘riding more’ per se isn’t efficient, you can end up just churning out junk miles with minimal benefit.

It’s a real eye-opener when you follow someone fast

This, very much this, ride with people better than you as much as you can, try to follow them, watch what they do, learn from them.

You’ll be surprised how much time they spend:

a> not touching the ground/obstacles
b> coasting where you are pedalling
c> pedalling where you are coasting
d> not braking where you brake

^ thats where the seconds are made up, and a few seconds here, a few seconds there, suddenly its 20-30 seconds a stage.

Oh, and get fitter as well 😉

To be fast you need to be efficient as well as powerful.

So I’d re-iterate my point and say, riding with faster riders is one of the best ways to get faster.

While i agree with you JJ and know you ride with some blistering quick guys, blindly following someone faster wont teach you how to read a trail and spot the fastest lines. And that’s arguable more important in a race situation where you don’t have the luxury of following a faster rider or are on an unknown trail.

From my own perspective, if your skills are competent then fitness will make the biggest difference. Tiredness makes riding a chore, leads to mistakes and and there’s no bigger fun vacuum. Braking later isn’t always the answer. Braking less and somewhere that doesn’t upset the bike too much makes it easier to go faster through corners.

Lastly work on you pumping and jumping skills. Rough trails are so much faster if you’re not touching the ground.

Please note: I don’t race mountain bikes, i just ride for fun.

Need some knee pads as well. Very few people without them when racing so it’d be nice not to have to think about my lovely knees getting hurt.

Then increase yellow levels and practice loads more

You a big lad ? I’ve got some older 661’s you can have FoC mate, they’re a bit loose on me at 15st. Although if you have rake like legs you may be able to double loop.

Yours if you want them, email in profile.

A couple of the main things I’ve noticed from riding with and watching fast people are they pedal at every opportunity, and they are airborne for a lot of the time, sections where I slow down to get through rocks or roots they accelerate into and hop over them. I don’t have the kahunas to do it though. They also take lines I’d never have even seen

10.5 stone I’m afraid otherwise I’d have had those in exchange for some beer tokens.

Looking at options now – big range of pads… Need to go and try some on.

I recently bought Dainese Trailskins…. Very nice.

10.5st ! you have no excuses LOL carry a 15kg rucksack too next time out !

kayla1 – Member

I know it’s completely not the same thing, but I did a few club races on a 125 this year and the first round in March was on a track I’d never been to so most of the time I was learning the line (and a new-to-me bike) and got spanked.

After only 24 hrs of being on here you are gonna fit right in.