Hot wax Vs squirt

Is it significantly better than squirt etc? Longevity? Performance?

In theory, it should be. There’s more lubricating material getting to where you want it and no carrier to evaporate leaving space for more lube.

Also, there are no penetration issues with hot wax that you can get with Smoove/Squirt

Recently moved from Smoove to Silca Hot wax and happy so far.

Yes, I would say so ime. Interestingly Zero Friction Cycling says somewhere on its vast, rambling site that you can get very good results from Smoove, similar concept, but it means pre-heating both the lube and the chain to improve penetration.

Given that the time-consuming aspect of chain-waxing or using Smoove/Squirt etc, is the initial cleaning of the chain you might as well hot wax imo rather than messing around heating chains which seems mildly insane etc.

Also, the downside of Squirrt, Smoove etc, is you have to leave them overnight, I think, so the solvent can evaporate, Hot waxing means you do it, let it cool, fit the chain and you’re good to go.

Yes, definite improvement and no gunk build up on cogs/jockey wheels etc.

I liked Squirt though, served me well on the summer road bike for several years. Also ran slightly quieter than a waxed chain.

Performance, wax is probably better than most drip lube, almost certainly cheaper in the long run once you’ve bought all the extra stuff. Longevity seems mixed based on your local soil and quality of chain. Whether it’s the right choice for you depends on your current level of chain care routine, your resistance to faff (chain removal cleaning, drip drying re-fitting etc etc) and mileage expectations I guess.

Hot wax is going to be ‘better’ in terms of longevity (time between waxes / reapplication) and long-term cost benefits (providing that you already have the kit to heat the wax). It also gets into the inner workings of the chain quicker during the life of the chain = less wear on the chain = theoretically longer chain life. You can read up on this in serious detail on the Zero Friction Cycling website.

As a long-time Squirt user who is only running one bike and only gets to ride once or twice per week, I prefer the less-faff aspect of dry drip lube though.

The most time consuming part of whatever lube you choose is finding and reading the relevant info on the ZFC website.

Like @devash – I have 1 bike and I don’t see the real benefit of hot waxing as I’ve been using Squirt for almost 12 years and it works very well for me. I don’t see the issue with having to allow the lube to fully dry before riding – I give the bike a wash after a dirty ride, give myself a wash and by the time I’m all sorted, the chain has dried so I apply the lube and the bike gets stored…it is dry before the next morning so all good.

I’ve only ever had 1 episode of a dry chain, I don’t lube frequently – maybe every 3 or 4 weeks – so I’m very happy with it all. Hot water seems to clean the chain up easily and a brush over the chainring seems to sort any dried lumps without any hassle.

Hot waxing sounds like a good idea, but there seems to be a load of kit needed and it seems to take time (waiting for the wax to warm up and then dunk) – I suspect I could have had the bike washed and the chain already drying before it gets to the stage where the chain can be dunked. For my use, it seems like a waste of time when Squirt seems to work so well for me.

I’m a waxer. Rotating chains and a two crock pot system with thermometers. I enjoy the process. It doesn’t have to be as involved as I make it.

I will however, freely admit that the gap between hot wax and Smoove is a lot less than the gap between Smoove and oil based lubes.

I used Squirt for a few years, then switched to Smoove (which I found had significantly longer life between applications).  Just switched to hot wax on road bike and Brompton, will be trying in new mtb when it arrives.  So will let you know in a few months.

Also ran slightly quieter than a waxed chain.

that’s interesting – I was expecting wax to be quieter but the road bike did make a bit of noise after the initial wax had dropped off.  How do you tell if it needs redoing if not through noise?

that’s interesting – I was expecting wax to be quieter but the road bike did make a bit of noise after the initial wax had dropped off.  How do you tell if it needs redoing if not through noise?

Putoline is silent IME

Paraffin wax* based lube is a little noisy, not dry squeaky chain noisy, but there’s definitely a little more whirring than with wet lubes.

It still sounds like a squeaky dry chain when it’s gone.  There’s a school of thought though that this isn’t “dry” in waxing terms though and is actually still good for hundreds of miles because there’s still some paraffin / additives left inside the chain where the high loads are, just not keeping the side plates quiet.

In general though I probably re-wax most bikes long before they need it.  Depending on the time of year one bike inevitably gets used more than others or in conditions that strip the wax quicker. So that chain comes off to get waxed and while I’m at it I’ll do any other bikes that need it.  Or on the 12s bikes I have 2-3 chains in rotation so I wax all the chains, then use them for a few weeks/months each and then swap.

Chain washing I’m somewhere between a skeptic and a convert.  I now give new chains a good soak and a swish in white spirit, then rinse in petrol which seems to be minimal effort and do the job.  Next time I might just try the boiling in water. It definitely helps with new chains, I’m not sure it’s really necessary with old ones.

*I’m currently experimenting with homebrewed wax blends after years on Putoline, YMMV with commercially available waxes.

Hot waxing sounds like a good idea, but there seems to be a load of kit needed

Mostly a 15-quid crockpot and a bent coat-hanger plus a couple of jam jars for the initial degreasing of the chain. Sure, you can spend 100 quid on the Silca stuff and I’m sure it works very well, but it’s not really a huge investment in kit, I think.

On the time front, I just re-waxed the chain from a gravel bike. It took around 90 minutes, but mostly that was the crockpot getting up to temperature. I set a timer on my phone and got on with life. The actual activity time was maybe 30 seconds taking the chain off, another minute threading it onto a hanger and sticking it in the pot and switching it on. Then 90 minutes later,  a minute or so swishing the chain and hanging it up to cool off.

People like ZFC make it all sound quite complicated, but in reality it’s pretty straightforward. People go into some sort of slightly bonkers cult-like mindset, but it’s not really necessary, unless you particularly want to become an insane evangelist for waxing, in which case, good luck :-)

On the time front, I just re-waxed the chain from a gravel bike. It took around 90 minutes, but mostly that was the crockpot getting up to temperature. I set a timer on my phone and got on with life. The actual activity time was maybe 30 seconds taking the chain off, another minute threading it onto a hanger and sticking it in the pot and switching it on. Then 90 minutes later,  a minute or so swishing the chain and hanging it up to cool off.

+1

Saying waxing takes a long time is like saying smoove / squirt / other dry lube takes 12h to apply.  You don’t sit there watching it dry. Take the chain(s) off after a ride, clean them (if deemed necessary), chuck them in a pot, wash the bike whilst the chains off, hang bike up in the garage and go have a cup of tea, shower, food, beer, etc.  Come back to the pot, give it a swish, lift chains out and hang somewhere ready for next time.

The only difference between that and any bottle based lube is you have to pop back to the shed to take the chains out and fit the chain the morning of the next ride (unless you use one of those plastic chain cleaner devices that just seem to exist to distribute degreaser all over your drivetrain and bearings).

It still sounds like a squeaky dry chain when it’s gone. There’s a school of thought though that this isn’t “dry” in waxing terms though and is actually still good for hundreds of miles

I was moaning about this on my hot wax/gravel thread. Yesterday my chain went ‘dry’ as in horribly squeaky. Even if there was any wax left the noise was awful and I could feel it through the pedals as more vibration or something. Basically horrible to pedal. Lashed on sone 3-in-1 at a mate’s house and the last 20km felt like tailwind the whole way in comparison.

My conclusion is that if it sounds like a dry chain it is a dry chain!

IMO a happy medium is Squirt for E-bikes – the Green bottle – used on a normal bike. As easy to apply as the original but seems to last much longer with quite a waxy feel on the chain.

I have hot waxed for years, first with home made and now with MSW. I also lubricate my girlfriends bikes, but in her case I use Effetto Mariposa flowerpowerwax which i find really good and long lasting. It is really thin and gets right into the rollers. Highly rated by ZFC in many of his tests and total drivetrain wear. Much better than Smoove in my opinion.

As for hot waxing just use the cheapest smallish crockpot which will set you back £15 ish, no other equipment needed. You will also run the cleanest of chains.

Yesterday my chain went ‘dry’ as in horribly squeaky. Even if there was any wax left the noise was awful and I could feel it through the pedals as more vibration or something. Basically horrible to pedal. Lashed on sone 3-in-1 at a mate’s house and the last 20km felt like tailwind the whole way in comparison.

Yea, I’ve usually got a small (squirt sample) bottle of wet lube in my spares / tools for those occasions.

I use Effetto Mariposa flowerpowerwax which i find really good and long lasting. It is really thin and gets right into the rollers. Highly rated by ZFC in many of his tests and total drivetrain wear.

sounds interesting,  I amusing Silca SuperSecret on the road bike and like it, wonder how they compare…

Yea, I’ve usually got a small (squirt sample) bottle of wet lube in my spares / tools for those occasions.

Think I’ll go Synergetic to be honest, even Fenwick’s needs a setting time so no good on longer trips or mid-ride…

Think I’ll go Synergetic to be honest, even Fenwick’s needs a setting time so no good on longer trips or mid-ride…

I used to use B&Q Biodegradable chainsaw oil for £7/liter.  I’m convinced the non-bio stuff was the stringy green base that TF2 used!

Now I use Tru Tensions wet because it was reduced in Lidl.  Tried their all conditions dry/wax based stuff and it wasn’t bad. It was getting noisy towards the 60-80mile mark though.

+1 what BWD says. Minimal faff really, especially if you run 2 chains. It could be a whole lot more faff though and I’d still do it because of the longevity. I’ve got 2 chains that have done 5,500 miles between them and are still showing virtually zero wear.

I’ve got 2 chains that have done 5,500 miles between them and are still showing virtually zero wear.

I use Juice Lubes Viking, I took off a XO1 drivetrain off* a while back that had done 6000miles and the chain was just getting to .5 wear. I clean the bike after nearly every ride less often in the summer obviously, and lube when it’s washed, other than that, I did nothing special to it. Taking out the purchase of the special equipment you need for hot waxing, mine probably cost more, but performance wise, unless you’re v keen to try hot waxing, I think the performance gains (and I still think they exist) aren’t readily justified for average off-road riders who take average to good care of their bikes.

*I wear everything together and replace everything together.

The big thing I found with squirt is just that it’s really variable, I could be very happy with it for ages then suddenly run into some conditions or the ideal mud that’d just wreck it in minutes. Which I think explains a lot about how varying people’s reviews are, I could definitely have put it on for 10 rides and said “this is amazing”, or put it on for one ride and gone “this is disastrously terrible” and never used it again.

But even at best it doesn’t last as well as hot wax.

I used Squirt for a couple of years and was reasonably happy, but eventually I got discontented with its often lasting only half a ride on MTBs in very wet conditions.  So,  persuaded by TJ’s evangalism I tried Putoline.

It’s not perfect but it is much longer lasting than Squirt in terms of the chain getting noisey.  And the extra time to remove and rewax every month or two is made up for by a much longer chain life.

I used to hot wax with Putolene but stopped when I switched out drivetrains on both bikes. I now use Tru Tension Tungsten All Weather lube.

I must have been doing something wrong with the Putolene because I always had heavy buildup on the jockey wheels and chainring. I use a cheap DFF to apply the lube and just rinsed the chain under the hot tap to get any dirt off before putting it on the cold fryer. As the fryer heats up the chain drys and is eventually immersed in molten wax.  While that’s going on I would was down the rest of the bike before hanging the chain up to cool off.