As per the title, just wondering if anyone's tried the new DT Swiss Ratchet LN Conversion Kit, which converts the freehub pawl-type mechanism on their lower-end wheelsets like the M1900s to the star ratchet system.
That's always been possible, but the kit adds a seal on the freehub body that would otherwise leave your freehub mechanism poorly protected. The only obvious snag I can see is that you need two tools, one to remove the original ratchet from your hub body and a different one to install the star ratchet version.
I already have the latter, any way of bodging the former or is a begging trip to the LBS? I guess the other potential snag is whether DT Swiss will supply the freehub body as a standalone part should you need one in the future and the kit using the basic 18-point star ratchet rather than the faster-engaging 36 or higher options.
Tempted as I have a set of M1900s I'm thinking about converting.
It's so expensive when factoring in cost of specialist tools I figured it made more sense to buy a new wheel or pay someone to rebuild it with a new hub. Luckily I found an m1700 for £130!
A load of new Rovals are coming with the ratchet LN system in them so it looks like DT are planning to make it a fully supported 'budget' ratchet option to sit alongside the classic ratchet at 350 level with the new EXP system being kept for 240's and 180's.
I considered it but just ended up putting a new 350 hub in for not much more money (reused the straight pull spokes)
Thanks all. I already have the star ratchet tool from years back, so it's basically 70 quid odd, plus however much it costs me to get the original ratchet out of the hub body. Cheapest I can find a 350 seems to be around £130 and I'd then have to faff around rebuilding the wheel, assuming the original spokes fit. So I'd be paying 60 quid more for basically the same result.
I guess if you were to go mad and buy both DT Swiss special tools, it would make no sense at all. I'd still be happier if it came with the 36-tooth star ratchets though. Hmmm.
Does the upgrade only come with 18t? Seems like a missed opportunity. More like a downgrade if so.
Be mad to buy the DT tools anyway. The copies are way cheaper and in some ways (standard socket fitting) better.
Does the upgrade only come with 18t? Seems like a missed opportunity. More like a downgrade if so.
I'm pretty sure that's the case, yeah. The 18T is fine as far as reliability goes, but 36 and upwards much nicer ime.
Could you bodge a way to remove the pawl drive ring so you don't have to use the special tool? If you're not planning on reusing it then it wouldn't matter if it was damaged during removal
nixie
Full MemberBe mad to buy the DT tools anyway. The copies are way cheaper and in some ways (standard socket fitting) better.
Yup, the official DT tool is weirdly shit. My cheap ebay one is just a far better tool. It wouldn't even take that much to make the DT one not suck, just give it a 1/2 inch drive or stick a nice big hex on the end for a socket.
Does the upgrade only come with 18t? Seems like a missed opportunity. More like a downgrade if so.
18t is fine, and the Star Ratchet seems much better from a reliability point of view. Lots of engagements feels nice / posh but doesn't actually improve performance. Too many engagements can inhibit suspension action so less might be more here.
Definitely not a downgrade, anyway.
Could you bodge a way to remove the pawl drive ring so you don’t have to use the special tool? If you’re not planning on reusing it then it wouldn’t matter if it was damaged during removal
Probably, yep. And no, not a 'downgrade' but it makes a nicer noise and engages faster with the 36 tooth stars.
I shall give it a go and report back 🙂
Both tools can be found on eBay or from bitul.pl for not much more than the Chinese 3pawl copies.
I’m thinking of swapping the guts between my m1900 (came with the bike) and m1700 I got for £127 as I’ve got a little ding in it
18t ratchet may be the most reliable but in technical stop start balancy stuff you can definitely makes a big difference even with 36t. 54t better* still, just wish there was a 72t option ..
Newer gen 24t 3pawl better than 18 but it’s no 36
*i read lots of horror stories of 54t failures especially given the price as a reputational chain snapper/free hub breaker I’ve touch wood not had a problem
I did get an eBay 54t copy to strip on its first Steepish (middle ring) climb though so go genuine
I instantly upgraded to 36t on the m1700 as I really noticed the slower engagement on the 3 pawl m1900. Not something I think I used to notice but I definitely prefer faster engagement. Especially on rocky climbs.
Anyone want to buy an unused pair of 18t ratchets?
I’m thinking of swapping the guts between my m1900 (came with the bike) and m1700 I got for £127 as I’ve got a little ding in it
The problem with that - and the reason the kit exists - apparently, is that the freehub seal is on the freehub with the 3-pawl hubs and on the main hub body with the star ratchet ones. So if you fit the freehub from a star ratchet system onto 3-pawl hub body, there is no seal on the freehub, which isn't ideal.
The conversion kit freehub has a seal fitted on the freehub so it can be used with the 3-pawl hubs and still seal properly. Or so the blurb when it was released says.
That sounds much like they looked hard and found a way to stop any old ratchet freehub body being used.
18t ratchet may be the most reliable but in technical stop start balancy stuff you can definitely makes a big difference even with 36t.
We can agree to disagree on that. I don't think we should derail the topic with a debate about how many hub engagements are needed, though.
i read lots of horror stories of 54t failures especially given the price as a reputational chain snapper/free hub breaker I’ve touch wood not had a problem
Yeah, I've read those too. I wonder if anyone has access to any stats about failure rates.
Interestingly (s'all relative), I stripped an 18t DT Star Ratchet on its first outing while pedalling up a slightly steep hill. It skipped once, destroying a load of the teeth and was replaced under warranty. The replacement one was totally flawless for 6 years when I sold it on. I guess I just got a bad one first time round.
I have 18, 36 and 54. I like 36 best and definitely found with 18 that there was a big dead spot when trying to put a quick crank or two in
anyone know if the LN driver is different to the regular star driver in order to incorporate the seal?
Or is the seal the only "new" part designed to fit on a regular star driver?
anyone know if the LN driver is different to the regular star driver in order to incorporate the seal?
Or is the seal the only “new” part designed to fit on a regular star driver?
That occurred to me too, but it seems unlikely tbh. I've got a conversion kit on order now and I'll post back once I can compare the freehub body to a regular star ratchet one.
nixie
Full MemberThat sounds much like they looked hard and found a way to stop any old ratchet freehub body being used.
That's unfair tbh- it's just that the seal placement varies on the different hubs, naturally no 240 freehubs have a seal because on the 240 it's in the hub body, always has been. And the 3-pawl hubs have the seal on the freehub. So put any existing 240 freehub on a 3-pawl hub and you have no seal.
in fact I'm pretty sure you can use the old design freehub, people were bodging this before it became an official kit. But doing it right just needs a new variant of freehub that didn't exist.
(as far as changing things to stop old parts being used, that's really not a DT thing... The EXP in 2020 is the first major change to the 240/350 platform for literally decades. I had a set of 240s that were older than bolt-through forks, but I could have still stuck a new 240 freehub on it)