http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/10251349.stm

Just heard this on the news. Surely it can't be right I live in the sticks so don't have much experience of the urban type but all the foxes I see run a mile at the first sign of people. And what are 9 month old's doing around foxes at 10pm anyway?

yeah it was a fox

no, it wasnt my mates dog, it was a fox

srsly.

Good point soobalias, in my country bumpkin innocence I didn't think of that explaination. Shocking whatever happened.

I thought it was Bombers that were used for owning folk. Times change.

When I was a kid, a gamekeeper up the road had a fox in a pen in his back garden – no idea why – I was too young to consider such things, but he was very careful to make sure that us kids didn't get to close. So I can easily conceive of a situation where a fox might be put in a situation where it could attack a kid.

9 month old up at 10pm?

Not nice at all

However, at least it may give Cameron extra impetus to have as many of the horrible little critters as possible chased to death by packs of dogs and snobs on horses.

was it one of those dangerous canines that are bred for fighting?!

Another good point Ianmunro but I've got a guinea pig in a cage in the garden thats a vicious little sod I'm sure if I let it out it would be gone like a shot it wouldn't hang around to attack me, much less go after a 9 month baby?

It doesn't sound unique.
I just googled fox attacks child
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-436361-fox-attacks-sleeping-baby.do

However, at least it may give Cameron extra impetus to have as many of the horrible little critters as possible chased to death by packs of dogs and snobs on horses.

In return for those "snobs" (i.e mostly genuine country folk, and a few rich gentry types) looking after the countryside and bridleways etc for you.

Just playing devils advocate, I dont agree or disagree with fox hunting. TBH I don't care either way thats why I've never taken part (and therefore exercised my democratic right and freedom of choice). I do think there are far more important issues government could be dealing with though.

There's nothing stopping them looking after bridleways without chasing a defenceless creature to exhaustion only to be ripped apart by baying hounds billy.

The bridleways can rot if that's the price thanks.

WTF are 'genuine country folk' anyway?

n return for those "snobs" (i.e mostly genuine country folk, and a few rich gentry types) looking after the countryside and bridleways etc for you.

Do they bollocks look after the countryside most farmyards are full of rotting machinery and half the rights of way are overgrown or blocked

Sorry no offence meant mate 🙂

Like I said I don't care either way. Foxes (certainly around here) are not endangered at all and the hunt when they were allowed were lucky if they got one anyway. As you say it is also cruel, to put it mildly, to set dogs on a very beautiful and noble wild animal.

"Genuine country folk" for want of a better term are just ordinary people who live and work in the country, mostly the opposite to the hoity rich types that most anti hunt people would have you believe the hunt is made up of

However, at least it may give Cameron extra impetus to have as many of the horrible little critters as possible chased to death by packs of dogs and snobs on horses.

Babies?

Not an antagonistic post billy, merely trying to understand your way of thinking.

How can you in one breath call a fox a very beautiful and noble wild animal, yet not care either way if it's inhumanely hunted?

I can see both sides of the arguement. I grew up on a farm in the country and live there still (BTW some of our machines are only used rareley so may seem to be "rotting in the yard" most times you ride past, and if you find blocked ROW then report it, the land-owner is acting illegally and should sort it, as far as undergrowth goes we have nearly two miles of bridleway, that you can't get machines down easily, on our land and it's difficult to keep on top of what with earning a living and all that!)

But we're getting off the point. Would a fox attack two 9 month old children at 10pm?

I've been walking home at night back to my house and come across foxes that didn't seem all that worried about my presence – if anything, I got a little concerned by theirs.

I can see if children were left out in a garden whilst the parent went in the house to answer the phone etc. that a fox might attack them – after all, they can attack cats and other animals, so why not small humans?

It's just contrary to anything I've ever experienced. Urban foxes must be very different.

May I suggest a cull if they're becoming a problem (joke BTW)

Did any of you actually read the story? The fox is reported to have entered the house and attacked the 2 kids in their bedroom…

Now, I would imagine that if a fox is bold enough, and I am sure some are, to enter a house looking for food, it won't have too many qualms trying to take a bite out of something smaller than it!

Would a fox attack two 9 month old children at 10pm?

Not imo/experience. I had a fox which would wait by my front door every evening for his dinner, he was more or less a pet – he would come running if I whistled, I would sit next to him as he was eating, etc etc (long story which I won't go into) When his litter of cubs were old enough, he brought them to my front door for feeding too. Unfortunately they were such ravenous bastards, that poor old Basil never got a look in and was missing out on the food. So I had to let him into my hallway so that he could eat in peace. Although he was very relaxed with me and obviously hungry, it was only reluctantly that he came in. All the cubs except for one (6 of them) wouldn't come in, despite having known me as youngsters. One of my cats hated him and would instantly attack him on sight – Basil never made any attempt to defend himself, and would quickly back away.

yeh, that was no fox – attack badger on crack is my guess

Did any of you actually read the story? The fox is reported to have entered the house and attacked the 2 kids in their bedroom…

Yes I did thats why I posted. I was shocked that it could happen to two babies.

TBH soobalias explanation seems more logical than a rogue fox entering peoples houses, ignoring the kitchen, bins etc and going to the bedrooms after two 9 month olds, presumably in cots at that time of night

funkynick – Member

Did any of you actually read the story? The fox is reported to have entered the house and attacked the 2 kids in their bedroom..

Yes I read it, but as with every story reported there is something we don't know or are not being told.

I feel for the children, but something in this report doesn't add up.

Well, foxes are quite capable of taking chunks out of dogs, especially when cornered, why else do you think they used to hunt them in packs? So I'm not surprised that a fox would, given the chance and if hungry, try taking lumps out of a small helpless child… they are predators after all.

Plus, there are previous reports of children being attacked by foxes…

And finally the police are saying they are not treating it as suspicious…

So what part of this is not sounding right? That a fox couldn't possibly attack a child? Or that it wouldn't enter a house?

So what part of this is not sounding right?

You saying "foxes are quite capable of taking chunks out of dogs".

Have you seen a foxes jaw ? It is tiny and fragile – probably about the size of a cats jaw. Foxes are not simply "small dogs" – they have evolved separately, and part of a fox's evolutionary advantage over dogs is how light and agile they are – they can catch birds in mid-air for example. They do not have jaws simular to an equivalent size dog – who's jaws have evolved to crush bones. A fox can not even take on a healthy adult cat.

To be fair the story has been updated since I first posted (i'e the police statement). As I said I have NO experience with urban foxes.

I do have plenty of experience with country ones. The 2002 report of a fox "darting" in the house and grabbing the child "by the head" does seem consistent (that is how they will grab young livestock – by the head)

Foxes I know of do not go hungry, they move on to more plentiful food sources. Maybe that validates this story, I can't help thinking cunning Mr Fox will find easier opportunities (bins etc) in East London than a pair of twins in bed though. Foxes are actually pretty small and it must have caused quite a commotion. Why didn't the parents kill it? Sounds harsh but thats what would happen if it was attacking my daughters and IME it's the only way to stop it in a frenzy.

They used to hunt with packs of dogs becouse the hounds are basically thick as the preverbial, one would be no good, lose the scent or just basically lose interest. The fox would run, literally for it's life, when cornered it would fight but be lucky to "take chunks" out of the dogs before it was, as TAFKASTR rightly says be inhumanely torn to pieces.

Maybe I'm being naive but this just doesn't seem right.

NO self respecting fox would attack a human child in it's bed before 11.30pm..

Well… having had to help patch up a dog that lost to a fox when I was a kid, then yes, I reckon they are more than capable of it when cornered, and a cat is quite capable of taking chunks of a dog as well.

Neither are animals that a fox is likely to attack though… but if they are cornered then they are vicious little buggers.

They'll quite happily kill rabbits and chickens, so why wouldn't they have a go at a baby?

They used to hunt with packs of dogs because……

Wolves/dogs are pack hunters, so it is they are more likely to hunt effectively like that. Part of wolves strategy is to wear down their quarry to the point of exhaustion.

funkynick – Why didn't it run away? (the fox, or the dog) and it must have been a very small dog.

No way is it impossible just seems very unlikely to me.

I still go with soobalias

strategy is to wear down their quarry to the point of exhaustion.

a bit like some people in this place at times. 😐

so why wouldn't they have a go at a baby?

Almost all animals have a strong inbuilt fear of man. And as a consequence, tend to keep away from close encounters with humans. Obviously if cornered they will fight back. I once cornered a fox early one morning on a building site in the room of a partly completed building, I have never seen a more terrified animal in my life – it was quite literally climbing up the walls in a desperate attempt to get away from me. I just backed off and let it escape.

My aunt had to chase a fox out of her cottage once, she had left the back door open and a fox came in through the kitchen into the living room. She came out of the utility through the kitchen into the living room to find it stood staring at my young cousin (old enough to be left playing on his own, so not a baby) and she was unsurprisingly quite shocked to see it, so was it apparently as she chased it around the room with a poker from the fireplace. This was a country fox in the middle of the day so dont know how you can compare it to this story but although im naturally sceptical of anything i read in the papers there may be some thread of truth to this one somewhere.

So it's a not impossible, though highly unlikely event – which is probably why it's in the news. I don't understand why we have to second-guess the family's version of events.. But then again, I am very much a 'benefit of the doubt' person

I don't understand why we have to second-guess the family's version of events.

Because very few animals would naturally prey off humans.

In fact, I can't think of any apart from crocodiles ……..even "man-eating" tigers are always either old, or sick, or otherwise starving.

……maybe it was a crocodile ? 💡

miaowing-cat, I was just shocked to hear it when the story was first on the radio. Whatever happened it is horrible to hear of two young children being hurt, seriously, according to the report.

Given my experience of them I was just giving foxes "the benefit of the doubt" as you put it and was after other peoples thoughts on it. 😉

When I lived in the UK I had two freaky fox incidents. First, middle of the day, me and 1yr old on the back of my bike, pootling on a bridleway past a field of goats, with kids. I spy old fox creeping through the back, and he was a big b'stard. He spies me spying him, and actually advanced growling towards us. I rode off sharpish, but it was a bit scary.

Next time, of a summer evening, back door left open, and foxy loxy sneaks in to the kitchen to steal groceries yet to be put away. A trail of pita bread up the back lawn into the wood. He must have been in a few times, as I saw him and chased him off, only to find the evidence spread before me.

Oh, and they climb trees, to get eggs from nests, and they steal your shoes.

I saw one driving back from a party in Oldham last friday night. Wandering around a road junction as bold as brass. As he was in the way when the lights changed, I gave him a slight honk of the horn, and he just turned round, barred his teeth at me, then carried on where he was. I had to edge the car right up to him to get him to shift. He certainly wasn't perturbed by humans….

I saw one driving back from a party in Oldham last friday night.

I wasn't aware that foxes could legally hold a licence..