I’ve been told that whatever max HR you see while out on your bike, your real max HR will be a few percent higher.

The theory, which has apparently been demonstrated, is that you are always going to be able to stretch your effort more under lab conditions, i.e. on a bike in a lab with someone coaching you to your effort, than while out on the road, where other variables, like distractions of environment, will inhibit that.

Consequently, you will be able to squeeze out a few more BPMs than you might expect.

The most I’ve seen recently, over a period of six months, is 186 (paltry considering I used to max out at 210 when I was in my 20s!) and the suggestion is that my max heart rate is more likely to be around 192.

What do other people ‘know’ based on their learning and wisdom; is this theory correct?

you are always going to be able to stretch your effort more under lab conditions

Wrong, classic example of that is Cav, his numbers are fairly average, (for a world class track/road sprinter), in a lab, but outside with a number on, well….

My max cycling is less than it is running.

The mistake you are making is thinking that the higher the HR is, the better. It is what it is. Some people’s HR does not go above 150, but it isn’t a reflection of their fitness.

The mistake you are making is thinking that the higher the HR is, the better. It is what it is. Some people’s HR does not go above 150, but it isn’t a reflection of their fitness.

No I never made that assumption although on a like for like basis, assuming my heart is still more or less the same now as it was 15 years ago, it only beating at 186bpm is going to mean less blood circulating than if it were beating at 210bpm and that surely means I won’t be as able to generate work?

All that aside, the reason for asking is because your max HR does change the ‘zone’ measurements and that does help with managing your effort.

I know that my Max HR# is best assessed in a race. It’s a bit like my dog. When he’s aching he mooches and doesn’t run about. But Squirrel! and he’s off! Controlled conditions do just that, control.

#193 according to Saturday’s sprint lead out (I’m 46)

When I was taking tri seriously, my rule of thumb starting point was take max HR for run calculations, then -7 bpm for bike and another -7 for swim. So I had different zones for each event. There was a mix of science (?) and feel in the calculations but they worked for me. TBH, nevere used my HR in the swim, but the ones worked well for pacing ride and run.

So I used Karvonen formula to calculate zones but with different max HR as the input. So say my max was 190, my bike would be 183 etc.

Hope that helps!

Mine’s 181 – whenever I’m riding at 179-181 I get that want-to-be-sick feeling so I’m guessing its close to being correct on that very basis…..

Wrong, classic example of that is Cav, his numbers are fairly average, (for a world class track/road sprinter), in a lab, but outside with a number on, well….

IIRC he’s pretty crap in real life too (and that’s power, not HR), he’s just very tacticaly astute, aerodynamic, and can sprint further and more often than the competition. At the usual measurements like (threshold)power/weigth he’s way behind, hence why he’s the first aboard the autobus as soon as the pelaton goes uphill.

As for max Hr, mines dropped quite markedly in the last 10 years (17-27). I used to be able to sustain 210bmp+ and peaked over 220. Then it dropped massively through univeristy and now max is about 198 and it rarely goes above 175 (and when it does it goes up quickly, then recovers back to ~160).

Max Hr’s fairly meaningless through, it’d be like top gear comparing the rpm’s of cars fuel pumps, it makes no allowance for the fuel type (haemocrit), engine size (muscle mass), intake manifold size (VO2max), or any other variable. Hence why everyone likes measuring power.

Achieving your max will also depend on what you are doing. Usually it is easier to achieve your max under controlled, supervised lab conditions where you have no option other than to follow the protocol which is designed to take you to your max.

It’s all too easy to ease off on the road for instance for a variety of reasons. Very often we don’t have a long enough constant gradient to test on.

Your max HR will reduce with age. My max used to be 200 in my 40s which when I was a really keen cyclist I used to see fairly regularly. Now in my later 50s I struggle to see 180 even though I probably train harder and longer than I ever did.

Thanks for the responses, great answers and insight.

Chappeau to this:

#193 according to Saturday’s sprint lead out (I’m 46)

And ‘yes it does, very much so’ to this:

Hope that helps!

Seems about right, the highest HR numbers I have ever seen on the bike was racing the Mega last year, I think I peaked at 198 trying to sprint that nasty climb out of ADH. To be fair though, after the start, my average never dropped below 188 for the whole ~50 minutes (no wonder I was so f*cked by the end).

I also play a lot of squash, and my peaks in that are constantly around the 205 mark.

My max heart rate has decreased as my fitness has increased.

I couldn’t figure out why…it seemed a little counter-intuitive but some googling found this which backs up my observations.

http://www.joefrielsblog.com/2011/06/max-heart-rate-and-fitness.html

Max HR goes down with age and with training (!) Reason being, as your heart gets bigger and stronger, it doesn’t need to (or maybe can’t?) beat so fast to move the same amount of blood. Also, your max HR depends on the activity. (As teamhurtmore said). Whole-body activities like running, and especially XC skiing, can have higher HR than leg-only things like cycling, which in turn is higher than swimming. Whatever the sport, finding out your max HR can be quite an unpleasant activity.

Maximum heart rate goes down with ageing as the pacemaker cells inside the heart cannot increase the HR with exertion as much as before. Average HR and resting HR tend to stay the same (http://circ.ahajournals.org/content/65/1/141.full.pdf if you’re interested in the science of it).

Cardiac output = stroke volume x HR, so as you get fitter by training and your stroke volume (the amount of blood your heart pumps out with each stroke) increases, your resting HR decreases to maintain the same cardiac output.

As mentioned before, everyone’s resting and maximum heart rates are different, irrespective of fitness. Maximum heart rate depends on activity type, hydration, altitude etc

Interesting follow ons here. I am a strong believer in avoiding the classic zone 3 for training. For me that is no mans land. I try to do all my long, slow stuff at <70% of Karvonen adjusted max and then mix this with shorter training >85%.

As I get back into trainging, the long slow target becomes easier and easier (put another way I can run faster at the same effort) but, and it is a very big but, the short stuff becomes harder and harder!!!! This is particularly true on the bike where unless there is a hill I find it very hard to maintain the higher targets. Perhaps I am simply not strong enough!!!

So I look forward to the long slow days but increasingly dread the short, hard ones!!!! This makes me feel like I need to get back to proper training again. I love MTB but it is all to easy to stop for the view (cough), check the map (last Friday), bottle a steep bit and have a few looks etc…. 😉

Now in my later 50s I struggle to see 180 even though I probably train harder and longer than I ever did.

Actually training longer and harder is possibly one reason you’re not seeing so high a HR. Personally I find it a lot easier to hit my max when I’m relatively unfit and not training hard – when I’m fit it requires a much higher perceived exertion to raise my HR.

Actually training longer and harder is possibly one reason you’re not seeing so high a HR. Personally I find it a lot easier to hit my max when I’m relatively unfit and not training hard – when I’m fit it requires a much higher perceived exertion to raise my HR.

As I am just finding out! I have read tons of info about training and HR over the years (including some of Joe Friel’s books) but have never come across this effect. Excellent thread.

I too now find that it is very difficult to push myself to the max probably because of the perceived effort you refer to. Happily now I can just tell myself I am getting fitter…. 🙂