Far right attempting to subvert the farmers protests in London.

Tenant Farmer on TV complaing about the IHT? Unless he has £2 million quids worth of Tractors he's fighting someone else's battle.

it should be fairly obvious why farming is a special sort of business that needs to be handled differently

It is, that’s why they receive massive subsidies for their businesses from the tax payer.

And now they get to pay half the IHT and a much higher starting point than those same tax payers.

Tenant Farmer on TV complaing about the IHT? Unless he has £2 million quids worth of Tractors he’s fighting someone else’s battle.

Radio 4 were doing vox pops with people protesting. It seems that cap-doffing serfdom is alive and well in  farm workers, probably earning minimum wage, defending the interests of rich landowners

Radio 4 were doing vox pops with people protesting. It seems that cap-doffing serfdom is alive and well in  farm workers, probably earning minimum wage, defending the interests of rich landowners

Beat me to it...

One silver lining to possibly focus on with this weird UK culture war we seem to be in is that many of the leading lights are typically gammony old men who will probably be 6ft under in a few years. They represent the past not the future.

So you have seen the Victoria Derbyshire and Jeremy Clarkson exchange then?

Another one saying we will have to sell 6 farms from the estate???

multi21Free Member
FuzzyWuzzy

How many small-medium size farms are worth over £1.3m though (assuming there’s a farmhouse on it, rising to £3m allowance inc. spousal etc.)? The BBC Verify article says only 35% of UK farms are valued at over £1m, I’d assume then they’re mostly medium-large farms (and likely just large farms once you get to £3m).
I’m dubious of that figure from the BBC.  In a lot of the country, the farmhouse alone is probably £500K, and I bet a lot are closer to a million. Then there is equipment (tractor alone can be £100K plus drills sprayers etc), working buildings, livestock + the land itself at £10K an acre (average farm size 217 acres). You can be over 1.3 million very easily.

An old friend bought his farm in a remote part of Devon thirty years ago this year, iirc. He paid something like £100,000 for 60 acres and a run-down grade2 thatched cottage. At the time it was two and a half times what my parents large 4 bed terraced house in a scruffy city was worth. He now has about 100 acres, and the farm is worth over a million. It is still run-down.

He farms sheep and anything else that will make some money - crops for biofuel, etc - doesn't make a huge amount of money from it, but is never short of money. But then he did come from a well off family in the first place. He can afford unusual cars, leases new 4x4s, goes on more foreign holidays than I do. A lot of equipment is shared between the community, so he doesn't need to buy massive amounts of expensive kit, and there is a lot of barter-type trading going on, off the books. (Help me with the spraying and I'll help put up your barn. Do you fancy a lovely joint of venison? Can't tell you where it came from...) If he could, he'd rewild the farm - he's got good intentions but that's often at cross purposes to actual farming.

It's a very different lifestyle to my townie life and I wouldn't want to do it, but that's not because he's living in penury. In fact, none of the friends I met in agricultural college in the 90s are doing any worse for themselves than the desk workers I'm sitting among now.

Tenant Farmer on TV complaing about the IHT?

Baroness Batters was on Radio 4 this morning - she was head of the NFU from 2018-2024, hence the interview. This is her wiki entry:

Batters was born on 28 May 1967.[1] She was brought up on a tenant farm near Salisbury and always wanted to be a farmer. She attended Godolphin School, an independent school in Salisbury.[2] As a teenager she worked with horses for David Elsworth, including riding over 30 winners in races. Her father encouraged her to develop a career instead of becoming involved in farming, so she attended catering college and then ran a catering company.[3] In 1998, when her father retired, she took over the farm's tenancy.[4]

She has been a member of the House of Lords since 2024.

I suspect that 'tenant' may have a few more meanings in the countryside than 'tenant' when you're being evicted from your house because you can't pay the rent. I have a friend who grew up in a tied cottage near Bristol. She was very posh!

That would be the Harry Metcalf with the warehouse full of fancy cars, that also works as a motoring journo?

So you have seen the Victoria Derbyshire and Jeremy Clarkson exchange then?

I did like his opener which can be summarised as "I was lying three years ago but now you can trust me, honest".

Although his ranting about six form politics reminded me of someone else.

Did he show Derbyshire any Monty Python images?

mrhoppy
That would be the Harry Metcalf with the warehouse full of fancy cars, that also works as a motoring journo?

I don't think it's any secret whatsoever that he's minted.

But I suggest you go and look up how long he's been farming, and how he came to be rich and involved in cars if this is supposed to be a gotcha.

Tenant Farmer on TV complaing about the IHT? Unless he has £2 million quids worth of Tractors he’s fighting someone else’s battle.

Strong echoes of the anti-ULEZ hysteria stirred up by R/W media outlets looking for a stick to beat Sadiq Khan with when the vast majority of vehicles people actually drive are exempt anyway.

There's going to be some variety of this tactic every time Labour tries to raise more money to fund the public services the Tories left in ruins, get used to it.

Of course, the most blindingly obvious way to alleviate the current financial squeeze, get the economy moving again and massively help farmers in the process would be to rejoin the European single market, wonder how Big Nige and co feel about that?

I don’t think it’s any secret whatsoever that he’s minted.

But I suggest you go and look up how long he’s been farming, and how he came to be rich and involved in cars if this is supposed to be a gotcha.

Not supposed to be a gotcha, only vaguely aware of him so wasn't sure it was the same fella.  But as it is he has multiple other income streams which take his time so I don't imagine he's slaving away to eke out every penny from his farm, if not for the fact he's doing other things instead of working it. So I'm leading to question the validity of his £60k figure, given his other commitments I'm assuming he needs to have staff within his overheads some of which he would t need if he was working dawn til dusk like we're told is needed.

He's also not a typical farmer for the purposes of drawing positions as to where things should be.

Tenant Farmer on TV complaing about the IHT? Unless he has £2 million quids worth of Tractors he’s fighting someone else’s battle.

If the last decade has shown anything it is that people are very susceptible to lies.

A few raised eyebrows in Kingscross today as the hard up Farming communities stepped out of First Class.

Interesting to see Davies, Farron and the LibDem party position on this. Very much lining themselves up as the new Conservatives (but without the foreigner obsession). Their other “pro farming” policies are pretty joined up, but jumping on opposing these meagre wealth tax changes risks putting them on the side of the landowner, rather than everyone else that lives in their rural seats (where the behaviour of the larger land owners towards the wider community is well understood).

And this inheritance tax change fixes that how exactly?  In fact i bet this tax change causes family farmers to sell up and actually increase the amount of land that’s in the hands of “big agribusinesses”.

According to local Facebook page, Bill Gates is waiting in the layby ready to pick them all up for a song

According to local Facebook page, Bill Gates is waiting in the layby ready to pick them all up for a song

Blimey, first his plandemic now this!

Am I wrong or do the farmers just have to do is sign the farm over 7 years before death? Just like the rest of us plebs

Dan Hodges, of all people, has just pointed out on Twitter that Kemi Badanoch has now committed to only 2 policies since her leadership election

1. Abolishing inheritance tax for landowners passing on land valued at over 3 million quid

2. Abolishing tax on private school fees

That's the Tory party really addressing the issues that concern most people in this country.

Finger on the pulse there Kemi

Correct 7 years, limited company, trusts.

So I've got a video from the protest of Clarkson.....turns out it was the interview with Derbyshire! I'd just started filming when he asked how many folk would be impacted by iht. I also got very close to Farage..... he's very short.

Crowdsize was huge though tbf.....saw 10k on BBC, then upped to 13k.....it was way more than that!

Vids of a tractor driving through a bollard, very slowly, but straight at a police officer are circulating on Twitter. Also, rather bizarrely, a couple of folks from JSO turned up!

I'm tired, really don't care for London and am still 90 minutes from home.

I found this an interesting take on IHT

Clarkson still thinks he’s on Top Gear using the audience to put shit on Richard Hammond. When he asks his farming disciples how many are affected yeah it’s true most of them are - they just need to do some tax and succession planning. Do these people all honestly think they’re on the hook for loads of money from the get go just cos they wear wellies all day?

At the risk of derailing the thread back to where it started, any sign of the far right getting involved?

do the farmers just have to do is sign the farm over 7 years before death? Just like the rest of us plebs

If you hand over an asset as a gift, you must live seven years, but cannot continue to derive benefit from the asset - otherwise you have not given it away.  For the case of a house, for example, your parent gives you a house and lives in it. To avoid IHT they must pay market rent for the property. That could just be a means of them “gifting” you further wealth, but it must be paid.

The problem with farming is the farm has been the pension. So forward planning of income after, say 65, was not a thing. That planning requires pension contributions or future savings to avoid deriving benefit. whilst more young farmers, and farm workers, will be paying into pensions, this has not always been the case. Hence elderly farmers have assets but no future income after gifting the asset.

Old MacDonald and Clarkson need to get home soon as they'll be sod all milk in the shops tomorrow.

If you hand over an asset as a gift, you must live seven years, but cannot continue to derive benefit from the asset – otherwise you have not given it away. For the case of a house, for example, your parent gives you a house and lives in it. To avoid IHT they must pay market rent for the property. That could just be a means of them “gifting” you further wealth, but it must be paid.

The accountancy press and HMRC have been stressing this quite a bit in the last week or two.

I found this an interesting take on IHT

It’s all been said in this thread, but with less hand waving.

It’s all been said in this thread, but with less hand waving.

Conversely, the video is more concise and has less of the usual tedious sniping..?

You didn’t watch it then? It’s full of sniping. And not at all concise.

it was way more than that!

people in large crowds alway seem to overestimate the numbers

the Met have a lot of experience so I think it’s likely that their numbers are there or thereabouts

And not at all concise.

And yet still more concise.

I started out from the perspective of the changes being a bad thing and this thread, being largely a load of shouting down and the usual, had done nothing to convince me otherwise. The video has me now considering the opposite viewpoint.. at they say - it's all in the delivery.

Its sure this isn’t representative of all farmers but the small family owned ones I’ve noticed where I walk doggo are dumping slurry straight into the local river (seen the tankers with hoses discharging)

I find this hard to believe, especially that you've seen multiple. Are you sure they're discharging rather than taking water?

@TiRed the last part is why most of the old farmers i know build a granny anex and work part time on other farms or rent back stables for storage.

Farming is a rubbish job with great benefits if you like being outside.

Massively underrated and taken for granted.

If my pad is worth £1m+ (no hope)  my kid will get hit with inheritance tax.   Even though my work has brought foreign money into the economy and helps (a tiny bit) to offset the mahoosive negative balance of trade.  I've not been paid massive subsidies each year for 50+ years, unlike them.

I didn't see any of them protesting when the ship yards, steel mills or 1000 other British industries were decimated.   We import most other things, we can import food if needs be - because we're so dependent on other countries already, one more step will male ****all difference.

They need to paying their share of tax rather than just sponging off the rest of us.

And never forget- 'their' land was land stolen from the masses in the 1st place over the past 500 or so years.   Their really just thieves handing on stolen property.

Anyway not sure in the timing of the announcement of this  new venture,but here’s a cycling related theme with farms ,gcn,inheritance etc

And never forget- ‘their’ land was land stolen from the masses

Given the ability and competence of "the masses", not sure we want it returning, tbh

Well, I imagine the proper farmers who went down to London trudged back last night in the cold and have now woken up and are going to work, in the cold, with not a single thing changed.

Meanwhile, Farage, Tice, Clarkson et al are probably still tucked up in nice, warm, London hotel suites - having had a lovely evening meal with some fine wines. Probably a brandy or two as a nightcap in some big armchairs to round off another successful day (for them).

In another "pick the opposite side to X and you'll be right" confirmation...

I see Liz Truss is backing the protesting farmers. I bet they're thrilled with that one!

Clarkson is a throbber. Never liked the guy, but him being caught out by that interviewer and his weasely response truly sealed it.

Quite farage-esque. What a ****.

This letter from the FT seems to sum up the position for me. These farmers should be turning their anger onto to the parasitic folk who have inflated the notional value of their land to such an extent that they are now classed as millionaires and taxed accordingly.

Also, Clarkson really is a revolting individual, he's just good at projecting bonhomie in controlled situations, stick him in a street interview with some awkward questions from the likes of Vic Derbyshire and the switch flips instantly.

but here’s a cycling related theme with farms ,gcn,inheritance etc

Saw that last night, spent five minutes trying to work out if it was a skit where they ended up racing CX around the grounds of a stately home. And I can't believe he's not actually called Hank.

In one infinitesimally small 'victory' I see that my local rural police force have removed their post on FB where they changed the profile picture to a "We Support British Farmers" banner.

It was pointed out to them by me and others that the police are supposed to be apolitical.

I started out from the perspective of the changes being a bad thing and this thread, being largely a load of shouting down and the usual, had done nothing to convince me otherwise. The video has me now considering the opposite viewpoint.. at they say – it’s all in the delivery.

I don't as a rule object to paying taxes, but I do when others don't have to pay the same ones as me - but maybe the mistake Reeves made was that she should've announced that landowner estates would pay the same as the rest of us, and then gave them 10 years (with no interest and benefitting from inflation) to pay as a concession?

Given his "help" to the fishing industry, I just don't get why Farage was welcome within 20 miles of that protest yesterday.

There were very mixed views on his attendance. Farage just turned up uninvited, and was then told that he wasn't welcome to speak on stage.

Clarkson: I hate him....on stage he was absolutely brilliant though, much as you'd expect.

on stage he was absolutely brilliant though, much as you’d expect.

Yup, very much what I would expect. What is less expected though is how shite he is when challenged.

The video posted on the previous page is an excellent analysis of the modern farming conundrum.

The problem with Labour’s approach in this and things like the winter heating grant is that they don’t offer a carrot with the necessary stick. The winter heating grant should have been tapered rather than a sharp cut off and the farmers should have been promised some form of price protections for their products to make farming worthwhile. The subsidies we pay them now are really just free extra profits to the food industry.

Both policies are perfectly reasonable and needed as we try to wriggle out of the decades long low tax economy experiment that has enshittified the public realm, but for heavens sake Labour need to do better to explain it and say why it’ll make us all happier, healthier and wealthier in the long run.