[Closed] Ever wondered what the Welsh Valleys are really like?

I watched the one where a fella had beaten his mate up in his house and dumped him round the corner to try and get away with it.

Feeling in the community was he had gone too far...

Made me quite sad to watch it, the slow decline of communities over several generations.

People torn between leaving friends and family to find work or staying and feeling life has somehow passed them by.

Very similar to the ex mining communities of Ayrshire in many ways, beautiful countryside, no jobs, lots of good folks still there surrounded by depravation, drugs and huge levels of alcohol abuse, immensely sad.

I live in one of the Welsh Valley's and wouldn't want to live anywhere else tbh.

all mining communities are/were the same.
fantastic places to live if you come from there, but pretty alien to outsiders/incomers. 8)

Huw Greene was my valet.

The particular problem for the Welsh Valleys is the historically poor transport connections

The particular problem for the Welsh Valleys is geography. No company in their right mind would be base there, when they can be based in the M4 corridor. The thing for the Welsh government is to ensure that the M4 corridor has plenty of companies and hence, jobs, that people can commute to.

Same as Calderdale as well, where as recently as 2007 a teenager was kicked to death for belonging to a different culture.

The particular problem for the Welsh Valleys is the historically poor transport connections.

The rush-hour traffic has to be seen to be believed. It's almost as though the whole of each valley is trying to get south at the same time! Going into Llantrisant or Pontypridd in the mornings is not fun and the A470 is one giant car park. But then it's to be expected when you have multiple parallel valleys and no roads linking them over the tops. I think it's why some people never leave, they can't 😛

A friend of my wife lives in the Valleys and by christ it is a scary place. We were in a pub and I got 'asked outside' simply because I wasn't a local. I was only saved from a brutal beating by the friend intervening and letting the scrotes know I was with her and it was all okay.

:-O

Her hubby is now a policeman in the force down there – not seen him on the show though.

This is going to sound harsh but very few industries continue indefinitely....yet former mining towns and villages seem to think they were entitled to jobs for life from the coal industry.

It's like all the mobile (and static) deisel tuners at the moment, a few years ago they were raking it in as people took their 150bhp Golf to 250bhp for a few hundred quid....things must be slowing now and with deisel phasing out they'll be looking for work soon.

You adapt, don't get complacent, take courses when they're offered to you, be willing to travel etc....there's loads of people in my town/village area of Wales (Lampeter/Llanwnnen) who moan there's no jobs, no social mobility etc....true, it's like retirement city here but if you're willing to travel 1/2 hour to Carmarthen in one direction or the same in the other direction to Aberystwyth then there are plenty of jobs...as above if you're willing to travel for an hour it gets you down to Swansea, Llanelli and access to more work...but this requires effort and its easier to moan there's not a 25k a year job at the end of your road than put the leg work in.

The attitude since I've been here (even among locals) is that there is plenty of work if you're willing to travel, the problem is the attitude to work....in the South East where I'm from it is considered nothing to commute over an hour to work....here in Lampeter locals consider Carmarthen a long way a way (30 mins)....change that and you change the whole face of the area positively.

When we fell in love with the area and decided to move here we were well aware that jobs were thin on the ground but we were also prepared to travel up to 90mins to get to work, that put us in touching distanceb of Cardiff...no problems then, but talk like that to locals and they think you're mad.

Public transport is actually really good with buses going from the village and town to Carmarthen and Aberystwyth every half hour from 6am through to 9pm, now this won't be perfect for all jobs but it's a damn site better than the South East was.

In the South East people will move house and relocate for work, talk like that here and locals will look at you like you've got two heads...it's a very old fashioned parochial view that hasn't changed with time.

I had a night out in Aberdare once, on the day that England beet Wales at rugby by the highest ever margin 😯 it was,.... scary

Well said Deviant, couldn't agree more.

I tried watching that series, but they were all speaking some weird foreign language that I couldn't understand

It's got subtitles for most of it.

Only Gogs and posh South Welsh people speak actual Welsh.

[i]You adapt, don't get complacent, take courses when they're offered to you, be willing to travel [/i]

This made me quite sad when I read it a week back - people who put their trust in a politician putting their lives on hold waiting for him to deliver what he promised. The rest of the world look on and think 'you poor fools'.

[url= https://www.reuters.com/article/us-trump-effect-coal-retraining-insight/awaiting-trumps-coal-comeback-miners-reject-retraining-idUSKBN1D14G0 ]https://www.reuters.com/article/us-trump-effect-coal-retraining-insight/awaiting-trumps-coal-comeback-miners-reject-retraining-idUSKBN1D14G0[/url]

[img] [/img]

@Deviant - Interesting point around commute times

i'm in London my limit is an hour's commute. Fair few people around me with commutes longer than that

The particular problem for the Welsh Valleys is geography. No company in their right mind would be base there, when they can be based in the M4 corridor.

i had a manufacturing client in Merthyr, the welsh assembly basically gave them a huge industrial unit to expand into for free. i remember going to Asda at lunchtime and it was basically full of obese mums in onesies and a high proportion of mobility scooters.

it a grim place.

In the South East people will move house and relocate for work, talk like that here and locals will look at you like you've got two heads...it's a very old fashioned parochial view that hasn't changed with time.

Possibly your would be happier in the South East. Not everyone wants to up and relocate away from families and communities - family and community bonds are that somewhat stronger in Wales I would say and I am not sure why good jobs cannot be brought to the valleys and the West.

I watched the one where a fella had beaten his mate up in his house and dumped him round the corner to try and get away with it.

Feeling in the community was he had gone too far...

TBF ... the victim didn't.

He didn't press chargers although he was put into intensive care !!

Look out .. generalisation ... the Welsh seem to love a tear up ?? ... (actually I'd add most of the west country to that sweeping statement)

I studied at trefforest and lived in and around the environs of Ponypridd for 3 years. Going to Uni there after 19 years of the leafy New Forest was an eye opener to say the least.

I drove through Wales about 10 years ago.
Going through some of the villages people would look at me in my car and their eyes were saying" I don't care where you are going,take me with you."
To be fair most people think Hastings is a shit hole but once you know the place it's great.

Possibly your would be happier in the South East. Not everyone wants to up and relocate away from families and communities - family and community bonds are that somewhat stronger in Wales I would say and I am not sure why good jobs cannot be brought to the valleys and the West.

I'm happy here, you couldn't pay me enough to go back to England....but the attitude to work here stinks, that's all I was pointing out.

I also agree about jobs being spread around the country, if you want a nicer UK in general (and I think we all do) then governments need to offer incentives to get companies to expand or setup in regional areas...I'd vote for whoever promised that but even Labour politicians seem to be London centric these days, sad really.

I also agree about jobs being spread around the country, if you want a nicer UK in general (and I think we all do) then governments need to offer incentives to get companies to expand or setup in regional areas...I'd vote for whoever promised that but even Labour politicians seem to be London centric these days, sad really.

Amen to that. Something Germany does very well, though history is against us in the UK as London has been preeminent for - what - a millenium now?

+1 for deviant, definitely the attitude there with regards to travelling or moving to the work. You're a braver man than me though if you say that to them though 😯

I saw the one with the rubbish armed robbers and the lad whose car they'd used, who'd been buzzing for a fortnight.

Bit of an eye-opener. Good TV, very non-judgemental.

It's a great TV program & really struck a chord with the places I have seen on my drive to trail centres, such as Cwmcarn & CyB.

We stay in Trawsfynydd normally when visiting CyB (which I know is at the other end of the country from Valley Cops), and that seems like a very similar village with people who are trapped & very little local work.

When we started going, there was a pub up the road & a bar at the hotel down the road. Then over time, the pub closed & last time we went everyone was piled into the hotel bar.
There is a bit of an aggressive undercurrent when you walk in, but we have always found it to be pretty friendly once you get involved & chat to a few people.

One of the issues is company's don't want to relocate to places like Wales as there is a shortage of skilled staff there. So even if the council offer incentives, businesses cant get the right staff.

Not sure if you can overcome that situation.

If you want to run a successful business you site it where there is lots of qualified willing to work labour.

We stay in Trawsfynydd normally when visiting CyB (which I know is at the other end of the country from Valley Cops), and that seems like a very similar village with people who are trapped & very little local work.

Used to fish the reservoir there. Had to buy day tickets from the post office I think it was, and had a few loud comments passed in Welsh between them.
Probably should have checked my dear old Gran, who was already pissed at being dragged 'up North' wasn't browsing the postcards next to them.
Not much funnier than little old ladies swearing like navvies in any language.

and I am not sure why good jobs cannot be brought to the valleys and the West.

Poor transport links and low quality skill set.

1st world countries can't compete on low skill manufacturing, so if that's all your population is trained for, you're a bit screwed.

As for service based stuff like Amazon Hubs, it's in the middle of nowhere with crap transport, so not suitable.

There isn't a simple solution, that doesn't involve a lot of investment and people upskilling. Or people moving somewhere where there are jobs.....

i'm in London my limit is an hour's commute. Fair few people around me with commutes longer than that

How much do you earn? There aren't many jobs advertised within 90 minute's commute of Lampeter for more than £25k, and certainly not unskilled ones. More likely you'll be earning less than £20k, possibly NMW.

It's like all the mobile (and static) deisel tuners at the moment, a few years ago they were raking it in as people took their 150bhp Golf to 250bhp for a few hundred quid....things must be slowing now and with deisel phasing out they'll be looking for work soon.

Are you really comparing the loss of the coal industry to engine tuning? 😆

I would add that the show only really represented the worst aspects of the Valleys - actually not the very worst, I duck in and out of Methadone clinics in the Valleys for work sometimes and I've seen worse than on Valley Cops.

Lots of people work hard and do well for themselves in the Valleys, one of my mates is from Merthyr and spends his weeks flying between the UK, Norway and Sweden doing something highly skilled and well paid with Data Centres (lord knows what).

Like others have said there are some great challenges facing young people in a lot of places up the Valleys, mutli-generational unemployment which makes having a job seem unusual, not the norm, little work close to you and a fairly hefty cost of living difference between the Valley's and the 3 main Cities in the South means a long commute for a lot of people - great if you do well you can move a bit closer, but it's a huge leap up.

This was partly why I was amazed most of the valley's voted 'leave' (wow, I know another thread derailed by the EU) but Westminster never wanted to invest outside of the South East, whereas the EU spends fortunes in the Valleys - a new road, or better rail links could transform the place in time, but I doubt it'll ever happen.

Trimix - Member
One of the issues is company's don't want to relocate to places like Wales as there is a shortage of skilled staff there. So even if the council offer incentives, businesses cant get the right staff.

Not sure if you can overcome that situation.

If you want to run a successful business you site it where there is lots of qualified willing to work labour.

[url= http://uk.reuters.com/article/us-trump-effect-coal-retraining-insight/awaiting-trumps-coal-comeback-miners-reject-retraining-idUKKBN1D14G0 ]Its not just in Wales that people put their head in the sand[/url]

It was like watching the the turkey voting for xmas. It doesn't take long for you to spot all the EU Directive 1/2/3 signs next to any new projects in Wales. The Heads of the Valley upgrade might never be completed, the second phase of Merthyr's redevelopment has been halted and the few good jobs in the area are all in the EU offices that will now close.

I've come to the conclusion that there are basically two types of people in Merthyr: those that work and those that don't. The ones that work are decent people who work hard and help others when they can (see the recent crowdfunding for the little girl with cancer as an example). Then you have the ones who have never worked and never really plan to. The locals I have mentioned this to agree so it's not just me being obtuse. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground! Seems to be similar throughout the Valleys.

we were also prepared to travel up to 90mins to get to work, that put us in touching distanceb of Cardiff...no problems then, but talk like that to locals and they think you're mad.

I lived in Merthyr for a while (early teens to early 20's), parents still do. My experience was it's mostly the women fighting but every local seems to box as a hobby (especially the scrawny ones) so best to avoid a fight if you can.

It's generally a bit of a depressing place, like the rough areas of a city but 90% of it is like that. On the plus side it's on the edge of the Brecon Beacons and plenty of decent road riding and MTBing to be had so it's not all bad.

There used to be a pretty dodgy pub next to my parents, I spent many a night watching fights break out and police vans roll up, was usually more entertaining than watching TV.

There used to be a pretty dodgy pub next to my parents, I spent many a night watching fights break out and police vans roll up, was usually more entertaining than watching TV.

We have a Weatherspoons in Cambridge, which has a police presence most nights...

yet former mining towns and villages seem to think they were entitled to jobs for life from the coal industry

The problem was never with the decline of the coal industry as a principle. Everyone knew it wasn't going to last forever. Remember that the people complaining were the ones going underground themselves.

The issue is with how it was handled. The Tories at the time just closed the mines (even if there was coal still left) and then wanted to let the market work naturally and let the towns die. They didn't care about the human cost of such a strategy.

As for suggesting you're lazy if you don't want to drive 90 mins to work - what kind of a world would we end up with if everyone did that? A shit one. No-one (who isn't a taxi/lorry/bus driver) should spend three hours a day sat in a car.

Some fascinating insights here. Never realised it was all so simple.
Basically, valleys people are either strivers or shirkers.
The shirkers need to get on their bikes to find work.
Great stuff.

As for suggesting you're lazy if you don't want to drive 90 mins to work - what kind of a world would we end up with if everyone did that? A shit one. No-one (who isn't a taxi/lorry/bus driver) should spend three hours a day sat in a car.

Personally I think anyone who drives to work is a bit odd, given they could just buy a smaller house nearer work and walk/cycle. But each to their own!

The issue is with how it was handled. The Tories at the time just closed the mines (even if there was coal still left) and then wanted to let the market work naturally and let the towns die. They didn't care about the human cost of such a strategy.

It was a deliberate strategy to destroy communities.

Fwiw I worked in Blackwood for a while.
It wasn't very different to the place I grew up.

The issue is with how it was handled. The Tories at the time just closed the mines (even if there was coal still left) and then wanted to let the market work naturally and let the towns die. They didn't care about the human cost of such a strategy.

It became a fight to be won in the end and the Miners are at least partly to blame, they allowed their union to hold the country to ransom - 'pay us more or we'll turn the lights out' and they did from time to time.

It's not surprising if you know the history of Mining in the UK, in the early days miners (which included Men, Women and Children) were effectively slaves, they were paid just enough to survive, but not in money, but in tokens that could only be spent in the Mine owned shops, which kept them poor and unable to leave to go anywhere else.

Still, Arthur Scargil and Thatcher ended up in a personal pissing contest and everyone else suffered which brought it to and end - sadly for South Wales though, unlike most other countries with large reserves of natural resources once the Bute's were no longer involved no one thought to invest any of the money in the areas that it's based to ensure there's a plan for it to run out, they just sucked every penny out to build the South East and left everyone to rot once it ended.

It became a fight to be won in the end and the Miners are at least partly to blame, they allowed their union to hold the country to ransom - 'pay us more or we'll turn the lights out' and they did from time to time.

What else were they supposed to do?

Personally I think anyone who drives to work is a bit odd, given they could just buy a smaller house nearer work and walk/cycle. But each to their own!

Personally I think anyone who drives to work is a bit odd, given they could just buy a smaller house nearer work and walk/cycle. But each to their own!

And I would rather my family and I live somewhere nice with more space and access to the countryside and open space than in a cramped, polluted dump near my work so I can cycle commute.

Each to their own I suppose...

What else were they supposed to do?

Massively increase productivity and efficiency in an attempt ot secure their future and still get screwed over anyway?

Thats what happened to the steelworkers round my way when they were in exactly the same position. It didn't make a difference.

footflaps - Member

We have a Weatherspoons in Cambridge, which has a police presence most nights...

And the most middle class post of the week goes to... 😆

footflaps - Member
We have a Weatherspoons in Cambridge, which has a police presence most nights...

And the most middle class post of the week goes to...

Well...if the place cant supply enough gluten and dairy free quinoa salads, the locals will stand up for themselves and take action 😆

Personally I think anyone who drives to work is a bit odd, given they could just buy a smaller house nearer work and walk/cycle. But each to their own!

Increasingly people don't have much in the way of job security so buying a new house everytime you switched jobs would be pretty stupid.

Beat me to it.

Hardly many "jobs for life" left these days and it costs upwards of £15k to move house last time I checked.

It's a Welsh valley phenomenon. Industries collapse all over the world. Especially primary industries.

Limited other industries can offer some jobs but will never replace the mass employment of some large primary industry. It's sad but most will need to travel for work, work away for some periods or move. The UK does need a geographically more balanced economy but you will never replace the mass employment in places like the valleys.

And I would rather my family and I live somewhere nice with more space and access to the countryside and open space than in a cramped, polluted dump near my work so I can cycle commute.

Each to their own I suppose...

I always assumed, that after having kids, we'd move out of the city for the reasons you give. But I'm very glad we didn't. They have so much to do here, all of which accessible by foot or bike, and even if I get stuck at work, I can still be home in 15 minutes so I can spend some time for them rather than being stuck in traffic. Car commuting really is the pits.

Ransos - you are assuming that we all work in the city!

I work in an industrial estate off a motorway surrounded by noise and pollution from the motorway, noise and pollution from factories and other industrial units.

Give me a nice little village on the edge of the countryside and a 40 minute drive through the countryside any day.

I work in the middle of London and my commute is around 2 hours each way a day. I'm far from the only one doing it (check my train at 6:30am). Why? A) I'd never live in London and B)it'd cost a fortune to move here C)The wages are higher D)What I do is pretty niche and therefore limited to large cities.

However, its grim and I hate it - the plan is to stop in a few years when I'll look to move north again and finally have some decent biking on my doorstep. I'm not sure how much longer I can leave the house at 6:30 and not get home until 20:00.

hooli, I agree, sounds ghastly, all that pollution from the motorway which carries the people from their currently quiet, cheap, outlying residences....

I don't tend to use the motorway, prefer the back roads myself 😉

Ransos - you are assuming that we all work in the city!

I work in an industrial estate off a motorway surrounded by noise and pollution from the motorway, noise and pollution from factories and other industrial units.

No, I was telling you about my personal experience. Anyway, I used to commute by car from the city to an industrial estate by the motorway. Because I was heading out when everyone else was heading in, it took me 15 minutes.

It's a Welsh valley phenomenon.

Geography is a pretty significant issue in this particular location.

Oh good, another commuting cock waving thread.

I commuted from Merthyr to Bristol for a year when I started my job down here - never again am I going to waste 2-3 hours of my life commuting each day (I get pissy if it's 10 minutes these days...)

Oh good, another commuting cock waving thread.

I'm not a connoisseur of such threads. Is it usual to brag about your cock being small?

"The particular problem for the Welsh Valleys is geography."

The new A465 should help I think. After years in discussion it looks like the final links in the project are finally moving ahead/ going out to tender next year.

It's a Welsh valley phenomenon.

Geography is a pretty significant issue in this particular location

Sorry bloody auto correct phone that should have read "it's not a Welsh valley phenomenon" which make the rest of the post make more sense.

The new A465 should help I think. After years in discussion it looks like the project is finally moving ahead/ going out to tender next year.

I wouldn't be too optimistic about that just yet. The current works in the Gorge between Brynmawr and Gilwern ares sucking up all the funding for any next stages (over projected budget already). Add in that the EU funds are now lost for the next stages and it could be a while.

The biggest issue road-wise is that it would be great to interconnect each valley halfway down but that means going over the mountains, not easy and not suitable for heavy goods vehicles. The geography that worked so well for the old railways to the docks is now stifling any movements.

I didnt think it looked that bad to be honest.. Plenty of areas all over the uk just like it and many much worse. I can guarantee you wouldnt get a chance to film at all on many estates and those agreeing to appear wouldnt be dealt with too friendly either.

remember going to Asda at lunchtime and it was basically full of obese mums in onesies and a high proportion of mobility scooters.

Was in Wales for a two week MTB to back in May. This is one thing that really struck us. The number of fat, obese and people who looked like they had no self respect waddling around. You would think that with all those mountains and free time they would be a darn sight healthier than they appeared to be.

Amen to that. Something Germany does very well, though history is against us in the UK as London has been preeminent for - what - a millenium now?

Germany is a relatively young country. Germany as a nation has only existed since 1871. Before that (and to a great extent still is) it was a collection of independent principalities and lands, each with its own regional centre. Power and trade was never centralised like it is in the UK/London

The only reason Berlin is the capital is because it was the main city of Prussia which came to "rule" the new Germany. Its location is crap,<100kmm from Poland, rubbish transport links to most of the country, miles away from the profitable markets. In many ways Hamburg (ports & trade), Frankfurt (navigable rivers & long history as financial centre) or Cologne (industrial centre and on the Rhine) would be better locations for a capital city.
London is the UK capital as since Roman times it has been close to international markets and had good links to the rest of the country.

It is the same reason that Italy has so many smaller cities of real significance and Rome isn't the one-stop-shop like London is.

*Sorry for the tangent...

Only on STW could people watch a tv program with an obvious agenda of playing to an ignorant stereotype ... and believe it.

Go to any housing estate in any part of the UK and you will find the usual idiots that these type of programs love to show; it’s not a valleys thing.

I remember watching the Scheme set in Kilmarnock loads o bampots on that, I wouldn't go there for a holiday weekend

I still have a soft spot for the valleys, even though I moved away last year...

Stunning scenery - mountains, forests, rivers, pretty good land access, good sense of community... Yes, there are some really skanky bits and the usual collection of wasters.

That said, most of the folks I knew / know loved the outdoors and were very proud of their "secret" local "paradise" - I could rarely be bothered to drive to a trail centre when all I really had to do was open the back gate and ride 🙂

In terms of "Valleys Sh!tholes" - most of them are honoured on here:

I’ve only ever lived in the valleys, in the village where the tv series Stella is filmed. There is little employment locally, but I’ve rarely been out of work since leaving School in 1996. Alway travelled between 40 mins - 1&1/2 hrs to building sites in surrounding cities. I’ve also always thought that areas I travel to to work are far rougher and the crimes more serious than I see at home.
The types found on this show do exist, and there is plenty of lazy people around, but good far outweigh the bad.

Oh, and We also have natural trails everywhere, bpw in one direction, Afan another direction and cwmcarn the other way.

The biggest issue road-wise is that it would be great to interconnect each valley halfway down but that means going over the mountains,

Stunning scenery - mountains..

Mountains? Hills yes, but no mountains around here.

They are called Mynydd in Welsh which translates to 'mountain' in English, but it's not exactly the same word. So every valley has a 'mountain' on either side regardless of how tall it is.

They are called Mynydd in Welsh which translates to 'mountain' in English, but it's not exactly the same word. So every valley has a 'mountain' on either side regardless of how tall it is.

😆

Only just noticed your reply molgrips. Yes you're right. Doesn't make them mountains though. 😛

Not deep in the valleys but lived in Cwmbran for a bit and while it had some roughness the locals were fairly charming. My first experience of a working mens club (women were allowed in by the 90s!) which was a really social and happy place, and a classic "local pub for local people", no tables, sawdust on the floor and a dartboard, and yet the locals were really friendly. It did help having some locals to go with though. There was a bit of the Slaughtered Lamb feel on walking in the door.

Cwmbran also at the time had a fair few tech companies, hence why I was there, as it's close enough to the M4. And free parking in town! (though crap town centre).