I think it would allow us to make trade arrangements with other countries which the rules of the EU don’t allow us to do.

I don’t think there is any requirement for us to join the EEA in order to get such an arrangement – we’d simply have to negotiate it with the EU. Realpolitik suggests there’s also a realistic chance of the EU agreeing to such an arrangement as it would be beneficial to them without seeming so advantageous to us that it would make it tempting for other countries to leave. At least I’m sure it could be framed in such a way as to ensure that.

Don’t get the idea I would rather this than staying in the EU, but it does appear to be one way to comply with the vote without slitting our own throat. Who cares what Nigel thinks?

Morning news conferences at the BBC they look at the mail. telegraph and express to decide what is news that day

Of course, you have proof of this.

Of course not. But then they’re knob heads, and I’d hate to think that our country (yes, our country) could be held to ransom by the threat of them creating trouble because mummy didn’t let them have their own way.

Norway option is far worse. Remember how it came about, the people voted NOT to join and the government didn’t like it so they signed up for pretty much everything anyway inc budget contribution

The short sharp shock of Hard Brexit is best imho. As I have said many times the EU we will be negotiating with come Nov 2017 will look very different than the one we see today. Somehow I doubt politicans have the necessary courage so we’ll get some sort of fudge or interim / tapered exit agreement.

BBC News: I have an old (now distant) friend who is a newsreader, they most certainly do not take a lead from the printed press (never did and can’t see them doing it now that papers are even less relevant).

TJ the BBC is comfortably left of centre. The left don’t like to admit that as it means they can’t “blame the media” for their troubles

Edit

Or do you 5th?

😆 I think the last paper I bought was the Beano. Come on, why would anyone buy a paper? Or a magazine, or a book. You’ll be telling me people go to actual shops to go shopping next.

Of course, you have proof of this.

Ah but he didn’t say they looked at only those papers!

Yay – following normal policy on this thread, it’s now clear to me that we’ll be fine with the Norway option.

Morning news conferences at the BBC they look at the mail. telegraph and express to decide what is news that day

I’m friends with a current BBC journo (in fact I was best man at her wedding), is it worth me fact checking this or can we write it off as hyperbole?

Anyone else get the feeling that Brexit is going to become the new normal.

In 10 years time or so we’ll still be in the EU but the 4th or 5th item on the news will be about the latest vote in parliament about a particular part of the process towards triggering Article 50.

At every election Labour and the Tories will try to outdo each other on how fantastic a deal they’re going to get as soon as they trigger article 50. The Lib-Dems will be promising to abandon Article 50 if they get in power (and then not abandon it if they do get in power) and the SNP will be poised to call a referendum the minute that Article 50 is triggered.

The UK will have evolved from that annoying country that wants special treatment all the time to that annoying country that says it’s leaving but never does.

FWIW critism of judges for interpreting the law is ridiculous.

Its not just criticism

the Judges have been declared Enemies of the People by the most poplar ‘news’ website in the country
with some extra homphobia thrown in
there are 1000s of comments on social media the echo these sentiments and some incredibly brazen threats of violence against Gina Miller in particular, all re-enforced by the political bottomfeeders tweeting above (go and look on facebook, people arent hiding their threats)
I got a lovely threat (with casual homophobia thrownin) via facebook from an EDL member for commenting on the advisory nature of the referendum.

Politicians, media and the public attacking the judiciary for simply explaining the law is a sign of a very sick political climate and May and Truss failing to condem this because they want an easy ride through parliament is shameful.

hardly anyone pays attention to the newspapers, y

The DM (and the sun) is still incredibly influential, it has a history of supporting the Nazis and fascists it cant put behind it and just as it was with scapegoating the jews, post truth politics is now trying to scapegoat the EU, immigrants or anyone who it disagrees with.
they wrote about jews exactly as they write about immigrants now…

they supported these douchebags

with this

and now the gay pro european judges are Enemies of the People

well Feind Unseres Folkes is exactly what the Nazis called the jews

Brexit and its major proponents are poisoning this country

The short sharp shock of Hard Brexit is best imho

best for who – not best for those who loose their livelihoods, homes etc. Only best for you possibly.

Can we just put a hold on this until I find the barsteward who scratched my car?

It will have been an immigrant, captain. Bound to be – it’s all their fault.

A Tory MP has compared the DM article to a nazi paper . Says it all really .

Neb – Member
What exactly is the benefit of a Norway type relationship compared to our current position?

It’s Brexit without Brexit.

We keep free market and keep free movement which keeps Remainers happy so it’s a reluctant win.

But it’s a form of Brexit so it complies with the referendum so for the Brexiters its a reluctant win.

That’s the goal for the Tories and Labour. Brexit doesn’t follow normal party lines – both camps both have members as staunch voters and yeah Brexit won the vote but it was famously close.

The fact it’s a shit solution doesn’t come into it.

Hell, what’s the downside? No voice in Europe? FFS most of us can’t be arsed to vote in the Euro elections and we put up with UKIP running the show for years, what’s the deference?

And the government of the day can spend the next couple of decades blaming the EU for bad news, even more so because we’re powerless to do anything about it and whose fault is that? The electorate.

JC has fired the first shot, access to free market or labour will vote against (not that I think his position is strong enough to follow that up) between that, 2 Tory resignations, an SNP that will never vote for A50, nah unless The Supreme Court over-turn the high court it’s all over for ‘Hard Brexit’ – not that even May would push that suicide mission through.

**** it, give the leavers some spitfires and blue passports and they’ll crawl back under their rock – 10 years and 50% are dead or too old and mental to vote and we can put this shit to bed.

Can we just put a hold on this until I find the barsteward who scratched my car?

He’s probably pissed off back to Romania clinging to the underside of a lorry. Well I imagine that’s what the DM story would have us believe.

oh look the kippers arent scared of revealing their antisemitism now either

Facebook group for UKIP supporters posts claim that Jews are conspiring against Brexit

best for who – not best for those who loose their livelihoods, homes etc. Only best for you possibly.

How many times do I have to say it, no personal gain from Brexit. I’m too old to see the real benefits which will flow to my kids as the UK avoids EU driven stagnation and looks outwards to the world.

On the press thing – its common knowledge and confirmed to me by a bbc journalist – yes they look at other papers as well but if the mail, express and telegraph all lead with the same story then the BBC will as well.

Your kids voted remain Jambalaya.

BruceWee – I very much doubt it will last that long. it will be two years andif no deal is reached we will be out on our ear. and IMO no deal is possible. The EU will not compromise on movement of people to any significant extent and that is a red line for the outies. Nor is an EEA deal possible – the other EEA countries don’t want the UK in it mucking things up for them and that would not satisfy the outies anyway.

So no deal. Its either out on our ear with nothing or reverse the decision to leave.

oh look the kippers arent scared of revealing their antisemitism now either

If UKIP implodes they’ll feel at home in Labour 😀

If UKIP implodes they’ll feel at home in Labour 😀

yup coz antisemitism is hilarious 🙄

All of them? I can’t find it now, but somebody mentioned earlier a prominent leave campaigner who was in favour of free movement of people. It would only take 4% of those who voted Leave to agree with that for there to be a majority of those who voted in favour of retaining free movement, and I’d be surprised if it was anywhere near that low.

Nor is an EEA deal possible – the other EEA countries don’t want the UK in it

Are you ignoring my earlier point that there is no requirement at all for us to join the EEA in order to get a similar deal?

No requirement no – but I can’t see it happening. Would the EU really create a whole new category just for us? I very much doubt it. I think we will either be given a take it or leave it option or nothing at all. I don’t see the EU being at all inclined to do the uk any favours at all. Remeber one of the EUs aims in any negotiations will be to stop any incentive for anyone else to follow so they will not be likely to offer anything advantageous. the EU hold al lthe cards here

Well they already have a unique category for Switzerland – strangely enough one which is very similar to that enjoyed by EEA members – so I can’t see any logical reason why they couldn’t have one for us. Doing so doesn’t appear to break any of their rules. It’s not about doing us favours, it’s about what’s best for the EU and I don’t think it would be at all difficult to sell this in that way. Realpolitik.

Whats best for the EU is to play hardball – if the UK get a good deal then others will want the same deal. Thats a huge driving force for them.

How many times do I have to say it, no personal gain from Brexit. I’m too old to see the real benefits which will flow to my kids as the UK avoids EU driven stagnation and looks outwards to the world.

Your kids with the right to claim French citizenship as do you if it all goes wrong?

And how many times do you have to be asked – how many jobs and lives is your ‘project’ worth wrecking – as you’ve never answered.

Of course. But I don’t see why it’s not possible to package this in a way which isn’t seen as a sufficiently good reason for other countries to leave the EU in order to get it. After all we are talking about something which will be worse than what we currently have, just not catastrophically worse.

How exactly are leave movements in other countries going to sell the idea of being like the UK to the bulk of their supporters who want to get rid of the stuff we’d be keeping under such an arrangement? If anything giving us such a deal might even quell some of those feelings.

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/the-brexiters-guide-to-whats-british-20161104116565

kimbers – Member

oh look the kippers arent scared of revealing their antisemitism now either

Absolutely inevitable tbh- recent experience with chav-baiting, fat-shaming, and muslim-bashing and any number of others has told people it’s OK to hate difference again. It’s all the same shit, literally the exact same- fear and ignorance, ignorance and fear, hate of the Other and the desire to feel better than others without making any effort to actually deserve it, and to find someone to blame, anyone- but let’s be honest, a lot of people really didn’t care when it was just people they don’t like that were getting shat on. Stupid leftards, with their political correctness, defending these workshy scroungers, and dirty eastern europeans who take our jobs, and pikey trash… Bleeding heart do-gooders the lot of em. It’s fine to hate as long as you’re hating the people I hate! Just don’t cross that line, that ism is fine but not this other, nearly identical ism, for some reason.

and it’s happened, that Mash article read as if they gave up half way through and went you know what? There is not point to satire lets all just go to the pub.

and if everyone is sitting down…
Jezza has a position
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-labour-block-article-50-theresa-may-cannot-guarantee-single-market-access-brexit-a7400266.html

Enola herself said people didn’t vote to become poorer. If she can’t deliver on something where that’s not going to happen …….

Wow, not only a position, but a pretty bold one, which would prevent May doing what she claims she wants to do (I’m assuming there are sufficient Tory MPs who would also vote that way). Very interesting times.

Trouble Aracer – a deal like you hint at would not satisfy the leavers and the eurosceptic press.

Trouble is I don’t think there is a deal that would satisfy all the leavers and skeptic press. From the racists to the make Britain great lot and those that just want to watch it all burn.

https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/prosecute-the-daily-mail-for-contempt