It’s good to know that the government knows better than the food industry, and is so sure that food availability won’t be a problem. Its just price and choice that will be affected, apparently, so that still confirm that Brexit is a good idea

Given that the current Foreign Secretary whilst he was Brexit Secretary expressed genuine surprise on discovering that, as an island, we’re quite dependent on our ports, what do you expect?

The bottom line is that this shower of ****s couldn’t care less if poor people see a massive impact on their lives due to rapidly rising prices of basic things like food.

It’s all worth it if they get to live out some neo-colonial, flag-waving fantasy

The bottom line is that this shower of ****s couldn’t care less if poor people see a massive impact on their lives due to rapidly rising prices of basic things like food.

obviously. its their fault for being poor.

No one is excluding racism/xenophobia as a motive, just pointing out that assuming that it’s the case before the facts are known isn’t the right thought process.

It’s amusing how virulent you people are inexcluding a possible motive. Heads firmly in the sand concerning a very nasty and well-documented trend in British society which the reputable press doesn’t hesite to link to Brexit – an increase in hate crime.

God you do like to pontificate don’t you. I think itc was quite reasonable in suggesting mental illness rather than xenophobia. I have no doubt there’s been a rise in hate crimes etc caused by brexit but there’s nothing in this incident to suggest that yet but don’t let that effect your diatribe about a horrific incident the causes of which are still unknown to the general public.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/in-crisis/201811/hate-is-not-mental-illness?fbclid=IwAR0ioZzj4mR-eWBHbFgyQtQGbyxa3NKkLzkpG24axLpUO8qa84y3fVt3qts

Thanks for the link to support what I said about mental illnes and discrimination not being mutually exclusive, Kilo. Now take it a step further and Google things like “hate crime Brexit catalyst”.

There’s a Brexit mentality that says britons are somehow superior and as soon as people consider themselves superior then others have a lower worth. It pervades the news I see coming out of Britian and the US at present (peas of a pod). Just as those two nations are seeing their world status challenged, not least because their recent behaviour means they’ve lost their former role and credibility as a world police or being on the side of right and good.

Fear is setting in, fear of the Chinese, the Russians, the Iranians (dear me), the North Koreans, the Mexicans, the Poles, the Europeans. Fear driven by the gutter media and transformed into hate. The political rhetoric plays on the paranoia and idiots (whether mentaly ill or not) starts taking it into their own hands to go on their own punitive racist missions on levels from mild unpleasantness to murder. Just browse Youtube and you’ll find people from elsewhere being told to go home in the most unpleasant manner. Watch the news and you’ll see worse, with totally implausible half-hearted condemnations from politicians the who ride on the wave suspicion, fear, hate and rejection of anyone foreign.

There’s a Brexit mentality that says britons are somehow superior

That is in no way restricted to British people. The issue is that Brexit presented these people with an opportunity to use that sentiment to drastically alter the course of the country and ruin it for everyone else.

Now take it a step further and Google things like “hate crime Brexit catalyst”.

Did you not read the bit in my post “ I have no doubt there’s been a rise in hate crimes, etc caused by brexit” in case you didn’t I have no doubt there’s been a rise in hate crimes etc caused by brexit.
The link between mental illness and discrimination in the article, it ends “ If instead we continue to hope that every angry, entitled male with a grudge and an arsenal can be cured by the mental health system, we doom ourselves to watching these tragedies unfold again and again.” which pretty much sums up that racist attacks aren’t in the main as a result of mental illness.

In more lovely news:

BBC News – Brexit: Food industry seeks no-deal competition waiver
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49258852

It’s good to know that the government knows better than the food industry, and is so sure that food availability won’t be a problem. Its just price and choice that will be affected, apparently, so that still confirm that Brexit is a good idea…

While May was trying to repeatedly get her WA through parliament, I can almost forgive government from not “scare mongering” by not acknowledging in public the real concerns about food distribution if No Deal came to pass. Albeit I think a lot of pro-Brexit believers, especially those on lower than average household incomes, should have been given a wake up call.

But for Boris and his chums to now be enjoying a well deserved holiday, despite No Deal now staring us in the face and so little preparation for No Deal having been organised before Boris took over the Tory lunatic asylum is unforgivable.

Supermarket shelves are going to be full of gaps, what’s available is going to further increase in price, more lower earners are going to needing help from food banks.

The very politicians that sold many pro-Brexit voters a load of lies and half-truths now have the Brexit Robin Reliant accelerator pedal fully to the metal, thinking they can win a game of chicken against the EU juggernaut. Absolutely delusional and lower earners will be the first to shatter.

So who do you fancy for the interim PM if Liz does her bit and sacks Johnson after losing a VONC?
I liked Grieves comment that she does actually have a role to play and that she is not just an ornament to the British constitution.
Liz has form regarding dismissing PMs with the dismissal of Gough Whitlam the Australian PM in 1975 albeit at arms length on that occasion. If she has the bottle she would get to do it face to face this time. Her Dirty Harry moment ‘does one feel lucky’?
So far its Ken Clarke, Dominic Grieve, Margaret Beckett or Yvette Cooper as possible unity PM.
My money is on Clarke with Beckett the outsider but then I don’t expect Liz will actually do her bit. Just take the money and keep her head down.

What I still can’t get my head around is how 45% of the population actually think No Deal is a good idea.

It’s because 99% of those 45% don’t have the vaguest notion of what it actually means. They think it’ll be business as usual, “no deal” = “not giving those funny foreigners anything.”

I heard some clown yesterday saying “I bet its just like the millennium bug, all these people talking about a disaster and then we wake up in after Dec 31st, 1999 and everything is fine”

Out of everything in this clusteryouknowwhat that makes me cross, this argument is the one thing that sets me absolutely **** incandescent. It’s weapons-grade ignorance and stupidity.

The Y2K issue was a non-event because a lot of people spent months, years in some cases, working very hard to ensure that it was a non-event. I know because I was one of them. It should have been hailed as a global triumph of planning, engineering and collaboration, but instead the world went “well, what was all the fuss about then?”

Go back a couple of hundred pages

Go back a couple of hundred pages and you’ll find where I explained to you, slowly and carefully and in great detail, exactly why you’re talking abject bollocks. Why you’re still talking abject bollocks months later I simply cannot fathom, it’s like talking to chewkw only with better grammar.

While the Brussels bashing continues:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jun/26/brexit-green-policies-vat-solar-batteries

Blame the foreigners when it’s Britain’s own policy to subsidise fossil fuels and tax alternative energy use.

As we seem to be staring down the barrel of a massively destructive brexit very likely followed by the breakup of the Union, I actually think it possible she might step in. Do you think she’d want to be remembered as the head of state who allowed that to happen?

Her Dirty Harry moment ‘does one feel lucky’?

That deserved more……

Y2K was just an IT issue but as you point out taken far more seriously than Brexit, Cougar. I get irritated with this thread (and stop posting) when it gets all Corbyn/tory/party politics because all that just distracts from the scale and scope of the damage soon to be done (already being done) by Brexit and Brexit attitudes. And especially irritated with the passivity of remainers.

On Y2K I did nothing, passivity was low risk. It was business decision that it would be cheaper and less hassle to fix anything that didn’t work than pay to prepare. Absolutely nothing went wrong. Brexit is very different, damage is already being done before it’s happened and even if you want to prepare there’s not much you can do as the structure of society is being changed and no amount of preparation will limit that. In fact individuals and businesses that act to limit damage to themselves will in doing so inflict more damage on the rest of society because the measures almost invariably means reducing exposure to UK PLC.

Out of everything in this clusteryouknowwhat that makes me cross, this argument is the one thing that sets me absolutely **** incandescent. It’s weapons-grade ignorance and stupidity.

The Y2K issue was a non-event because a lot of people spent months, years in some cases, working very hard to ensure that it was a non-event.

Yep, its actually the diametric opposite of Brexit and using it an argument for Brexit is as wrongheaded as its possible to be.

So the argument is actually a perfect analogy of Brexit!

Y2K?…

How about “Well, it will be just like the first world war with the ‘Stab in the Back’ myth if they steal our Brexit…”

Christ.
All.
F-ing.
Mighty.

No hope. None at all.

I guess on the plus side I don’t eat much fresh fruit or veg, I wonder how long it will be before supply chain issues impact microwave meals…

Logic would suggest that it’s going to have an impact on olives and brie supplies, but that this will be compensated for with an influx of curry and kebabs

Actually… that should have been on the side of a bus. I’d definitely have voted for that

Will no-one think of the steak bakes, eh…?!

Has anyone seen Cummings and duke from the doonesbury cartoons in the same place?

YOu do know who Duke is in real life? Hunter S Thompson.

Satire is dead!

I’d love it if Cummins went full on Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas at the tory conference, with Gideon in tow as his Attorney/Editor…

HST is probably doing about 189 rpm at that comparison. He would have made very short shrift of the bulk of our current political class.

I guess on the plus side I don’t eat much fresh fruit or veg

Are you Scottish?

Managed to knacker a knee in Leogang last week. Took the usual trip to Zell Am See hospital where we’ve been many times before. They did an X-ray but basically said they wouldn’t do an MRI and I should get one done when I get home.
It felt like they were getting me out of there ASAP. I wonder how long it takes them to claim back through the EHIC system and if they are under instruction not to spend much time/cash in case they don’t get it back before Brexit?
We’ve always been really well looked after before but it definitely seemed different this time.
Still, “sovrinty”, blue passports, Brexit means Brexit.

Without London, the rest of England would be pretty poor.

Utter horseshit. Without London then we’d have had centuries of investment in other parts of the country and they’d be better off.

Still, “sovrinty”, blue passports, Brexit means Brexit.

In other, less broken bone type health news anecdotes, my mfjnr cannot get his eczema treatment. It’s manufactured abroad, and guess what? Not importing it, because Brexit. So that’s nice.

I look forward* to a smorgasboard of shortages in the near future.

* I don’t.

Without London, the rest of England would be pretty poor.

Without London then we’d have had centuries of investment in other parts of the country and they’d be better off.

I can’t change “centuries of history”, sorry… others were talking about making Wangerland/England minus London a new country outside the UK & EU (jokingly I assume)… I simply pointed out that wouldn’t be that rich a country without London (jokingly you could assume).

Without London then we’d have had centuries of investment in other parts of the country and they’d be better off.

Hahaha. As if there’s a finite amount of money in the country and people choose to spend it in London rather than other places!

Without London somewhere else in the South East would have become London. Just look at a map and have a think. Or rather – why do you think we have London now?

other countries are not so centralised with one city sucking all the money out of the economy.

Yes, yes, the country is too focussed on one city… but that wasn’t the point I was making… it was that if you had a “New England” that broke away now, without NI, Scotland & London (something that isn’t going to happen), the result would not be a rich country… because when people say England is a rich country, that is very much an England that still has London in it. If you, entirely hypothetically (jokingly?), removed London from England it would not be anywhere near as rich.

and Scotland who support the UK economy – take london and scotland out of the picture then england is barely viable

other countries are not so centralised with one city sucking all the money out of the economy.

Ludicrous to think that London sucks money out of the economy – it creates it. Get a grip.

Also, lots of other countries are the same. Paris, Stockholm, Oslo, Helsinki, Edinburgh, Cardiff. Countries that don’t have one pre-eminent city are either amalgamations of historical regions each with their own pre-eminent city or have been planned in modern times.

Molgrips you’re talking such a load of garbage. London doesn’t magically create money, oh it doesnt matter

Enjoy your Brexit. At least understand why it’s happening …

No moilgrips – it sucks money out of the rest of the country and concentrates it in London. all the government depts, all thosestaff paying high housing costs thus needing london weighting on slareies, high housing costs all over = money from the public purse into private hands in housing benefit.

Paris does not dominate the french economy in the same way = other cities get a slice and france has been a unitary country longer than most.

Like it or loathe it, but London attracts lots of foreign investment / business start-ups in things like Fin-Tech – the come because it’s London, not Birmingham or Manchester. Take London out the equation and they’d simply invest in another country – not the UK. Two key factors are money and talent – we continue with our “hostile environment” then we’ll hit the economy hard – they’ll simply take their money and jobs elsewhere.

Molgrips you’re talking such a load of garbage. London doesn’t magically create money, oh it doesnt matter

You’re going to have to explain that. I can explain my argument:

It’s easier for businesses to work with each other when they are closer together. So they are more productive, in economic terms, and they grow. When there are a lot of businesses in one place, they make money and the people who work there spend it, often locally. That is why nearly all cities are richer than the countryside. (Also why house prices are higher – because more people need to work there). Businesses can have more local customers and thence make more money. This has been how it is as long as there have been cities. So really big cities have a stronger effect, as long as they aren’t too big to affect communication. Economies create money – the bigger an economy, the more it creates. So for the reasons above, London creates more money than Cardiff which creates more money than Caerphilly and so on.

Enjoy your Brexit.

You’ve got to be **** kidding if you think arguing that big cities make more money makes me a **** Brexiteer. That has SERIOUSLY pissed me off. What kind of half wit links those two things?

Or is anyone you disagree with on any topic a scumbag and automatically a Brexiteer, a racist, fat, and anything else you don’t like?

No moilgrips – it sucks money out of the rest of the country and concentrates it in London. all the government depts, all thosestaff paying high housing costs thus needing london weighting on slareies, high housing costs all over = money from the public purse into private hands in housing benefit.

The amount of inward investment that happens BECAUSE it’s London absolutely dwarfs the extra cost of labour. If it didn’t, they wouldn’t bloody well go there would they? These companies are perfectly able to invest anywhere they like. So why do they choose London? Is someone forcing them against their will?

other countries are not so centralised with one city sucking all the money out of the economy

Because they have land borders. Where as the UK has a big **** off sea who’s narrowest point is guess what? Pretty **** near London.

Just thinking a bit more about ways out of No Deal. Isn’t the most straightforward simply for Parly to pass legislation torevoke A50?

Isn’t that what the full remain parties – Lib-Dems, SNP – be pushing for rather than a GE.

Or do they really prefer a GE because Labour are looking weak and, especially Lib-Dems, have a lot to gain in a Westminster election?

Maybe a test of their integrity?

Cherry amendment was designed to make that a possibility, ie. Parliament being able to revoke A5O at the final hour, as a backstop if you like, if we were heading for an imminent No Deal exit. Guess who worked against that? Other than the Conservatives that is. Go on, guess who…