Espresso Machine

Spurred on by the recent coffee threads on here and my increasing dislike of my aeropress I’m tempted by a “proper” machine.

Max budget would be £400 really and I’ve seen this which ink tempted by.

https://www.gaggiadirect.com/carezza-range.html#!/Gaggia-Carezza-Deluxe-and-MD15-Grinder-SET-inc-traditional-and-bottomless-filter-holders/p/581359350/category=113117303

Is it any good or any other recommendations?

Careful now, or in my case, car full now.  We’ve just arrived at our rental house in Brittany and the first thing I unpacked after putting the bikes together was my Gaggia Classic, Iberital grinder, milk frother (for Mrs BigJohn) and knock box.

But while waiting for it to warm up I checked I can fit a baguette in the bottle cage for tomorrow breakfast.

So you can get a bit carried away with the whole coffee thing. Although Mrs BigJohn is ok with packet ground stuff here so I didn’t have to find room for her grinder and beans as we like different beans.

For £400 I’d be getting:

a comandante c40

second hand sage bambino

naked portafilter

scales and timer

and learning how to use them on YouTube

My Sage touch is much better/more consistent than my Gaggia Classic.

Sage barista….not sure how much they are now, I love mine though.

I moved from a gaggia classic to a sage barista, less faff and equally good coffee imo.

Gaggia was a bit more involved, but that wore off when doing more than two cups!

+1  for any Sage plus grinder really. I have a Barista Pro from an ebay outlet which came in on your budget, ideally you would have a separate grinder, but it’s more convenient and compact in one.

Lelit Anita maybe a wee bit above your budget or a Rancilio Silvia secondhand from me like new for £350 and would chuck in a De longhi grinder bringing it up to your £400

My Gaggia needs stripped for a bit tlc but it’s easy to work on

@flannol

Sage Bambino is discounted at the moment with a grinder as well.

https://www.sageappliances.com/uk/en/products/espresso/bep450.html?sku=SEP450BSS4GUK1

We started with a delonghi magnifica. That was ok but then junior trumped it with a sage barista which made great coffee. Junior and the barista decided to move out, so we bought a pre-used Sage Bambino and sage smart grinder pro for £220 all in. This is definitely a another step up in terms of both coffee quality and reduced preparation times.

Whatever you buy, spend a morning learning about ‘dialling in’ your machine – it really does make a tremendous difference. Aldi #3 cheap beans dialled in are way better than expensive beans done badly.

Always been happy with my Gaggia, had it for over 15 years now.

Sage duo pro is on offer w some other bits on john lewis. Have been really pleased with mine and use a hario hand grinder for beans

£400 will get you a Sage Barista Pro if you ask Sage nicely for a discount code (or wait for the next Lakeland 20% voucher to drop through the letterbox).

Mine is 5 years old and still going strong.

My Jura packed up a few weeks ago and to be totally honest I’m not bothered, and not looking to replace. I drink far too much coffee, always have. (I actually OD’d on caffeine years ago! I sht you not).

I’ve kept my Aeropress and my Bialetti but significantly reduced my intake, and my timing (never had issue with a coffee before bed). Early days but probably (for me) for the best.

Up until it died I was very happy with the Jura – was pre owned and made a decent shot. Of course, everyone will tell you, in true STW style that what they have is “the best”.

Good luck!

Sage Bambino would get my vote.

I know there’s a lot of love for the Gaggia classic on here – but I had a go on my mate’s, and I just don’t get it.

We went from a Sage Bambino to a Sage Touch. I would say the main difference between the 2 is the ease of use of the Touch and better consistency as you are not manually tampering etc

So in reality I am saying the Bambino is a very god machine for the money if you can be arsed with the separate grinding.

If this is a bit new to you, i’d suggest keeping a little bit of your budget back for a calibrated tamp i.e. Nomcore or similar. There are so many variables involved in getting it right and so i found using a calibrated tamp eliminates one of the most subjective and hard to repeat elements. The others such as grind size, dose and extraction time are easy to measure.

So in reality I am saying the Bambino is a very god machine for the money if you can be arsed with the separate grinding.

Grinding is separate in both, surely?  Just in the touch the grinder is integrated into the left hand side of the machine.  For me, this is a bad thing – it means you can’t get the grinder you want/upgrade.

+1 normcore

the tamp that comes with bambino is terrible

better consistency as you are not manually tampering etc

Just as a side note, I bought one of these calibrated self leveling tampers to do away with those concerns. It’s a bit like a torque wrench, it clicks once you’ve applied 30lbs of pressure and the sliding collar means you can’t tamp on a slant. Never fret about inconsistent tamping again. A bit pricey, but what’s the point of diving down the espresso rabbit hole if you can’t acquire gadgets?

Grinding is separate in both, surely?  Just in the touch the grinder is integrated into the left hand side of the machine.  For me, this is a bad thing – it means you can’t get the grinder you want/upgrade.

Nope in the Touch you just put the puck into the machine and it grinds and tamps based on settings you can set, you have full control. We never change the tamp, but often change the grind based on the beans.

The Touch is something like 5 x the price of the Bambino though. My post was alluding to the fact that the Bambino makes just as good coffee (nearly) with just more faff

I’m reading this while drinking an oat flat white produced by my 2001 Gaggia Classic and rather more recent Sage Smart Grinder Pro. I wasn’t aware of the Barista Touch Impress, but I’ve just read a couple of reviews and it looks like a pretty good option, with the convenience of bean to cup with the brew quality of a manual. The thing that would concern me would be the longevity – there’s a hell of a lot of stuff to go wrong in there, whereas my GC is 23 years old and still going strong. Yes I’ve replaced a couple of bits, but it’s easy to do and all the spares are available. The Sage looks much more of ‘No user serviceable parts inside’ kind of deal.

increasing dislike of my aeropress

Just wondering what the issue is OP? I love my espresso machine but if I was forced to choose just one method to brew coffee, it would be the Aeropress.

I’ve got a Gaggia Classic (bought manufacturer refurbished) and a Wilfa Svart Uniform grinder.  Great setup, I’m really happy.

My neighbour works for a coffee roaster and puts all his money into a grinder.  He doesn’t even have a coffee machine at home – just the grinder – as he says he’s used to the £10k ones at work. 😮

I really don’t rate the Sage stuff at all.

Not to be controversial but I wish someone had given me this advice when I handed over 1600 for an oracle.

I’m now using a decent grinder and my oracle in single dose mode manual mode.

I’d be looking at that new cheapish Gaggia Espresso Evolution and separate grinder for that money perhaps.

Expect to go on a journey.

Just as a side note, I bought one of these

in the description in the link it describes it as “Female friendly coffee accessories” what the actual f.ck is that? Unless it refers to the shape…? 🍆 👀

Back to the OP: Gaggia classic here for 15 plus years (so the original version.) other than manually wind the pump pressure down I’ve done nothing other than descale it and it’s been faultless. Took a while to learn how to make proper coffee, but learn I did.

This is what I use. It’s the most used appliance in the house 🙂

Delonghi Dedica Arte

https://fave.co/45QO36m

As opposed the the Delonghi dedica (Without the Arte). The steam wand on the Arte is waaaay better than the older version.

My grinder is a Sage Digital Grinder. https://www.sageappliances.com/uk/en/products/coffee-grinders/bcg820.html

You can currently get both of those for under your £400 budget.

what the actual f.ck is that

A tamper for people with poor tamping ability.

Sage barista and sage grinder here. Use it 6 plus times a day, 3 years old

in the description in the link it describes it as “Female friendly coffee accessories” what the actual f.ck is that? Unless it refers to the shape…? 🍆 👀

Wow.

From the ad:

This makes it more user-friendly for women and beginners

😯

ISTR that the high priest of coffee* thinks that tamping pressure isn’t particularly critical, and my experience would support that. Didn’t stop me buying a very expensive tamper**, but mostly because I just like big lumps of machined metal.

*James Hoffman, obvs.

** Isomac

Omg that bambino and grinder is pretty much the same as my Premium Bonds winnings….   Easy come, easy go….

A tamper for people with poor tamping ability.

Yep that’s me. I wish my barista skills were as awesome as yours must be.

ISTR that the high priest of coffee* thinks that tamping pressure isn’t particularly critical

He does. I think getting it level is much more important to avoid channelling.

Yep that’s me. I wish my barista skills were as awesome as yours must be.

I should really have said that differently, sorry!

I think a lot of accessories get sold to try and solve ‘problems’ that company particularly with blind shakers and spring loaded tampers etc etc.

I tamp using 4 fingers on the edge of the portafilter, it’s pretty easy to feel the level and not apply a lot of pressure, but I understand people buying nice things too.

My coffees comes out pretty well, honest!

increasing dislike of my aeropress

Just wondering what the issue is OP? I love my espresso machine but if I was forced to choose just one method to brew coffee, it would be the Aeropress.

Just very underwhelming. I think my grinder is too fine a grind for it maybe (a dualit burr grinder)

Tried loads of different good quality beans but they are all just meh tasting…. Tried some of those same beans made in a proper coffee machine and the difference is night and day.

It’s the scales that gets me, does it really matter if your one or two grams out?

I measure by volume with the original scoop, do different coffees weigh differently?

Tried loads of different good quality beans but they are all just meh tasting…. Tried some of those same beans made in a proper coffee machine and the difference is night and day.

That is unlikely to be down to your AP. Don’t give up on it, even when you get your espresso machine. The Aeropress is capable of making very, very good coffee.  It could be grind size, or dose, ratio etc. They are a bit fussy to get from “OK” to “great”. James Hoffmans “ultimate Aeropress technique” is great to put you in the right ball park with all those things.

It’s the scales that gets me, does it really matter if your one or two grams out?

I measure by volume with the original scoop, do

That works, but you will find that some cups taste much nicer than others. With a bit of precision and consistency you can tip the odds so bad tasting shots become far less common.

do different coffees weigh differently?

Yes, big variation. I usually dose 18g and some coffees will be half way up the basket and some will be overflowing. Some are just a lot less dense and “fluffier” for want of a better word! Light roasts tend to be a lot denser than dark roasts

I should really have said that differently, sorry!

No worries 👍 I do know what you mean about the endless gadgets. I fall for some and baulk at others – blind shakers are a step too far! I can get reasonably good results with an ordinary tamper, but find my calibrated tamper is heavier, feels nicer in the hand and is just pleasant to use. I doubt it adds anything to the taste of the coffee though. I bought it initially when I was having loads of issues with channelling.  Turns out it was using the wrong sized basket, not inconsistent tamping that was causing it.