Di2 obsolete?!

There nothing SRAM can do about jamming, assuming the person doing the jamming knows what they are doing. Mis-shifts, harder but also possible.

If you doubt, I suggest you take a look around at any tech news site regarding hacking achievements.

Give it few more years and they’ll start selling Mind Controlled Groupset. No shifters and levers required!

Electronic shifting of any kind is completely unnecessary and would offer me no advantages at all while just being something to go wrong.

Other things that fell in to the same category for me were indexed gears and disk brakes. And of course I was right about them. 🙂

Another thought just got to me: isn’t stuff like electronic shifting kind of against the whole concept of bicycle? I mean it should be powered with muscles, shouldn’t it? All the mechanical concepts work around this principal, even if they are getting easier to operate (like hydraulic disc brakes).

And the electronic stuff removes that “human powered” thing a bit: You click on the shifter just to let the computer know what to do? Nah…

Electronic shifting of any kind is completely unnecessary and would offer me no advantages at all while just being something to go wrong.

I think the key thing is I’ve been on ride where people have snapped cables, or shifters have died (including mine twice, an MTB shifter pawl snapped so wouldnt ratchet the index wheel doodaa bit inside and my DA 7800 has inreperably jammed). Never been on a ride where someoens Di2 has failed (although theres less DI2 about). I reckon a switch would outlive both of my failed shifters, and potentialy be a cheap fix, is there any need for brake+shifters anymore, just add touch sensitive pads to the groupset and people could put triggers wherever they liked, within a generation I reckon we’ll no longer bother with ‘clicky’ shifters for electronic shifting.

Another thought just got to me: isn’t stuff like electronic shifting kind of against the whole concept of bicycle? I mean it should be powered with muscles, shouldn’t it? All the mechanical concepts work around this principal, even if they are getting easier to operate (like hydraulic disc brakes).
And the electronic stuff removes that “human powered” thing a bit: You click on the shifter just to let the computer know what to do? Nah…

That’s why all lights are dyno powered, along with garmins etc

within a generation I reckon we’ll no longer bother with ‘clicky’ shifters for electronic shifting

continuously variable transmission

Yes, I think Shimano (as they tend to do) played things safe with Di2 and mimicked the ergonomics of mechanical shifting (arguably they’re worse as they’re less tactile). Considering they could have done anything they wanted with shifting buttons!

That’s why all lights are dyno powered, along with garmins etc

Lights and Garmins are not really bicycle parts, are they?

There nothing SRAM can do about jamming, assuming the person doing the jamming knows what they are doing. Mis-shifts, harder but also possible.

It is all irrelevant as there is only one ProTour team riding SRAM this year 😆

FSA on the other hand may need to give this some thought and Tiso also have a wireless 12 speed group….

SRAM wireless shifting caught on video, more details emerge

Thing is though, there are only so many practical places to put shifter buttons/switches, and all of them are on the bars, which provide a handy mounting point, so there’s really no need to take the tech any further. I get the ‘clean lines’ argument, but it doesn’t hold water as you’re always going to have brake cables/hoses in the same area anyway.

I reckon a switch would outlive both of my failed shifters,

hmm, never broken a shimano shifter – tho I have seen the odd 1, with the odd exception the current ones last a looooong time getting the leccy ones to last even longer will be a feat.

and potentialy be a cheap fix

hahahahahahaha, you’re funny. I expect them to be just as irreparable as current STIs and more expensive. but like I said I’ll be interested when they cost less.

In terms of having it on my bikes, I like advancement in bike design but I don’t like electronics, you can’t fix them when they go wrong, and they are expensive. Gear cables work fine, so I’ll pass.

I can only see this like mobile phones, its the march of progress and its coming if we like it or not. I suspect most will like it and most will end using it as it filters down over the years to cheaper bikes. It will become standard.

I mean it should be powered with muscles, shouldn’t it?

Isn’t it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailleur?
Assuming you’re not one of those weirdy beardy SSers you’re already a cycling purist heretic.

you can’t fix them when they go wrong,

ever tried fixing a modern cable gear shifter?

electronics opens up the possibility of multiple shifter locations, di2 easily does regular, sprint and climbing shifter all on the same set of bars,

you can’t fix them when they go wrong,

ever tried fixing a modern cable gear shifter?

No, I’ve never had a broken one.

Another thought just got to me: isn’t stuff like electronic shifting kind of against the whole concept of bicycle? I mean it should be powered with muscles, shouldn’t it?

I agree, but take that to its conclusion and we’d not have suspension or gears either (Henri Desgrange was right but reality is a bit different). I do think it’s one of those things that takes us further from the idea that perfection is about taking stuff away, not adding it, but Di2 is great kit and the option to have it is good. It’ll be a very long time before it filters down and it’s been said that it’ll remain at Ultegra/DA level.

Last year’s Trans-Am winner used Di2 for a 4000+ mile self-supported race – when you’re on the bike long enough to lose dexterity or just be so plain tired that any effort saved is a benefit, leccy gears have advantages. If Di2 / wireless set ups had a tiny dynamo hub option or a plug in for existing dyanamos (maybe they do already?) I’d be more into it, no real reason apart from the idea of a self-contained system having appeal.

Would like to try Di2, no particular interest in wireless though – especially Sram!

I imagine in future frames will come hardwired for electronic shifting, with conductive filaments installed during the construction process.

I imagine in future frames will come hardwired for electronic shifting, with conductive filaments installed during the construction process.

There was a lovely custom bike around last year that had inlaid conductors under the paint laquer.

There was a lovely custom bike around last year that had inlaid conductors under the paint laquer.

There you go, the future is already here.

I would guess that wireless is for the manufacturer’s benefit more than the rider; wireless chips cost nothing these days, and probably mean that the unit can be better sealed against water and muck, don’t need a strong cable entry point or socket, can be smaller and would make the system a whole lot quicker for OEMs to install if they don’t have to spend time stringing wires around.

I see no reason why not, really…

I want special paint that conducts signals and shimmers and twinkles during night rides when i shift *

Assuming you’re not one of those weirdy beardy SSers you’re already a cycling purist heretic.

The perfect steed for snow and Ice as I so ably demonstrated last night 😉

* I ride a SS in winter so I just realised the flaw in my plan.

Internet ate my post so heres a summary.

hmm, never broken a shimano shifter – tho I have seen the odd 1, with the odd exception the current ones last a looooong time getting the leccy ones to last even longer will be a feat.

Well I’ve broken 2 as I said, excluding those I’ve broken in crashes or ripped cables out of (and with small buttons and cables that just pop back in arguably I should include those in my argument too as they’d be amost imune to that sort of damage). Both failed in the mechanical guts, not the lever so I suspect an electrical contact would probably have carried on working for much much longer.

hahahahahahaha, you’re funny. I expect them to be just as irreparable as current STIs and more expensive. but like I said I’ll be interested when they cost less.

6870 levers are £160 online, 6800 levers are £180, so they’re already cheaper, and thats before you consider the ability to keep a bike running by just plugging in the much cheaper sprint/climbing shifter if the switch in the main body fails.

But lets not let facts and anecdotes get in the way of suposittion and ignorance on the internet, ehh?

I suspect an electrical contact would probably have carried on working for much much longer

But lets not let facts and anecdotes get in the way of suposittion and ignorance on the internet, ehh?

😉

Not bikes, but by far the most common failure in industires I have worked in are electrical. FWIW I like DI2 but don’t see any need for wireless. If you need to connect component A to component B the most reliable option is always a fixed hard wire if it is possible.

I’ve also broken a Dura Ace 7800 STI – cable died, dropped bits of cable into the mechanism, it all jammed irrepairably some months later.

I agree that Di2 ones will be more reliable than cable ones, which are far from indestructible.

Have any of the Di2 naysayers used it? I suspect it’s one of those things where the scale of the benefits only become apparent on use. I haven’t used it either, mind.

Wireless shifting will certainly make bikes easier to build.