Citroen’s – OK or still hit and miss with reliability?

We’re looking for my daughters second car (she’s worn her first one out!), and DS3’s come up at decent prices.

It would be the 1.2 Petrol Puretech we’d be looking at.

Her current car is a 60 plate Zetec Fiesta and it’s been grand considering the abuse a 1st car gets and the 40k miles she’s done in it in 3 years.

Ta!

We’ve had a 13 plate c3 Picasso for the last 6 years, can’t say it’s been any less reliable than any other car I’ve owned. Other than a small oil leak and a coolant leak it’s not given us any headaches.

As the owner of a 1.2 pure tech.

Unless your going to be fastidious with maintenance save your self the grief.

Timing belt is the wet belt system similar to ford ecoboom.

Short journeys and partially combusted fuel in the oil causes the belt to swell and break down

The wrong oil spec causes the belt to swell and break down

Old oil- causes the belt to swell and breakdown down

The broken down belt then clogs up the oil pick up and bad times come.

The handbook says 10 year change on the belt. This was revised to 6 years/60k

I bought mine with 18k on the clock (fully informed of its foibles)  and fsh and I’ve kept in top of all of its needs. I fitted a new belt my self last year at 6years/30k.

I’ve only had that engine in a Citroen, not a DS so bear that in mind but in my experience it’s not a very nice engine. Rather coarse and gutless.  Difficult to keep it smooth when pulling away (feels unbalanced at low revs like it is going to stall).

Decent economy though.

Also I *think* they have a wet belt so ensure that’s been changed if its due.

As for Citroen reliability, again, I’ve not had a DS, but our Citroens have *all* had niggly electrical problems as well as the typical French car stuff like windows/doors not sealing very tightly and letting water in. That’s with main dealer servicing as well.

Thanks folk – I’m avoiding EcoBoost Fiestas because of the wet-belt system. So these will be added to the avoid list too! 🙂

Rather coarse and gutless.  Difficult to keep it smooth when pulling away (feels unbalanced at low revs like it is going to stall).

Was that the turbo or non turbo . I’ve the non turbo in an 800 kg car and it’s smooth as silk compared to the old 3cylinder corsas which sounded broken from new.

No complaints with the drivability of the engine. Just a warning of it being wet belt (but no where near as voilitile as the ecoboom)

My experience is perhaps quite a way out of date, but we had a 59 plate C3 Picasso which we bought at the end of 2015 with about 33k miles on the clock.
It was an ideal car for a small family in terms of size, space & practicality, but quickly gained the moniker of The Shitroen, due to unreliability issues.
By far the worst car for reliability I have ever owned, and the dealer was equally bad (Richard Sanders in Northampton who now don’t seem to deal in Citroen).

I had my doubts before purchasing, but many people reckoned I was basing my decision on out of date stereotypes and several owners of Citroen’s at work reckoned they had zero issues over several years. Bleurgh. Should have gone with my gut instinct and avoided.

trail_rat
Was that the turbo or non turbo . I’ve the non turbo in an 800 kg car and it’s smooth as silk compared to the old 3cylinder corsas which sounded broken from new.

Non-turbo.

When it was new, I took it back to the dealer thinking something was broken “no, they all do that, sir”. They let me drive a different one and it was indeed the same.

And in fairness it, has stayed exactly as it started, it’s just so unrefined though. If yours is smooth, perhaps they added a balancing shaft or DMF in later revisions?

How bad was fitting the new belt? + Was there any evidence of deterioration of yours (e.g. gunge in the strainer) ?

Coincidentally one of the motor trade YouTube channels I watch covered these recently

Basically, don’t touch with a barge pole

Damn, that’s the Petrol Rifter off my list then…

How bad was fitting the new belt? + Was there any evidence of deterioration of yours (e.g. gunge in the strainer) ?

Non turbos not nearly as bad as the turbos. Easy belt to change (I’ve done a number of cars and vans over the years)  belt came out in perfect condition making me think. Should have left it…. But you can’t inspect the teeth for cracks Insitu. But I did/do  monitor monthly for swelling with the laser pure tech belt gauge through the oil filler cap.

It’s a fixed price 495 service at the dealer. I prefer to do it my self as only have me to blame when it goes Pete tong.

Mines in a 108. They have a teeny tiny clutch and flywheel compared to anything bigger. It’s well suited to the vehicle the 1l was way under powered once out of the city  even if it’s chain drive.

I don’t think I’d like the 82 tame horses in anything bigger either to be fair. If the pure tech does shit the bed I do fancy trying to cram the 140bhp turbo in there. I don’t think it would take too much rearranging.

@grimep

Thanks for that!! 🙂

Lots of cars off the list now! 😳

Car UK YouTube channel  has no issue buying and flipping ecoboosts yet says don’t buy a Puretech.

Lol.

Lots of cars off the list now

15 years ago it was almost impossible to buy an intrinsically bad car / badly designed car. Now it’s almost impossible not to.

I’m kinda keen on the Tourneo Grand Connect but you have a choice of 1.2 ecoboost or 1.5d with endless dpf etc issues.

Dacia Jogger? Choice of 3 pot turbo petrol or a hybrid.

Hate SUVs. Don’t want an auto.

Hard to avoid ending up choosing Passat or Octavia estate

Lots of cars off the list now!

The answer you are looking for is Honda Jazz. Thank me later.

…try selling a Honda Jazz to a 21 yr old girl!! 🤣🤣

And I have tried!

We’ve got a 19 year old Jazz, it’s my favourite ever car! Just hope it never dies as it’s been excellent.

I had my doubts before purchasing, but many people reckoned I was basing my decision on out of date stereotypes

For at least three decades people have been telling me “oh don’t worry, French cars are fine now”.

Not a gamble I’d be willing to make yet though, having suffered with a crappy Renault (that I was given).

We’ve got a 19 year old Jazz, it’s my favourite ever car! Just hope it never dies as it’s been excellent.

Yep. Absolutely bulletproof if a little down on power.

…try selling a Honda Jazz to a 21 yr old girl

Civic then? A bit more stylish and less “old man”. Surely better looking than a Fiesta? But then I don’t know how a 21 year old thinks!  🙃

Her current car is a 60 plate Zetec Fiesta and it’s been grand considering the abuse a 1st car gets and the 40k miles she’s done in it in 3 years.

Get another one of these that’s not knackered?

That’s what I’m working on – but she fancies something different which is understandable.

1.0 and 1.2 TSI Fabias are also in the frame (manual).

Corolla (or whatever it’s called nowadays) / Yaris. Basically anything Japanese or leapfrog all the crap end of the ICE evolution engines and get her a cheap Nissan leaf (depending on her usage)

1.0 and 1.2 TSI Fabias are also in the frame (manual).

Ours is an estate, teh shizzles as a functional car. Glamorous it is not. Adequate, yes. I am a fan. Eldest and his GF have just toured the Highlands in it (including sleeping in the back one night!) and both liked it, and despite Grandpa’s Gold colour, they thought it cool wee car.

Honda Civic is a good call for ‘looks good, bit different, reliable and safe’.

ProCeed?

Had a Renault once, only my 1984 Mini was more unreliable.

Got a Berlingo with the 1.2 puretech. I think it drive briliantly. I get over 50mpg on long journeys too. Plenty of torque and powerful enough unless you carry lots of passengers.

If you’re considering a 1.5 diesel, make sure it is a post Feb 2023 one with an 8mm camchain. The 7mm ones seem to snap.

65 plate 1.2 Puretech here. Zero problems. Combined MPG 43, often 50+ on motorways.

1.0 and 1.2 TSI Fabias are also in the frame (manual).

Great cars. Surprisingly roomy inside, good visibility, often previously owned by pensioners. The kids have a weedy 85hp 1.0 at the moment.

The 1.2TSi is quite lively. We left the winter tyres on to reduce unexpected wheelspin coming out of wet junctions.

Grandpa’s Gold colour

Is that the one officially known as “beige”?

My work runs diesel Berlingos. Mine, a 2019 plate, has an ad blue problem that has had it off the road for months. There is another Berlingo in the queue for repair in front of it with Citroen with the same fault, but they don’t seem to be able to fix it. I’m not the work mechanic so not fully informed but something is seriously wrong with Citroens ability to resolve the issue.

I’m very glad that I couldn’t get a Citroen Inverness salesperson to give me customer service when I was last wanted a car – I was in the market for a new Berlingo but given their poor response at the time to sales enquiries* I bought a second hand Volvo V90 that has been perfect.

*During the chip shortage so perhaps their reticence to talk to me was due to having no vehicles……..

Current car is a Renault, and the only major thing I can think of was when the drainage channels under the bonnet got blocked by leaves and this led to water getting into one of the black box CPUs – meant the wipers were unreliable. Something like 500€ to change…Arguably my fault, as I should have checked the channels weren’t full of crap more regularly.

But otherwise it’s been basically faultless, just the usual wear-and-tear things you’d expect from any car that’s getting on for 10 years old. I wouldn’t have a problem with getting another Renault.

And I’ve got a couple of mates that always get Citroens. I’m sure if they’d had major issues with their cars I’d have heard about it!

Can I add another vote to Honda Jazz. I had one and lots of people laughed as it was seen as an old persons car. But it was one of the best cars I have been in. More room inside it than a Focus and the like, but smaller in body size, easy to park, reliable and fast enough if you were not timid and rev’d the thing to the red line. When I split with the wife, the car went with her and she ended up buying two more since, despite being one of the people who originally laughed.

I now have a decent spec Skoda Octavia and it’s not a patch on that Honda.

Your 21 year old is showing why she’s not yet responsible enough to drive. 😀

Curve ball suggestion that may appease a 21yr old….BMW Z4 or are you wanting something a bit newer? They’re peanuts to buy and insurance might be reasonable despite appearing otherwise.

I had a Grand Picasso. It was not great. The hydropneumatic suspension failed after less than 25000 miles. Replaced it with springs. Dual mass flywheel gave up at 90000 miles. Water poured into the passenger compartment at 14000 miles. Front suspension creaked at low speed from when I got it. The DSG gearbox was jerky. It didn’t even make 100,000 miles before it set itself on fire outside our house. Smoke poured out from the engine bay and every light flashed with the alarm going off. At that point, I just smiled as it meant I could see the back of it.

That said, it was far more reliable than my Smart Brabus Roadster which was a bloody garage magnet. CPU died early doors, it leaked constantly,  ABS sensors failed, would regularly not start necessitating a flat bed trip to the garage, overheated regularly, fan belt snapped, leaked so much that if you left it for a week, there would be mold on the seats, completely random electrical failures etc. It was great fun to drive but an absolute stinker of a car. Made in France. You mat see a theme that a) I am an idiot and b) French cars suck.

It’s a shame as my mum and dad had two BX’s and a Xantia and they were lovely cars and reliable too.

Honda Jazz? My dad had one and it rusted away at about 80,000 miles at 14 years old. The old trope about Japanese car being rust buckets is still on the money in my experience. It went at the suspension mount points in the engine bay.

Cheers

Sanny

Your 21 year old is showing why she’s not yet responsible enough to drive. 😀

She’s actually a very good driver – the car is just worn out.  We bought it cheap as it wasn’t perfect to start with and it’s lasted her 3.5yrs which is way more than I expected it would.

And she passed her HGV test last October! 😜

I feel safer in a car with her than my wife!

when the drainage channels under the bonnet got blocked by leaves

There may be rubber flaps at the exit of these scuttle drains, by the wheelarch.

Could be worth removing those to prevent that issue recurring.

She’s actually a very good driver

It was a joke based on hte stereotype of her age, I meant no offence and I have no idea what her driving is actually like. But cars which are not trendy and youngsters don’t like are often good buys as they don’t have a trendy premium to their price. I guess that was my point.

It’s getting very difficult to find good reliable cars and which are not stupid huge SUVs imho.

They’re no worse than other brands, especially if you keep on top of maintenance and servicing.

I’d avoid any wet belts though. They do cause more when compared to older engines without them.

I’ve owned 30+ cars over the years and the only cars that have broken down and left me by the roadside have been Japanese and German (Toyota, Honda, and VW), whereas none of my french cars have left me stranded.

@traildog

No offence taken! 🙂 👍

We’ve just had exactly what’s described in that video up there ^
Our 6 year old, 60k mile C3 failed the MOT miserably on emissions. Main dealers reckoned 6-8 weeks before they could have a look at it, but thankfully a local engine specialist recommended by our garage has coaxed it through. They say the engine and catalytic converter are both on the way out though, so time to get rid.
It was alright as far as a car goes, not very refined but lots more acceleration than my i20. The list of advisories in addition to the shagged engine doesn’t say much for build quality though. First and last citroen for us.

French car design can be innovative, funky, practical – on.paper, good cars.

My Renault scenic went wrong with:

Electronic parking brake fail, needed complete new unit

Gear selector cable broke

Fan resistor burnt out

Electric window units failed

Electric sunroof mechanism problems

Ok you get these problems on all makes, and people will decide never to buy another Ford say just because of one problem one their car… But Stellantis group: Fiat, Jeep, Chrysler, Vauxhall, Peugeot, Citroen etc cars have earned their reputation, and rightly or wrongly I’d never buy one…

I’ve found Ford to be a good make compared to other cars I’ve owned but they’ve created their fair share of stinkers