Bloody americans, coming over here and shooting our goats

You’ve ruined it Welsh farmer I was waiting for his answer but cheers for pointing out to him it’s pretty much no different to an abatoir.

<p>I’m on the “so what” side of the fence.</p><p>Yes she is American and carrying the usual crassness but when all is said and done what has she actually done wrong?</p><p>There are plenty of animals out there meeting a far worse end than a quick shot to the head they never knew was coming, if you’re that concerned about animal welfare maybe you should look at what’s on your own plate before you judge what’s on other peoples. </p><p>If you’re wondering what my overall standpoint is, read The Ethical Carnivore by Louise Gray, it’s a fair start. there’s also a chapter about wild sheep around Caithness and how there is literally no other way of managing them as they are completely wild. Of course fact have no place in this discussion but I thought I’d mention it anyway.</p><p></p><p>As for calling a her a tart or hoping she encounters some French hunters, class act. I wonder, do you wish death and fire crude insults at anyone who kills animals or just the ones that kill the fwuffy wuffy widdle ones?</p>

Ideally a .22 free bullet to the top of the head

Yeah – from 200 yards, baby !

I’m most offended by the use of the words hunter and hunting when applied to goats and sheep. How do you hunt them exactly? It’s not like there is tracking and skill involved, they’re just there dawdling about all brightly coloured, standing out from the surrounding landscape and shit.

I once nearly convinced a sheep to walk off a cliff without even trying very hard. She’s a massive cockwomble for wearing camouflage too. £10 says I could walk up to a goat or sheep whilst dressed as a clown and juggling and still kill it with ease. Hunting my arse.

Goats are not really ‘native’, but they have been living in the wild for over 300 years. And there’s only a few thousand left around Scotland, they are now fairly rare.

<div class=”bbp-reply-author”>rene59
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Why? There are photos of steaks from the stag shown on her twitter or instagram. Why wouldn’t someone want to get back to something tasty?

If you care about taste and texture you don’t rush back with a deer and cook it, let alone an adult red stag, they’ve not even taken time to bleed it let alone hang it so it’ll be the shittest venison steak you’ll ever eat. But then maybe it’s more symbolic since the whole thing is one big advert for her business, for her clients “eating what I shot like a proper hunter” is probably worth grinding their way through a plateful of crap. They took 4 stags so no matter what they only ate a token amount anyway- a difference that makes no difference.

(in case anyone didn’t gather that, she’s not some idiot thinking she’s a super boss hunter for taking down a deer- she runs paid hunts for rich clients, so every post and every word is marketing. Her clients most likely will be holiday hunters so they don’t want it to be difficult, but they want their mates to think it is.

It’d be kind of the equivalent of Stevomcd setting up a special riding week where you do nothing but ride dramatic looking piss-easy features in his back garden while he takes awesome photos so you can show all your mates your extreme alps photos. You know it’s bollocks, he knows it’s bollocks, but that’s not the point)

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And yeah…you kind of shot yourself in the foot there renee, most meat is hung for a bit to make it tastier, but you knew that; right?

Watch some hunting videos, good one is Meat Eater on Netflix. You will see them break down the carcass on site and they often take the fillet from the back for the frying pan and also the liver. Some cuts are so tender they don’t need hung to make them tender and yes hanging can develop flavour, but the back fillet, like a fillet steak from a cow doesn’t really pick up much in the way of flavour no matter how long it’s hung for.

You’ve ruined it Welsh farmer I was waiting for his answer but cheers for pointing out to him it’s pretty much no different to an abatoir.

No different. Minus the journey in the back of a lorry to get there and the unsanitary conditions and stress during that journey. The wait to get into the abattoir not knowing what on earth is going on then watching your fellow cows/sheep/pig whatever take a bolt to the head to stun them, then hung from a hook and throat slit whilst often squeeling in pain/fear. If your extra unluck you might get one of the bored workers abuse you for a bit first.

Yes, no different at all.

**** me.

It’d be kind of the equivalent of Stevomcd setting up a special riding week where you do nothing but ride dramatic looking piss-easy features in his back garden

will the dates be going up on his website ?

I know which one I’d rather eat.

Watch some hunting videos, good one is Meat Eater on Netflix.

You mean the staged for TV stuff?

the back fillet, like a fillet steak from a cow doesn’t really pick up much in the way of flavour no matter how long it’s hung for.

Oh but it does.

^^Second from the left? The one with teh evil eyes 👀

Funny looking sheep.

Nope. The one on the right with the cankles.

“I know which one I’d rather eat.”

They’re both pretty nice tbh

You mean the staged for TV stuff?

They stage stuff for TV?!? Oh noes, that must mean everything on the show never happens anywhere else then.

Oh but it does.

Ok, you’re obviously an expert. I’ll take your word for it.

We get venison from that’s come from deer that’s been killed to keep the numbers down in Macc forest.   There’s a team of rangers out every night shooting the wild boar in the FOD as they are completely out of control.  The goats on the Great Orme cause devastation to the surrounding properties. We live in a country where the largest predator is a fox, so these large mammals populations.  It’s not like she’s shooting a rhino or a tiger.  If they can bring money into the economy for something that needs doing anyhow good on them.

I don’t get the photos especially the one with the sheep  but it’s part of their hunting culture.

There are deer in Macc Forest? Live about a mile away, have been cycling there for the last seven years and I’ve never seen one. Every day is a school day. I’m going off piste to find them this weekend.

Why is it always white blonde women who seem to get in the news for this?

I most often night ride on the forest and always see deer.  The most ive seen us about 20 on the cycle path down from the benches at the top of the white rabbit.  They ran in front of me for  about 200 yards it was amazing.  They’ll be rutting in a few weeks, you can hear them for miles.

I’ve seen them in the fields around Langley and I think that’s when they try and cull them to keep them within the forest.

Meh, i’ve been veggie my entire adult life and i can’t see what the outpouring of social media grief is all about, i’m perfectly happy for rich idiots to pay handsomely to shoot animals that need culling such as the galloway goats and red deer population that live close to me, they are going to be shot/culled anyway so it makes perfect sense to raise additional funds whilst controlling their numbers, although shooting is a bit ott though for goats and rams, it would be just as easy to walk up to a goat whilst offering it a bag of monster munch and give it a dunt on the back of the head with a hammer.

She’s a massive cockwomble for wearing camouflage too.

I’m not sure that is newsworthy though – I could show you dozens of people in camo gear any weekend in Scotland.  Admittedly she might be the first woman.

£10 says I could walk up to a goat or sheep whilst dressed as a clown and juggling and still kill it with ease. Hunting my arse.

I’ll take your bet.  It has to be a feral Scottish goat though, not some farm animal.  Please post the video of your successful clown antics and I’ll happily send you a tenner.   So as not to offend the internet I don’t need you to kill it – just touch it with your hand.

I was visiting a friend in NZ in 2005 and we set off from Arrowtown with mountain bikes and a sporterised .303 SMLE for a 4-5 day combo gold mine visiting – goat stalking trip. The abandoned gold mining towns were great but we didn’t pot a single goat as they were wily AF. They seemed to know exactly what days our permit was active and on what land we weren’t allowed to shoot, so congregating there to mock-bleat in our general direction! We never even got close. Feral goats are/were a big problem on South Island due to degradation of indigenous flora and I’d have had no qualms.

You’ve ruined it Welsh farmer I was waiting for his answer but cheers for pointing out to him it’s pretty much no different to an abatoir.

I have to disagree with this. I’ve seen the stress the animals go through to get to an abattoir, and I’ve (unfortunately) seen a sheep take a quick bullet to the back of the head. The latter was instant – the former was not.

I know which I’d prefer if I were the animal.

FWIW, I don’t buy meat any more. I don’t think anyone should if they’re queasy about the idea of animal suffering.

I most often night ride on the forest and always see deer.  The most ive seen us about 20 on the cycle path down from the benches at the top of the white rabbit

Sorry for the derailment folks. I ride in the day which might explain it. Honestly can’t believe I’ve never seen any. I’m blaming Hope and their noisy hubs,

I’ll take your bet.  It has to be a feral Scottish goat though

How will I know it’s Scottish, do they bleat with an accent?

Cant see what the issue is she shot some animals that can be eaten, was hardly a Giraffe or  a Lion or a Bear was it.

I shot a goat once and I’ve been to abatoirs a few times, I know how I’d rather be dispatched if I was a sheep or a goat, especially a feral goat that had never been handled.

Wow Drac, you have shocked me. I would have thought you were a bit more grounded than that.

The industrialized killing of animals for human consumption, is just what it says on the tin. The end result – a dead animal, is pretty much the same and being shot on a Scottish Island.

However there is suffering caused by how we make it more convenient for ourselves.

Like Soma I’ve been a vegetarian for since my teens, 30 plus years.  That’s my choice. If you want to eat meat that’s ok, it’s your choice. But be realistic about the process. Pigs are smart animals, they know the sound of another pig suffering. That’s what they will hear at a slaughter house.

Ok back to the original point. She makes a living by advertisers paying money for attention. So that’s what she is giving them. Looks **** to me thou.

She’s a massive cockwomble for wearing camouflage too

Think of it as a sort of uniform. The Americans wear camo to go hunting, its like wearing trainers even though you’re not doing sports. Or at the risk of another argument, a helmet to ride to the shops, you (probably) don’t need it, it doesn’t really effect your ability to ride the bike but plenty of people do it because wearing a helmet is just what people do when they ride a bike.

Pigs don’t suffer all that much since asphyxiation by CO2 is the general method used to kill them (hence why the recent shortage was such a big deal). They just go to sleep.

There are also ways to design abbatoirs to be far less stressful and more humane but that still doesn’t get around the fact the animals have to be transported there in the first place.

Camo – good luck hunting in anything else. If any statement is going to out you as someone with no clue about what it is they’re commenting on this is it. Cockwomble indeed.

How will I know it’s Scottish, do they bleat with an accent?

It’ll call you a baaaaaastard

Wow Drac, you have shocked me. I would have thought you were a bit more grounded than that.

The industrialized killing of animals for human consumption, is just what it says on the tin. The end result – a dead animal, is pretty much the same and being shot on a Scottish Island.

I’ve seen both, I use to shoot years ago too neither or exactly pleasant or clean evrrytime.  I’ve also seen sheep dipstached on the farm and again it’s not all joyful and happy experience for the animal as they’re not stunned first and it can also fail first time.

Eating meat means you kind of have accept that the animals haven’t had a great end to their lives, you can be comfortable with that or become a vegetarian/vegan. I choose to live with it but reaslistic enough killing an animal either way is not pleasent. However killing a sheep is hardly hunting or a sport.

The reason she’s dressed in camo is the same reason some of us on here dress in neon flouro enduro pyjamas to go for a bike ride in the woods.

It’s gives her an erection?

However killing a sheep is hardly hunting or a sport.

Again, that comes back to context. If its feral then good luck getting it any other way.

Like other’s here, I find the pictures of the two hunters posing with the dead goats quite absurd. However, the goats are on an island, their numbers need to be kept under control, these folk are paying good money into the local economy to do that, and quite frankly, I’d rather they went out and shot a goat, than a Lion or a Tiger.

When you read the woman’s actual tweet thingy at the bottom of the pictures, she’s making a big point of highlighting the equipment she used. She’s advertising her sponsor’s (or potential sponsor’s) kit in these pictures that are aimed at a niche audience, it’s her job to post this sort of stuff to social media. No matter how ludicrous it looks to me, there’ll be someone out there with a stack of money thinking that Islay is their next stop for a bit of shooting action.

I’m struggling to get worked up about it. If it was a picture of my mate Bazz, sitting at the edge of a pond with a 7kg Trout in his arms, and the caption….”Look what I just bagged at Wellside Farm fishery with my Shimano reel and Diawa rod”*, I’d be thinking, “Where’s me Trout fillet ya jammy git”. I’d struggle to be outraged in all honest. I don’t see the difference between popping off a Goat or  Deer with a gun, or pulling a fish out of the water on the end of a rod.

Forgive me if I’m exhibiting moral bankruptcy, but I really can’t get outraged about this.

C.

* Awaiting sponsorship calls

Pigs don’t suffer all that much since asphyxiation by CO2 is the general method used to kill them (hence why the recent shortage was such a big deal). They just go to sleep.

There’s a video somewhere of pigs in a slaughterhouse being killed with CO2. They quite clearly do not enjoy the experience. They don’t just go to sleep.

Apparently pigs are very sensitive to CO2.

Pigs don’t suffer all that much since asphyxiation by CO2 is the general method used to kill them (hence why the recent shortage was such a big deal). They just go to sleep.

Not true. Try and hold your breath for as long as you can – just before you give up, that feeling of having to take a breath isn’t lack of oxygen but the build up of CO2 (hypercapnia) which you can overcome by taking a breath and expelling the CO2 / rebalancing the O2 to CO2 ratio.

But if you’re breathing CO2, that won’t rebalance and yet you still have enough O2 in your system to stay conscious for a while. So you are simultaneous desperately breathing with no effect, making the process very stressful even if it’s for a short period.

Inert gases like nitrogen have the effect you describe – the concentration of O2 in your system drops until you become ‘drunk’, then drowsy, then fall asleep and then die. Some US states are investigating it as a new execution method, and it’s well known among jet pilots, etc., as a result of failing cabin air pressure (there was a case a few years back where the pilot became disorientated so quickly he just carried on flying rather than descend to higher O2 atmosphere, and also why they say fit your own mask before helping others – the time to fit others masks might be long enough for you to forget why you need to fit yours)

Positive note – if you want to impress your kids by swimming lengths of a swimming pool underwater, start by doing some deep, slow inhale/exhales to push as much CO2 out as you can before a final breath and swim. Also adds to the theatre, as if you’re about to perform something truly death defying!!

I’ve got an article written in the 1940s about bow hunting for wild sheep and goats in the Rockies.

Apparently they were considered a really tough animal to hunt because of the terrain and because wild sheep and goats are a lot cleverer and a lot more timid than the sheep you see on your average UK farm.

I’ve no idea if these Scottish sheep are the same, and it would be a lot easier with a rifle,  but I could see why some American hunters might consider this a challenge (though I have no idea if it is or not).

Let’s make it a fair fight…,

Drac
Subscriber

Go on then tell me?

Welsh Farmer got there first, but yes, generally shot from the other end of the barn (close enough to guarantee an accurate shot, not so close that you’re spending the next week picking sheep brain off the barn walls).

it’s pretty much no different to an abatoir.

I think you need to see an a abattoir, it’s not dignitas.