Big car, small engine.

My son is a new-ish driver and about to start a new job where he’ll be doing a lot of driving, mainly on motorways. My general feelings on this ( having driven 30k+ a year for over 30 yrs ) is I’d like him in something with a lot of metal around him, Golf/Focus minimum size. But insurance dictates a small engine, so hence  the question, big car, small engine. I’m aware of the 1 ltr eco-tech engines that Ford make, and also the 1 ltr in the VAG cars, but what else is out there. Budget, up to 5K, and economical, but probably goes without saying in such an engine. Ideally I’d like him in a Volvo V70 1.6 diesel, but it’s a no from both my son and insurance, and obviously the Singletrack Skoda Octavia, but I think they are too new. Thoughts please

You can just about get reasonable mileage Passats with the 1.6 TDI in that price range. Insurance group 16

Example

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202407051473872

My son is a new-ish driver and about to start a new job where he’ll be doing a lot of driving, mainly on motorways. My general feelings on this ( having driven 30k+ a year for over 30 yrs ) is I’d like him in something with a lot of metal around him

Statistically – motorways are the safest roads we drive on – less than 5% of driving related injuries and and fatalities happen on motorways – becuase they have so many safety features designed in. Maybe having a bigger, heavier car just makes it more of a likelihood of having an accident on the roads that 95% of injuries actually happen on.

We have a 60 plate Octavia 1.4 TSI sitting SORNd waiting to be passed on to son, but pretty sure it’s not £5k even from a dealer. More like under £2k..

Something like the 1.2 Fabias/Polos are still good on motorways. They pull away from 50/60 quite strongly as the turbo kicks in at low revs.

Also look carefully at *what* the metal is around him – you can have bigger but older design of car which is not as good in a crash* than a smaller newer design.
*remember that many of the ‘headline’ star figures for cars include the accident avoidance cleverness, not just how the metal performs around you. Worth peering at detail results.

You can sort this by adult occupant – a couple of wee cars stand out as very safe – Honda Jazz and Mazda2 are both up there with Superb/Octavia/Volvo lumps…
https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/safest-family-cars/#?selectedMake=0&selectedMakeName=Select%20a%20make&selectedModel=0&selectedStar=&includeFullSafetyPackage=true&includeStandardSafetyPackage=true&selectedModelName=All&selectedProtocols=-1&selectedClasses=1202,1199,1201,1196,1203,1198,1179,40250,1197,1204&allClasses=false&allProtocols=false&allDriverAssistanceTechnologies=false&selectedDriverAssistanceTechnologies=&thirdRowFitment=false

Your “general feelings” are just that, feelings.  Bigger cars are typically more comfortable over distance and can obviously hold more stuff, but it’s not the 1990s any more.  You can get a Smart with an NCAP 5 rating.  Also, what MacC said.

My question though would be, if your lad is starting a new job involving a lot of motorway mileage, why isn’t work providing him with a suitable vehicle?  From a business perspective, funding someone’s personal car at 45p/mile can get expensive fast.  A day trip from the North West to London and back could pay for a lease vehicle for a month.

Honda Jazz?

My lad had this problem. We bought him a 2011 Audi A3 1.6 diesel. Insurance was £2500 with a black box fitted, which was no worse than similar insurance on a fiesta/Corsa. I think we went through a specialist young persons insurance company too.

Big car small engine sounds like you get caught out overtaking as it’s gutless but maybe I’m out of date

I was thinking back to a MK3 Cortina from the ’70’s with 1300 cc engine

I love the torque of my 3.0i z4 for overtaking and the free induction tune

Hired an Opel Corsa at Dusseldorf for Spa weekend couldn’t fault that car, corsas in UK were always shhhhhhhhhhhit

Volvo V40 D2 (1.6 not the later 2.0) should be well in budget & very economical apart from prices of parts, very safe but don’t know what the insurance would be?

Cougar

Free Member

Your “general feelings” are just that, feelings. Bigger cars are typically more comfortable over distance and can obviously hold more stuff, but it’s not the 1990s any more. You can get a Smart with an NCAP 5 rating. Also, what MacC said

Crash test scores can only be compared within the same class of car. For equivalent scores and car ages e.g. ncap 5*  from 2015, the larger car is safer.

From a business perspective, funding someone’s personal car at 45p/mile can get expensive fast

They’ll be claiming it as an expense before tax. I’d be more concerned that 45p won’t cover his running costs and depreciation on even a cheap car. A newish driver is probably going to be paying through the nose for insurance covering business use and the 45p rate is only allowable on the first 10k miles, then it drops to 25p.

You can get a Smart with an NCAP 5 rating.

Great little car on motorways, apart from crosswinds and overtaking trucks, as I discovered on a windy drive up the M5, it tried to leap half a lane sideways passing the front of a large artic. Quite surprisingly nippy.

Big car small engine sounds like you get caught out overtaking as it’s gutless but maybe I’m out of date

I was thinking back to a MK3 Cortina from the ’70’s with 1300 cc engine

Yeah, you certainly are! My Ford has a 1.0 EcoBoost 3-cylinder turbo. It’s supposed to produce 125bhp, but it honestly feels like it’s got ten more at least. The same motor is put into the Focus, and I know some EcoSports like mine have the same engine mapped to 140bhp as standard. They also have a surprising amount of torque and pull really well. Fiesta based, I absolutely love mine, I bought it having been in a job where I drove 15-20 different vehicles a week, of all kinds, and it ticked all my boxes for looks, comfort, etc.

Probably much too new to be affordable, but it shows that modern small capacity engines with forced induction will steal the boots off any mass-market car from the 90’s and wee in them.

Just a thought, a Toyota Aygo has a small motor, but is perfectly capable of doing significant motorway miles. something Fiesta or Polo sized would probably be the best option.

Oh no, avoid the Aygos and it’s ilk at all costs. My ex girlfriend had one and it is the most uncomfortable car I’ve ever been in, I wouldn’t want to be doing many long journeys in that. Worst seats ever, and all noisy and gutless.

It’s been a while since I was in that position but I found medium sized diesels to be cheaper than small petrol ones, my first car was. 1.6 petrol, my second a 1.9 diesel and it was cheaper (due to the early demise of the petrol one that wasn’t down to having an NCD or anything)

Funnily enough, while chatting to the mechanics we have our cars serviced at last week they were all muttering “as long as you steer clear of the Ford EcoBoost engines…” They have clearly seen quite a few problem cars with that engine.

They’re not called EcoBooms for nothing.

To keep insurance costs reasonable look at the oddball options.  A Skoda Rapid estate with the 1.2 Tsi engine is surprisingly cheap to insure as it doesn’t attract the boy racers, easily cheaper that the equivalent Polo/Golf (it sits between the two for size).

Crash test scores can only be compared within the same class of car. For equivalent scores and car ages e.g. ncap 5* from 2015, the larger car is safer.

I didn’t know that. But even then, that doesn’t equate to smaller cars being inherently more dangerous. If I were to have a ‘big one’ I’d rather be in a 5-year old Jazz than a 30-year old Jag.

Yeah, you certainly are! My Ford has a 1.0 EcoBoost 3-cylinder turbo.

Our current motor is a 1L Seat Arona. I was eyeing up the bigger engine, the salesdroid said “you don’t need it,” I was like “well, I’ll be the judge of that my good man” but he was right. It’s perfectly capable so long as “drive it like you stole it” isn’t on your to-do list.

The Civic I had prior to the Arona was 1.5L and was north of 180PS. That’s just mental. By way of comparison, a 1990s Ford Escort with a 1.6L engine was putting out around half that. The Cavalier SRi I had was 2L and something like 130PS.  Granted, cars are considerably heavier today, but still.

Ecoboost = ‘wet’ timing belt running in oil. Absolutely stupid idea. See also Puretec 1.2 PSA engine, equally crap.

Citroen Berlingo with 1.2 Puretech engine? Yes the Puretech is a wet belt system and there are some horror stories but that is usually because service interval timings and replacement oil types are incorrect. Properly serviced the 1.2 Puretech is a fine engine.

If he’s doing mega miles, a diesel might be a good shout. The 1.6 in the astra and insignia is euro 6, extremely economical (99g co2 from memory), and unexciting to drive. Plenty to be had for 5k, eg

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202406100610386

Newer shape one also an option if you’re ok with higher miles.

As above, motorways are statistically comparatively safe and I see that additional emergency refuges are now being built on “smart” sections of the M1

I patrolled motorways for 10 years in the 1990s/early 2000s and no particular class of vehicle was immune to fatalities/serious injury, including big lorries

Vehicle-wise, buy something reliable. Read up on the best thing to do in the event of breakdown, don’t mess about changing tyres, etc. and stay alert to what’s happening, particularly as weather and traffic conditions change.

Keep away from trucks registered elsewhere, especially if they’re closing on the vehicle in front, and try to sit alongside a gap rather than a vehicle (it gives you both space)

Allow plenty of time for the journey and take breaks 🙂

with the 1.2 Tsi engine is surprisingly cheap to insure as it doesn’t attract the boy racers, easily cheaper that the equivalent Polo/Golf (it sits between the two for size).

Good call.
We looked at Rapid or Scala as alternative to the Fabia. I preferred them as they had a bigger, nicer cabin. But the big boot and slimness of the Fabia estate won over one son and mrs_oab – so we have Fabia estate 1.0 in 110bhp guise.

Small engine has surprised me – it’s got some real go to it. But you do feel it is small when loaded with four on board or a few bikes on the roof. But for 1 or 2 up it’s nippy!

Get this beast or a similar version of it https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-features/tangier-london-vw-passat-goes-to-charity-auction/48838

Cougar

I didn’t know that. But even then, that doesn’t equate to smaller cars being inherently more dangerous. If I were to have a ‘big one’ I’d rather be in a 5-year old Jazz than a 30-year old Jag.

Yes totally agree. Annoyingly I found out about the NCAP thing while I was trying to argue the opposite point. 🙂

Thanks for all the responses, as ever though, insurance seems to be the big stumbling block. A 1Ltr Octavia is group 18 and pretty much all the 1.6 diesels are up there as well. Interestingly a Fabia Est 1ltr is only group 8 so we maybe looking that way.

One thing though, where would you rather be in a bump? A  5 year old Citroen C1 or a similar age Octavia? I ask ,as the Citroen is the classic first car for many kids, and my thinking is something with a bit more protection, ie, a bit more metal.

Out of curiosity, why is he having to drive high miles without the company offering a vehicle, or a contribution towards it? I guess they’ve no requirements as to age/type of vehicle etc.

Just seems odd, in my limited world experience, and genuinely wondering what jobs let  companies put employees over a barrel like this?

He’s self employed, and like me just gets a flat fee for the day, that includes travel, meals , hotels etc. Yep, crap, but that’s the way of the world for many.

My daughter is still learning to drive.  She bought herself a 15 plate Fiesta 1.0 ecoboost Titanium with under 60k on the clock.  Its absolutely mint and has every toy and safety aid needed.  Has a service history including what oil, spark plugs and tyres its had fitted.  Brake pads/discs and new tyres just done.  1 owner.  Airbags galore.  Its 100bhp which i have driven and its ample for motorways in a car that size.  Lets face it a 69bhp fiat 500 can skirt along at highly illegal speeds on the motorway if it needs to.

Good on fuel but not as cheap to insure as i expected because its putting out more BHP than, for example bigger older engines like the 1.25 engine they offer.

We got it for enough under £5k to be able to do the wetbelt job too which was due next year.  Ford have just accepted that Fiestas with FSH, inside the 10yr and mileage period are covered for wetbelt failure too

Refering to the 45p expenses rate, it’s only meant to cover the incremental costs i.e. fuel, tyres, extra depreciation etc.

Anything new-ish will cost more than 45p to run if you include depreciation. But it’s depreciating whether you drive it or it’s sat on your driveway doing nothing.

I bought both my previous cars “for work” and both turned a very healthy profit for me at 45p/mile.

Having said that, if he doesn’t want the car for personal use as well then if I were him I’d be suggesting to his employer they give him a company car/van that’s left at work overnight (i.e. not dealing with BIK). There’s no point effectively paying the company to employ you, may as well get an office job.

If making a profit off the 45p is the goal, then go as cheap as you can without looking like you’re asking for breakdown trouble and annoying the company. Think £1200 1.6 NA petrol focus. It’ll do fewer mpg, but enough to be profitable, and there’s very little to go wrong with them.

Is it knocking up and down a motorway or a lot of motorway driving with a lot of non motorway driving as well.

If its sat on the motorway i would look at an old mondeo tdi. If its got a fair bit of town driving as well a golf will be a better bet imo.

Id gravitate towards something that has a lot of users like a ford or golf as parts will be cheaper and easier to fix with the wealth of knowledge on the tinterweb.

I really like the passats and they have some with small engines but a lot of the taxis around here have them with mileage blockers so be careful.

spend some time on a comparison site to see what cars are insurable.

There’s a wide variety of Honda Civics at that price point.

Comfortable & safe enough & generally not too bad on insurance.  A few engines don’t quite meet ULEZ if that’s a consideration.

Right, I’ve narrowed it down. Nothing bigger than a Golf, and the engine can’t be bigger than 1.2, and group 8 insurance or less. And Euro 6, if possible. All I can see are VAG cars, is there anything else ( I’ve been warned off high mileage Fords )?

Do you mean Euro 6?

CAZ ULEZ for London (and others) is Euro 6 diesel and Euro 4 petrol (which gives a choice of petrol Euro 5 and 6 as well)

@andy8442

Your requirement has got petrol TSI Fabia all over it!

My daughter has a 1.2 TSI and it’s a cracking little car.

Your requirement has got petrol TSI Fabia all over it!

Fabia, Ibiza, Scala or Rapid all in 90bhp manual 1lt or 1.2lt
You might just stretch to a Ceed 1lt as well.

andy8442

Free Member
Right, I’ve narrowed it down. Nothing bigger than a Golf, and the engine can’t be bigger than 1.2, and group 8 insurance or less. And Euro 6, if possible. All I can see are VAG cars, is there anything else ( I’ve been warned off high mileage Fords )?

The Ford 1.25 is a reliable engine in the mk7 Fiesta. It is the 1 litre that has the wet belt issue.  I took one over 100K with no issues, literally nothing went wrong on it, routine servicing only.  Slow AF though.