Asking for (or demanding) an apology

This caught my eye today:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/olympics/articles/cy0npjxw7k1o

Is it just me or is there something strange about asking for an apology?  Or is it a case of cultural differences?  Asking for an apology is just not something that would ever cross my mind.  Acknowledgement that a mistake was made?  Sure.  But to ask someone to say sorry seems weird.

A friend of mine was telling me about his sister who works as a nurse in England.  Apparently there is some kind of certification she needs to renew regularly and she was late applying.  As a result she was uncertified for a few days.

As part of the disciplinary process she was required to write a sincere letter of apology.  Her first effort was rejected by her manager as not being sincere enough.  She mentioned this to my friend who, while they were still chatting, sent her a block of text.  She sent this in as a letter and that was accepted.

ChatGPT has its uses, after all.

And then there was this situation that was definitely weird:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/nov/07/scottish-rugby-union-fined-70-thousand-mark-dodson-world-cup-comments

From what I remember this was a pissing contest between Mark Dodson and Alan Gilpin.  Both of whom seemed to think their behaviour regarding the negotiation of who was going to apologise for what was completely normal.

Is it just me who finds this deeply weird behaviour? I’m not sure if this is confirmation bias but asking for (or demanding) an apology is something I’ve only ever seen English people do which is why I’m wondering if it’s a cultural thing.  Not saying it never happens in Scotland (or anywhere else for that matter) but I’ve never seen anyone but English people doing it.

Is it just me or is there something strange about asking for an apology?

Yes.

Lewis brakes on the Intense race team bikes

I suppose peak level ‘asking for an apology’ would be that Lewis brakes thread! EDIT: Too late!

Demanding an apology from strangers on the interweb because they criticised some knock off Chinese brakes…..right you are!

But yeah that nurse story sounds really **** weird!

As part of the disciplinary process she was required to write a sincere letter of apology.  Her first effort was rejected by her manager as not being sincere enough.  She mentioned this to my friend who, while they were still chatting, sent her a block of tex

Thats nothing more than bullying.

For me an apology cannot really be solicited. It is implicit that an apology is given without being asked for.

The trouble is that we’re in such a culture where people are scared stiff of issuing an apology because they fear it confers proof of culpability – which could then be used against them further down the line. It’s just the slightly **** society we find ourselves in.

I apologise all the time at work, it’s very effective at resolving complaints.

WRT being made to rewrite an apology, some people aren’t aware of what makes a good one and so it can come off as passive aggressive.

I apologise all the time at work, it’s very effective at resolving complaints.

I think most people apologise quite often.  It’s asking for an apology I’m talking about.

For me an apology cannot really be solicited. It is implicit that an apology is given without being asked for.

Absolutely this. If someone has to point out the mistake/error to get an apology, then there is no sincerity behind the apology.

Absolutely this. If someone has to point out the mistake/error to get an apology, then there is no sincerity behind the apology.

I’m sorry you feel that way.

I saw the article about the skeet shooter, and I think how she put it is maybe softer than saying she’s asking for an apology – I read it as she thinks there should be one, along with an acknowledgement that she has literally been robbed of a gold medal. If that was me, I don’t think I’d have put it in such moderate terms!

“However, I do believe some accountability needs to be taken to acknowledge and an apology for the incorrect decision ultimately costing me an opportunity of winning an Olympic gold medal.”

I apologise all the time at work, it’s very effective at resolving complaints.

The most powerful ‘apology’ type work scenario Ive been involved in was where a colleague was made to look stupid in a meeting by a bully.

Fair play to the person who was bullied. She asked to speak with the bully, and asked me to go along. She didnt even ask for an apology. She just let the bully know how it made her feel. The bully went away very sheepish and actually changed their behaviour after.

I am sure that if the lady had asked for an apology the bully would still be behaving in the same way

I apologise for potentially not understanding stuff in audits.
It tends to unbalance auditees and they tend to open up and offer information far more.
Of course I am not sorry in the slightest

I apologise for potentially not understanding stuff in audits.
It tends to unbalance auditees and they tend to open up and offer information far more.
Of course I am not sorry in the slightest

Next time I’m audited I’m going to demand an apology from the auditor for potentially not understanding stuff in audits.

It should unbalance the auditor and allow me to conceal far more information.

Of course, I don’t require an apology in the slightest.

I just don’t see how this can only be an English thing and the isninuation has upset me a little.

I demand an apology.

Ads678, Gods own Country, England.

I think it’s OK to ask that someone (who hasn’t already) to acknowledge the hurt or harm they’ve done, which is how I translate the ‘asking for an apology’ question. It, at the very least, makes them reflect on it they haven’t done so already

The nursing one; I’d expect a competent nurse to at the very least have their shit together enough to sort out their registration or certification in plenty of time. That’s pretty basic, and I think if an apology hadn’t been forth coming, I’d have asked for one. Not least because of the danger it places their patients in*

*I’m not sorry, ending a sentence like this is perfectly acceptable. It’s only the likes of half-wits like John (two sides) Dryden that started the whole nonsense, likening English grammar to Latin – which it isn’t.

I demand an apology.

I won’t apologise but perhaps we can negotiate a mutual statement of regret.

@Brucewee

You can try that one, tends to piss us off and dig more though. Are you so confident in your systems that you want that…… most don’t

I read it as she thinks there should be one, along with an acknowledgement that she has literally been robbed of a gold medal. If that was me, I don’t think I’d have put it in such moderate terms!

This.  An acknowledgement of the error is required… I would have thought that would include an apology.

The way i read this it’s basically getting an apology from the organisation, it’s more to do with an error being made and the apology would be accepting liability, it’s not like she wants a heartfelt apology from an individual.

I won’t apologise but perhaps we can negotiate a mutual statement of regret.

Aye, that’ll do.

Aye, that’ll do.

OK, let’s call our lawyers and instruct them to begin work.

She was robbed of the OPPORTUNITY for a gold medal (it was a shoot off and she was eliminated, she might still have lost on the following shots). She’s looking for some recognition of culpability from the Olympic body, and I have some sympathy with that.

I apologise for potentially not understanding stuff in audits.

It tends to unbalance auditees and they tend to open up and offer information far more.

Of course I am not sorry in the slightest

The Colombo approach? Seen it a hundred times now. The interaction between auditor and audited at an individual level almost never fails to have an amusing element in my experience.

Auditors are fun and, generally speaking, the ones who are any good at it get promoted away from the actual work and into management. So the cycle continues…

Oh, and no, I am not sorry!

That Lewis brakes guy – not ventured into those threads – what an absolute stroker! The missing emojis and likes are felt hard on that thread.

The nursing apology rejected letter; jeez – tool level of bellendery. The funny thing is that nursing is a complete sellers market and they could so easily take their skills elsewhere. Of course that works both ways – the person they were being asked to write an apology to might be a desperation appointment in a staffing shortage and would be a long way from even managing the tea and coffee cupboard in other circumstances.

As to the OP – I can sort of see what she’s after. An admission that they got it wrong and robbed her of an opportunity of gold. Not as good as getting the gold, but it’s something you could hang your hat on in years to come. That will probably have been her competitive lifetime highlight – not quite the same as having to apologise for nausing up a bit of paperwork. Breaking, and that Aussie lady’s performance in particular has robbed me of the opportunity of pointing out shooting is a crap sport and  participants being refereed to as athletes laughable. But the bar has now been set so low it is no longer relevant.

She was robbed of the OPPORTUNITY for a gold medal (it was a shoot off and she was eliminated, she might still have lost on the following shots). She’s looking for some recognition of culpability from the Olympic body, and I have some sympathy with that.

I don’t think anyone is arguing with that.

It’s the apology part I find strange.  Even if what you mean is an acknowledgement, asking for it in the form of an apology seems really alien which is why I’m wondering if it’s a cultural thing.

Colombo approach, love that.
I tend to use it very sparingly and it should be a sign that we have def found something and we are just confirming there is a gap.
I love auditing and am refusing to move back into management, much more fun this way round

Is it that different from demanding satisfaction (ooer missus) and all that? In the old duelling days, you’d demand satisfaction. Now you can demand an apology (and get told where to shove it)

Is it that different from demanding satisfaction (ooer missus) and all that?

I honestly think you might be onto something there.

Not saying it never happens in Scotland (or anywhere else for that matter) but I’ve never seen anyone but English people doing it.

A quick google of “demand an apology scotland”  would tend to indicate confirmation bias. That your rugby example has no obvious link to England also seems odd.

In the shooters case it is effectively an admission of failings which then leads onto how can they address it in future with the suggestion being for the refs to use slow mo video footage to review.

OP would you vastly differentiate between someone who is ‘demanding an apology’ or ‘asking for an apology’, or even ‘wanting an apology’?

The use of the word demanding to me could imply someone with a demanding, needy aggressive personality which is not an attractive trait.

I would be interested to know if you think only English people have demanding, needy aggressive personalities? 🙂

I think in many situations there are people who would like to receive an apology from someone they feel has aggrieved them. I often hear people say in criminal or negligence cases that all they really want is an apology. In these cases I would think that an apology to them would go some way to show an admission of guilt and possibly a show of remorse. I would say that publicly stating this is indirectly asking for an apology (though possibly not demanding it). Also saying ‘an apology would have been nice’ is a roundabout way of asking for one.

A quick google of “demand an apology scotland”  would tend to indicate confirmation bias.

My google skills show mostly politicians demanding apologies rather than individuals.  In the case of politics I think ‘apology’ and ‘demand apology’ means something very different to an individual having an apology demanded of them.

I kind of get that the shooter is more asking for acknowledgment.  Like I said though, if I was in the same situation it would not occur to me to ask for that acknowledgement in the form of an apology.  I might expect and apology but I wouldn’t ask for it.

That your rugby example has no obvious link to England also seems odd.

Mark Dodson and Alan Gilpin are both English.  The entire thing was a pissing contest between these two and the apology ended up being the main bone of contention.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/arid-30956933.html

I think in the public eye the demanding an apology is simply trying to make someone publicly admit to the person being wrong and “you” are right. This is not just English, its pretty common in world politics.

In terms of the Olympic athlete requesting an apology, she has dedicated her time and effort to be one of the best in the world, she sucessfully hit her target, the judges failed to see it and eliminated her. Why should she not have an apology? She is highlighting that there is room for improvement, that the current system is proven to be flawed and she had an opportunity taken from her, something she had worked incredibly hard at and may not get another chance to achieve. Seems fair to me.

Why should she not have an apology?

Don’t think anyone is saying she shouldn’t have one

Again, it’s asking for an apology that wouldn’t occur to me and I find it strange.  And that along with other times people have asked for or demanded apologies is what I find strange.

Anyway, to many on here this appears to be perfectly reasonable behaviour so I guess the attitude is at least fairly well accepted among the STW demographic so that tells us something at least.

I think the “demand an apology” is just media shorthand isn’t it? Like mentioning the age of some-one – “Man, 34 finds giving an apology difficult” or that all women in swimwear are ‘flaunting’

I don’t think I’ve met someone IRL that’s ever said “I demand an apology” I think I’d struggle to take them seriously

I guess the attitude is at least fairly well accepted among the STW demographic

Or just the English part of it?

I think what nickc says is fair, the use of the word demand is usually just media hyperbole.

In the below linked BBC article ‘demand’ is used in the title, but reading the article supposedly the interviewee only said “hopefully get an apology” which is someway from demanding one IMO.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-66617352.amp

I don’t think I’ve met someone IRL that’s ever said “I demand an apology” I think I’d struggle to take them seriously

I think if your work requires a written apology as part of the disciplinary process that’s a demand, even if it’s not stated as such.

Especially if they then turn around and say, ‘Nope, not good enough’ after your first attempt.  It’s not really a request then, is it?

In the below linked BBC article ‘demand’ is used in the title, but reading the article supposedly the interviewee only said “hopefully get an apology” which is someway from demanding one IMO.

Indeed journalist clickbait title hyperbole is pretty much all it is.

Thols2 – this is so 2023 news