Anyone with experience of focus warranty (more ebike ponderings)

Following on from various other threads, I’ve found I’m gravitating to a focus ebike. There are a few reasons, chiefly:

It’s a decent size at 515 reach
Bosch motor
Removable battery

The other options don’t tick all the boxes quite as well, eg the specialized doesn’t have a removable battery which I’d prefer for winter instead of leaving it in the garage. The kenevo sl does look lovely though and I’m a tart so I shan’t discount it on the basis of it being the wrong answer nor expensive.

What has me dragging my heels a bit on the focus is warranty, they’re an unknown to me and being an ebike I expect I’ll need to use it at some point.

Has anyone had dealings with the warranty on a focus? Were they any good to deal with? Do they have a national approach or is it all through the shop you bought it from (which is a good hour or two away but they have a road bike dealer closer)

I’ve also seen a heckler at a less offensive price, and jungle are just up the road but, shimano motor and still expensive…

vitus ebikes are just over 2k from crc. at that price you`d be mad to buy anything else.

my focus has been decent but focus dont have a huge presence here. the motor is covered by the motor manufacturer anyway.

vitus ebikes are just over 2k from crc. at that price you`d be mad to buy anything else.

Apart from the fact they don’t have Bosch motors.

vitus ebikes are just over 2k from crc. at that price you`d be mad to buy anything else

Not really.
Whilst the price is difficult to overlook, the only one that’ll fit me is the mythique lt. Even then in slack it’s definitely on the not entirely sure that’s big enough side.
The only version available would see me replace just about everything but the frame – so it’s at least £4k really. (and the kit is going to be worth a fraction of the peanuts it would normally attact in the current market)
It’s a mullet which I don’t want.
The battery is non removable.
It’s a first gen motor with no real world feedback so far as I can see.
Oh and they’re online only so if anything does go wrong I’ve got to mess about with getting it boxed etc and back to crc. For a normal bike I wouldn’t be bothered chances it’ll matter are slim, for an ebike I expect it’ll happen at least once if not more. For a new model, with a new motor?
Add to that CRC/wiggle posted huge loses this year and are currently having a fire sale, I doubt they’ll go but it tends to be things like CS that get cut back with vigour to try and return to profit. I hope to be proven wrong but I can see their warranty etc being much much worse in 12 months time.

In honesty I think I’d be mad to buy one despite how tempting the price is.

the specialized doesn’t have a removable battery which I’d prefer for winter instead of leaving it in the garage

Which Model? As the current/old Levo’s/Kenovo  batteries can be easily removed, not so sure about the Levo SL or Kenovo SL though (Race co are doing the Kenovo SL frame only for 50% off)

Get this 🙂 What a bargain
https://www.leisurelakesbikes.com/bikes/electric-bikes/cannondale-moterra-neo-carbon-lt-2-electric-bike-2023-black__396412

505mm reach in XL, battery is removeable, bafang a big company I believe but granted there is the worry with support by mail order. CRC have always been good for warranty issues for me though. I expect you could just send the motor back if there was an issue. As for the spec, who cares about gears if they work. Forks yer probably and maybe better pads/rotors.

I’ve never ridden a mullet so that is one thing I wouldn’t be sure of. Been 29er for 10 years, 6’3 and currently on a XL 2022 Escarpe

As the current/old Levo’s/Kenovo batteries can be easily removed,

This is interesting, easily at in designed to be or easily as in not difficult – I want to be able to quickly and easily drop the battery and take it inside where is warm and then quickly and easily remount it.

(Race co are doing the Kenovo SL frame only for 50% off)

No s5. TFFT.

I had a Focus (which I’ve just sold) and I really liked it. Local dealer support is paramount for an e-bike IMO so I would only buy a brand where I had access to a dealer locally.

Easily, you disconnect the battery connector, and unscrew one bolt, it’s a long battery so easier to do it with the frame upside down.

from 1.30 (this is a Levo mk2, but the current Mk3 just has a slightly redesigned battery connector)

How to remove your Specialized Kenevo & Levo Battery – YouTube

The Focus batteries drop out in seconds, without having to turn the bike upside down, which on an e-bike is a lot harder than it looks!

VanHalen

my focus has been decent but focus dont have a huge presence here. the motor is covered by the motor manufacturer anyway.

True but your warranty is managed through the retailer (in a roundabout way for the motor).
Shimano – > Madison -> retailer -> customer
Shimano – > Madison -> direct manufacturer -> customer

My Shimano motor is failing after 9mo but refuses to give me an error code.
It’s cutting out and making some pretty bad metal on metal sounds and getting worse but the local LBS (rather than CRC/Wiggle) told me Madison aren’t interested in anything but the error code.
I was asking them how much for them to ride it and write a report and they just said Madison won’t be interested in what they say.. (How true that is I don’t know).

I’m basically riding it at the moment trying to get it to fail on some error code to then return it to Wiggle… hoping I’m not miles from anywhere when it finally fails and the cranks still turn so I can at least pedal it back home unassisted. Given the grinding noise and feeling like something is loose inside and jamming I think the not being able to pedal it all all is at least likely.

YMMV etc. I guess most people manage an error code and then CRC/wiggle let you return via a LBS.

I know other motor makes are different… and to some extent seem to believe the shop if they say its screwed?

Whilst the price is difficult to overlook, the only one that’ll fit me is the mythique lt. Even then in slack it’s definitely on the not entirely sure that’s big enough side.

Can’t say about the Mythique but my size M e-sommet is WAY bigger than my size L Capra. I was lucky enough to try one and had thought I was a large but NO WAY….

What I can say is the bike itself is stupidly good for the money… I got the base model and changed suspension/wheels/brakes but I’d probably do that anyway.

It’s a first gen motor with no real world feedback so far as I can see.

It’s not entirely clear if the modifications by Vitus are going to stop you replacing it with a OTS Bafang..

Frankly I’d love to be in the position of just being able to buy a replacement motor… though I have 15 mo warranty left so I hope this fails in a warranty way soon.
I could take my chances and return it to Wiggle but I feel like there is at least a 50/50 chance I’ll be without the bike for months then get it back exactly as I sent it and have lost that time from warranty ??

In honesty I think I’d be mad to buy one despite how tempting the price is.

On the other side I could buy one of these every year and still be quids in over my mates £12000 Spez..???
On the other hand his motor failed and was replaced same day…
On yet another hand my other mate bought a most basic Spez (same price as frame/motor alone) and swapped everything onto it and stuck the takeoffs on his old Decoy and sold that??

I’m running out of hands .. I guess the point being pros and cons

which on an e-bike is a lot harder than it looks!

I’ve lots of practice of getting a bike upside down, the difficult part has always been not being underneath it. I can’t see that changing with an ebike 😉

Levo SL and Kenevo SL battery is removeable, but you have to drop the motor to do it, so not exactly an easy job.

Levo and Kenevo full fat have batteries that are designed to be removed trailside.

FWIW, I’ve done 2000 miles on my Focus ebike (Bosch) without fault.  I bought it from a shop 100 miles away (because they could get one months before the local shop).  Local dealer said he would deal with any warranty issues, though.  Brilliant bike, can’t fault it.  It’s a wee bit porky, but a couple of Kgs on these things doesn’t really matter, does it?

stevextc
Free Member
VanHalen

my focus has been decent but focus dont have a huge presence here. the motor is covered by the motor manufacturer anyway.

True but your warranty is managed through the retailer (in a roundabout way for the motor).
Shimano – > Madison -> retailer -> customer
Shimano – > Madison -> direct manufacturer -> customer

My Shimano motor is failing after 9mo but refuses to give me an error code.
It’s cutting out and making some pretty bad metal on metal sounds and getting worse but the local LBS (rather than CRC/Wiggle) told me Madison aren’t interested in anything but the error code.
I was asking them how much for them to ride it and write a report and they just said Madison won’t be interested in what they say.. (How true that is I don’t know).

I’m basically riding it at the moment trying to get it to fail on some error code to then return it to Wiggle… hoping I’m not miles from anywhere when it finally fails and the cranks still turn so I can at least pedal it back home unassisted. Given the grinding noise and feeling like something is loose inside and jamming I think the not being able to pedal it all all is at least likely.

YMMV etc. I guess most people manage an error code and then CRC/wiggle let you return via a LBS.

you need a better lbs. my motor got sent off by my local shimano dealer. it was a little bit noisy.

VanHalen

you need a better lbs. my motor got sent off by my local shimano dealer. it was a little bit noisy.

Did it have any error codes?
The LBS I went to (based on proximity) only sells one ebike model with a Shimano motor and that by ironic chance is a Nukeproof.
I wasn’t even asking they handled the return just if they could write a report and they advised me it wouldn’t make any difference.

If it makes a difference I can travel further .. I was reluctant to just send it back to Wiggle without a firm error code.
I did ask on a STEPS group and though lots had successfully returned the motor with error codes noone had managed without.

Sorry Steve, I missed your post, guess they crossed in the ether.

Can’t say about the Mythique but my size M e-sommet is WAY bigger than my size L Capra

I think that’s more because YT make bikes for hobbits than vitus make them for lanky folks.

My two current bikes are a kona with 515 reach 670 tt and a bird with 540 and TT of 680 one of those feels right – along, up, down and round in car park circles checking the indexing – the other feels a touch small. Both are bigger, by a good chunk, than an XXL capra.
A 650 TT is teeny weeny!

I want to be able to quickly and easily drop the battery and take it inside where is warm

I’m curious, what’s your motivation for this?

I’m curious, what’s your motivation for this?

Not killing the expensive battery really. The garage gets cold, often drops below 5 for protracted periods in winter and below zero for a few days at a time. (obviously depends on the weather)
Li-ion batteries do not like the cold, certainly they do not like to be stored in sub zero temperatures and charging them at low temperature isn’t good for them without massively throttling the charge current and I’m not sure if the smart charge actually accounts for temperature. I’d rather not find out the £800 way.

Will it be a problem? Probably not.
It’s it worth finding out? Absolutely not.

We have stored our Turbo Levos and Levo SL in the unheated garage since 2017 and that’s where they mostly get charged unless they are in the camper.

No where else to put them and cant be fussed in removing the batteries.

Not had a problem yet

(the other thing with a removable battery is it means spare battery too, this means much better for self shuttling days and a big part of the driver for an ebike is practice practice practice which I’m thoroughly rubbish at because pedaling up the same hill repeatedly is terminally boring)

Will it be a problem? Probably not.
It’s it worth finding out? Absolutely not.

Yeah, fair enough. But i do think you’re overthinking this slightly. Li-ion batteries do not degrade by being stored in the cold. They certainly do have lower capacity when cold I.e a cold battery won’t give good range on a ride. But it doesn’t impact long term battery lifetime.

Just done a bit of reading this morning as I’m curious about this, and it’s confirmed my suspicion:

If you’re bringing a battery inside you’re best off putting it in the freezer if you’re really concerned about long term degradation of capacity! But it’s not a thing to worry about anyway. One thing to avoid is overheating, if your garage gets unreasonably hot in summer that would be a time to be concerned. The cold is not. All chemical processes slow down in the cold, that’s the general principle behind keeping batteries cold to prevent self-discharge and avoid long term degradation. That said cold batteries do not take a charge as well and do not deliver power as well, but long term damage is not an issue. My 7 year old electric car is happy being stored outside, but range is worse in winter.

https://batteryuniversity.com/article/bu-702-how-to-store-batteries

So just leave it in the garage and stop worrying.

So just leave it in the garage and stop worrying.

My ebike does live in the garage, but the temp tends not to drop much below 5 celcius. but if below zero temperatures are not really a problem for storing batteries why do the manuals for various batteries contains statements like these

“It’s recommended to store the Battery at room temperature (approx. 10 °C to 20 °C / 50 °F to 68 °F ) and do not expose it to direct sunlight.” – battery manual for TQ HPR 50 battery.

“Never store them at temperatures below −10 °C or above 60 °C.” – bosch powertube battery

“Storage temperature °C +10 to +40” – bosch powertube battery

Now I do agree that storage of ebike batteries inside seems to be overplayed, but he manuals do say this kind of thing,which is why people are a bit sensitive about it.

I had similar dilemma’s this time last year and ended up buying an orbea rise.  I bought local thinking warranty and ease of claiming etc.  I also spent ages mulling over the battery.  I spoke to a guy who’d previously worked in a battery factory and modern batteries are designed to work in far wider range of temps than the UK has to offer. and these days, temp has naff all real world noticeable impact.  The bigger issue is human impact.  Leaving it on charge for 23 hours a day and so on.  Sure, battery capacity declines in colder temps but he was saying you’d never notice the difference.

There doesnt seem to be a general consensus on batteries either despite the manuals.  I’ve been told by professionals to store at around 1/4 charge and top up for 10 mins every 3 moths to keep it alive through to store it at full charge when not using it.  I go for the middle ground.  Store at 1/4 to half full then fully charge the night before.  BAsically dont charge after use, just charge before use.

removable battery is more about convenience.  My rise is internal battery.  Means charge in the garage and if we go on hols I have to hope I can take the bike into the room to charge it or have access to an external charge point.  My mates canyon is unplug battery and take inside.  My bikes a PITA to take away on hols.  His isnt.

And I’m coming to the conclusion warranties are only occasionally useful.
1) Rear XT mech crapped out after 3 rides.  Clutch siezed due to no grease.  Bike shop wouldnt warranty it.  Regreased it.  Shift was still shite.  Regrease again.  Still shite.  So I REPLACEED it with SRAM.  Not warranty.
2) Rear axle snapped.  I did get warranty new axle but that’s it.  No labour coverage so I did it myself.  But the replacement took so long I ended up with new wheels anyway.

3) Fox fork bushes failed after 200mls.  Warranty claim but I didnt do it through the shop.  JTech did it all for me as part of a service and upgrade.  Still had to pay for the service but I got new bushes for free.

4) Frame bearings siezed after 80mls.  No warranty as consumable so not only the cost of the bearings but also cost of labour.  So I did it myself.

Warranties have so many exclusions on wear and tear there’s not a lot they cant wriggle out of.

In short, I dont think I’d worry about buying local again for the sake of warranty.  If the motor fails then maybe I’d think differently but for now the shimano is still rattling on and on and the warranty I have needed has been worthless.

why do the manuals for various batteries contains statements like these

very good point, and as OP said, when they’re charging £800 for a replacement you’re gonna take every precaution you can. That’s fair enough.