That’s the same trail over from Tilberthwaite that’s been getting lots of press.
I can’t help thinking that a local quarry owner has mates who sign off this work – all that ‘quarry waste’ must cost £K’s. That or a gravel bike manufacturer…..
That section has been really good recently – bedrock steps, which were a hoot downhill and a challenge to climb. In the past it’s been loose baby head rocks and a bit of a pain. The weather will sort it soon enough. If it’s done for farm access (as it is a BOAT I believe) then it’s sort of understandable, but it does look like twee touristification. There’s a fairly posh development off to the right these days isn’t there?
So in the first pic we have an eroded mess, in the second we have a repaired path that will blend in nicely over time.
Why do you want these eroded messes to be allowed to get worse and worse? It somewhat upset me to go walking in the lakes and see the paths I remember from my childhood as wide eroded gullies.
As a guy who walks a lot @tjagain I walk to escape the manicured sanitised world. The ‘eroded mess’ presents zero problems to walkers. That crap is tantamount to tarmac – like walking on the pavement in the middle of Ambleside. Hardly escaping are you?
It’s now a bike motorway too. So it’ll increase conflict between both sets of pissed-off-at-the-vandalism user groups.
Im not looking for an arguement here TJ ..but what you see as an eroded mess …others see as a trail with a certain level of technicality / challenge ..
That’s certainly how I viewed it each time I have ridden it ..if every trail were to be ” smoothed out ” why would we bother with full suspension mountain bikes ?
The problem with that type of surface is it will wash away into a dangerous gully after a few decent days of rain. This will make it unsafe to ride, problematic for farm vehicles and an issue for walkers. Judging by eye that surface is about a foot deep so you’ll end up with a foot of gully meandering through it.
I’m well aware of that being the case ..I live in a very remote part of the country myself ..and certainly don’t view myself as being either ignorant or entitled ..no need for the aggression ..mine was a point of view ..
I understand the argument that vehicle access may be needed but is that what’s happened here? If so why not just tarmac and be done with it ? It would be no less ugly and out of keeping than what has been done, and would last a lot better.
No it’s a highway that the highways department have a duty to maintain in an accessible state for ALL users not just those of us on two wheels that enjoy a challenge.
Did they chip out the bedrock, or just cover it up with a load of shingle which will wash out this winter? Either way, anything approaching a standard LD winter will remove large quantities of that stuff within months.
the highways department have a duty to maintain in an accessible state for ALL users not just those of us on two wheels that enjoy a challenge.
TBH most of the other users will have preferred the bedrock – I imagine Kankku et al will be equally pissed off. But if the farmer is genuinely wanting to use it to get to his stock, then I guess we need to find other challenges around there.
How long ago was it that the section of Jenkins Crag was covered? On the JennRide this spring it was already being washed away. Certainly where there’s any significant slope or surface water the work doesn’t last that long. The Coniston side of Walna Scar is another that was covered but is now back to pretty much as it was on the steeper sections.
I normally go down through Moss Rigg Wood, there are some proper and possibly not-so-proper 😉 trails there. Not been along that Tilberthwaite one in a couple of years.
We understand that for some people that the enjoyment they get from using a route may centre around overcoming the challenge of ‘technical’ sections on a route. On some routes in the Lake District this challenge has always been part of the route with bedrock, steep gradients and unstable surfaces providing that challenge.
With regards to Tilberthwaite this is not the case, as we are dealing with a route that was created as part of the infrastructure to support the mining and quarrying activities in the area. This overall infrastructure is part of the historic environment of the area and is recognised in the submission to UNESCO that resulted in the National Park being granted World Heritage Site status.
The work on the route is aimed at returning the track to an overall condition similar to that when it was constructed. We recognise that in doing so we are repairing the more challenging damaged sections enjoyed by some people, but it will make the track more accessible and enjoyable to others who are currently unable to use the route due to the damaged sections.
As with every route that we repair, this has been carefully evaluated to ensure all user groups are considered and that it receives the appropriate level of maintenance.
When they were saying it was to help the farmer access his stock, that’s a fair argument, but returning the track to the state it was in when it was supporting quarrying and mining seems slightly wrong-headed, given that there is no quarrying or mining up there these days. I love how they are trotting out the UNESCO stuff to justify absolutely anything they want already.
Not sure who the users who are ‘currently unable’ to enjoy the route are. Can’t be walkers, they can get up it just fine. Not 4x4s or MTBs.
Must either be gravel bikers or little old ladies in Nissan Micras.
It’s disappointing that a section of my favourite local ride is gone (for now) but I understand that the farmer needs access. Thats their livelihood.
So, serious question, what would be the best way to ‘resurface’ a trail like this? How would you keep all end users happy? I don’t know what the answer is…. Anybody?
I’d take that over the baby heads dumped over huge sections of the lakes in the past (including the bottom of that road/track/trail/line on a map) which are often loose and unstable making walking or horse riding much less enjoyable and playing a big part in the widening and damage to those same-whatever-you-want-to-call-thems.
Yeah the one time i rode that trail there were quite a few enduro motorbikes coming up it. The riders were all really nice and gave me priority heading down it, unlike the Kanku 4×4 that came up a bit after them
I don’t know specifics about this matter but I have had a lot of experience with Cumbrian local government at all levels, and LDNPA. Corruption rules up there, and if something happens it is most often for all the wrong reasons.
I am semi local to that trail re my mrs living nearby. Local people are not happy with it. Last I heard it cost 75k to do. Met a kankku driver up there walking it and he was in favor of it re clients. There is a lot of anti 4×4 feeling too. See westmoreland gazette website.
New farmer has replaced the old one. He drives his quad all over the fells not just the track…. it was perfectly accessible pre work by quad. It did not need such repair work everywhere to allow him access. Old farmer left re 4×4 disturbance.
The bedrock slabs were a delight to ride n run up or down. Its now very fast and far less interesting. Bedrock was smashed up too in places. I watched unfold the last couple of months with sadness. Been on local tv and in the papers.
Its happening to a lot of great tracks in the lakes and it is really taking any challenge away. Seems to be a lot of bridleways thats getting the work to make stuff more family friendly or to appease unnesco. I know some riders like it as it loads easier to ride now – whats wrong with hike a bike if its too hard?. Homogenous gravel is not what I like to ride myself. Problem is its happening a lot with no sign of stopping. Faster speeds are going to cause conflict with other users. I also think a few hard winters will trash it and more money will be spent on a pointless repair/restructure when the local main roads are potholed to hell…
Not knowing who Kankku were I googled them. Is it a huge coincidence that the main photo/animation at the top of their site is of the exact same view posted by the OP?
I am struggling with this – the trail clearly has eroded, a lot. That poses real issues for the farmer, it is possibly going to continue ending up with new trails being formed and or innacessibility.
The new trail does seem to stand out some, but may well bed in nicely.
I do have concerns that I cannot see drains and such like, has this just created another issue further down the road through poor construction.
Met a kankku driver up there walking it and he was in favor of it re clients.
I cannot fathom why this should be. I thought the whole point was getting clients onto challenging terrain, not the kind of track you could get a standard car up?
And in what way does UNESCO status demand this kind of repair?
That poses real issues for the farmer, it is possibly going to continue ending up with new trails being formed and or innacessibility.
It was in that condition for years without any sign of trouble, and if, as reported above, the farmer on that side is quite happy tackling it on a quad, that takes away any justification for blowing 75K on levelling it.
So, a few years back I did a Kankku 4×4 trip up in the Lakes and I am pretty sure that I remember driving down this section of trail, which was one of the toughest that we did…and lots of fun too:
I specifically remember them talking a lot about erosion and protecting the trail and they were insistent that the tyres remained on firm ground at all times to avoid churning the place up. We were also told not to spin tyres or generally hoon about either, for much the same reasons (as well as wrecking the trucks and pissing off other users). Noone did and, tbh, considering that we took a load of 4x4s across an offroad route, I’m pretty sure our “impact” was pretty low, although doing this twice per day, every day might be a very different matter.
They mentioned that a lot of trail damage was actually from private 4x4s driven by people who didn’t have a clue what they were doing and thus caused way more damage than they needed to. I’m not sure what the truth of it is, of course, but we were taught basic techniques for torque reduction (i.e. brake and throttle together) to avoid wheelspin and associated damage and loss of forward momentum and I know that the group we were in certainly weren’t pissing about. We only met a couple of bikes on the day we were out and the convoy was instructed to stop to let them get past us with minimal fuss.
I’m surprised that Kankku would have gone along with this as it would go without saying that a flat, gravel track isn’t a lot of fun for this sort of thing, but perhaps they are aware of the delicate balance that lets them keep running these excursions. That said, if I were a farmer and I needed to use this (public) route to do my job, I might want it sorting out as it would be heavy going to drive this every single day, with a sheep trailer on the back!
(Oddly, I’ve never actually ridden around here so I can’t comment from an MTB point of view. I really must correct this in the near future!)
[url=https://flic.kr/p/NS7u1K]Untitled[/url] by Richard Munro, on Flickr
