I did it cos I wanted to stay in research and wasn’t ready for a real job (had a job offer, which was in research, but of course relatively directed rather than curiousity-driven). So when the phd offer came up – which it only did at the last minute when another candidate pulled out – I jumped at it.

I did and do make a lot of use of it, not precisely – once a problem is solved, you do something else! – but generically in terms of skills. Got up to about 60k equivalent salary (abroad) in research before walking out. Colleagues in the UK were mostly working harder for less money but those that made it did end up with a better career path (and pension). No regrets but I would plan things differently if I had my time again. Most importantly – get in with a high-profile supervisor who will get you an early paper in a top journal and a post-doc with a high-profile pal. Doing it myself with no leg-up or mentoring whatsoever has been a continual struggle and as a result I never quite “made it”.

i managed to keep my thesis down to less than 100 pages

of sh1te to be fair

but i passed with almost no corrections and i dont even have a copy of it

just a means to an end. The hardest part of it all was motivation. But it was worth it….eventually…. when i left academia and got a well paying job in industry

Well done OP for getting it done and good luck to everyone else who is approaching the end.

I buggered the end of mine up by taking on full time teaching, starting a Post-Doc (don’t know how I got away with that), getting married and doing some extra work on the side… all in my final year. I started my final 2 Chapters (the important ones) at the start of December and had it handed in before Christmas by doing 8am-4am days. Sure it wasn’t ideal but a month of intense work is very do-able short term when you get in to it. It’ll be fine 😀 Just get started!

I would also not worry about the Viva. The problem in the UK is there are few guidelines as to what to expect so students brick it worrying about every permutation. Be respectful of the examiners but if you can explain clearly why you believe x, y and z then don’t be afraid to challenge their opinion or recommended corrections. You should know your stuff better than anyone and the fewer corrections the better obviously so don’t be afraid to fight a little to get the list reduced!

If you think your supervisors aren’t interested or supportive then this needs to be flagged up as soon as possible with the University as it is a major problem. It is very rare for the PhD to get to a hand in stage and fail- the Supervisors should have been on top of it well in advance of hand in. A good bit of advice I got was that the only Theses that fail are ones where the Supervisor should be failed.

It also helps if you can find an external examiner with a plane to catch in the afternoon (Irish examiner if in England for example works well) or get a US examiner where the Viva is a formality and not examined and the tend to go a bit easy on you 😉 😀

A PhD is a journey IMO (to sound all cliched). I agree with others that there is no real logical reason to do one but knowing you’ve over come one of the toughest things you are likely to do in your career and gaining a ton of skills, experiences, travels, friends and everything else that goes with it is worth more than you might appreciate at the time.

It is also more than just a means to a teaching in academia end. I now pimp out my skills and knowledge gained and I much prefer it to academia or “normal” employment. There are many directions to go after a PhD and at the very least it is something that no-one can take away from you 😀

What is Media theory????? I feel sorry for the poor sods who have to read these thesis’s My niece just got a PhD in French Literature, what is she going to do with that?

Anyone with Chemistry as first degree?

What can a degree in Chemistry do as I might have to push my nephew for a PhD in Chemistry related fields … where is the money in Chemistry? 😀

He is very good in Chemistry by the way …

Oh dear I think I better not tell them as I think they will get even more depressed. 😮

Ouch! I think that hurts if PhD earns as much as undergraduate … 😯

What is Media theory????? I feel sorry for the poor sods who have to read these thesis’s My niece just got a PhD in French Literature, what is she going to do with that?

Good question I want to know too … Teacher? Lecturer in French Lit?

^ Very few people I know with a PhD have any desire to stay in Academia (even those who get lectureships and long term contracts!). A PhD is more about acquired skills, knowledge, connections and all those other normal things that dictate getting a job, so it is no different to any other kind of “training”. I guess most people get so worn down by the end of the PhD that, as Johnx2 says, they don’t seem to realise the opportunities elsewhere and feel stuck in that academic world with little opportunity and little desire to do anything different.

@DanW – some good advice there mate. Thanks for posting.

What is media theory? I’ll try to explain without resorting to academic language. 😆

It basically involves theorising (questioning something with an aim of developing a deeper understanding) the impact of mass media (and now digital media) technologies on society.

Basically its an amalgamation of political theory / philosophy, social sciences and engineering / technology studies and a bit of archive work / history.

So for my thesis, I’m looking at recent discussions regarding the empowering / disempowering nature of digital and social media i.e. is social media causing political revolutions? Are we now empowered consumers because we can order a Chinese on our smart phones? Has the Internet increased paedophilia etc?

The question is not whether the technology is either empowering or disempowering (it is obviously both, depending on what you do with it), but rather, why, in Western society, are we so fixated with technological progress, and how does this influence (inform?) our day to day lives.

Obviously I’m looking at specific case studies and using specific theorists to look at the issue but in terms of careers outside of academia, I’d be interested in working for a think tank, market research, tech firm etc.

When people say “media studies is a Mickey Mouse subject,” the first thing I say is “Do you read a newspaper? do you watch TV? Do you own a smart phone? How many hours a day do you do these things for?” Media define our day to day lives, the question for media theory is in what way?

Thanks for the input.

I have to explain to him the rest will be up to him.

No intention of advising him to do PhD in the far east …

No, we/he rather not or not going to work for the Chinese as we know their ethical values and we don’t trust them even when we are the descendants. 😆

He seems to be doing well with marks averaging 95% to 100% in his first year now. I think only one module is 80% as I was informed by my sister.

That’s the long term aim as far as I am concerned … my advice is in that direction.

Fixed some bits 😀 As a PhD student half the skill is in managing your supervisor. There is no way you should get to submission in a position to fail. If a supervisor is heading you in that direction then the University should have policies to deal with it and you have to take some responsibility to look after yourself too (easier said than done perhaps)

You CANNOT fail a viva unless that is not your work.

Or it is impossible to fail a viva unless you have no supervision even without supervision if you get to viva you will pass.

edit: as I was informed by my mates the Profs …

No, you can fail. Or get major corrections which amount to nearly the same thing, basically “whatever you do to the document won’t be enough, go away and do more work”.

And technically (depending on the uni) you can pass the viva and yet not be awarded the degree – for example at Edinburgh the senate have to approve the recommendation from the viva, but they don’t have to…

Well it’s not a fail per se, you get to resubmit…in a year or two.

A proper fail is incredibly rare. As mentioned before, I would have in mind that you are unlikely to fail so use the Viva to limit corrections (and possibly enjoy the last time someone takes proper interest in your work! 😀 ).

To expand a little on the earlier thoughts, something to have in mind for anyone nearing the end is that the people examining you know what they know very well but there’s a very good chance the specifics of your work is outside their direct expertise/ experience. In a similar way, you also have to remember the examiners often have incredibly busy lives and will have had only a fraction of time looking at your work as you did preparing it. I can’t explain this well, but you should know your work better than anyone and the examiners opinions are very often exactly that- there is room for discussion around those opinions and nothing is set in stone. Just because they come in to your Viva with a list of corrections doesn’t mean you need to leave with all of them 😀

If you imagine the writing stage and taking the Thesis to 2 or 3 supervisors- all will give slightly different opinions of how it should be structured/ what is most interesting/ how to present results/ etc. The Viva is no different. It is a PITA to have to move huge sections of text and sections around just because another person prefers it that way or redo every single Figure to fit with someone else’s preferences. Usually most examiners can see past corrections like that and put it down to personal preference but those are the most annoying corrections to have if you do have somebody strong willed. With things like that I would try to justify your choice, explain the benefits and limitations and have in mind to keep the corrections as minimal as possible!

Another bit of advice leading on from that would be the importance of writing clearly and concisely. You don’t want to p1ss off the examiners before they even meet you getting them tangled up in wordy nonsense 😀 That was my speciality 😳

I’m not sure it does, I can only think of 2 ‘fails’ during my time and in both cases the student had been advised not to submit, but proceeded to anyway for various personal reasons.

Interesting discussion. I did a first degree in Chemistry (Durham) and then had a place for a PhD but turned it down late on because I was going into it for the wrong reasons. I have however stayed in Chemistry. So let me give you some perspective from the other side of that fence.

True – but is it really? I think there are certain times, like where you become the leading researcher into a field that you know most about because it’s an extension essentially of your PhD, but in the majority of cases it’s just having PhD after your name; and that’s where……

Absolutely. After 25 years experience there are still jobs people won’t look at me for because I’m not a Dr. And that’s not necessarily highly scientific jobs like big Pharma either. Not all Chemistry is breaking new boundaries, I worked for a company that formulated existing raw materials together to make soaps and detergents and the like so hardly the pinnacle of science yet was glass ceilinged because I wasn’t a Dr. Some companies (big German ones for example) almost visibly shrink in meetings when you don’t have Dr. on your business card. It hasn’t necessarily meant I can’t have a decent career (and I’ll be honest, I’m Director level and earn well above what a PhD qualified ‘technical’ person does) – but you need to find the right companies that value capability above having those letters.

So true – particularly in early days. There were times in my early career when folks would come in at about the same age as me and a PhD but with no real world experience vs my 4 years, and flounder. Like going out to chemical plants to run a scale up trial and trying to persuade some proper roughneck operators to delay a shift change / work break to enable the trial to proceed. I’d swap 4 years of having worked with them and eaten with them for a bit of paper any day then. It does eventually level out, and as above 25 years experience vs 21 and a PhD is one I rarely get the better of, and sometime the worse. But it also depends on personality in that case as much as experience.

Interesting. I went on a school visit at about the age of 16/17 to a chemical factory (actually one that used chemicals rather than made them) and was so enthused by the experience and also the enthusiasm of the bloke who showed us round that I wanted to be a chemist from then on. Sometimes I curse him (he’s probably long dead now) but in general it’s been fun.

It’s a decent springboard for many careers. Most of my Chemistry peer group at University didn’t stay in it – there are lawyers and accountants and marketing folks and….. That said, I’ve also done time in Supply Chain, and Marketing and Sales as well as technical so within Chemistry there’s a lot more that the degree and knowledge of ‘Chemistry’ enables you to do, it’s not all white coats and fume cupboards.