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(think I asked this before but don't recall an answer - sorry if I missed it)
What's the ultimate intention in Nath's plan, weight loss or some kind of power gain ?
Presumably nobody races in that sort of state, right, so what happens when you glug carbs for racing ?
Actually people do race like that, but generally for much longer events.What's the ultimate intention in Nath's plan, weight loss or some kind of power gain ?Presumably nobody races in that sort of state, right, so what happens when you glug carbs for racing ?
Someone can correct me if i'm wrong, but I think for shorter events where you are going to need big carb powered bursts you do the bulk of your training in your new fat burning state which forces the adaptations to use fat as fuel, and then you switch back to high carbs a couple of weeks before a target event.
Try googling periodised nutrition.
I assume this is about right then, given its marginal gainsy provenance:
“Essentially, certain low-intensity sessions are performed with low glycogen stores, and high-intensity sessions with high glycogen stores,” explains Dr James Morton, Team Sky’s head of nutrition and reader in Exercise Metabolism and Nutrition at Liverpool John Moores University.“The idea is that by restricting carbs around certain training sessions you can actually enhance training adaptations. This increases the number of mitochondria in muscles, improves your ability to burn fat for fuel and, potentially, increases metabolic flexibility [muscles’ ability to switch between burning fat and carbohydrate], as well as your body composition and performance.”
So on days that nath is crushing puny humans with ossom power he should still be eating carbs but maybe fasted slow rides ?
(I'm guessing that a 10 mile fasted commute 2-3 mornings a week would be worthless in this respect ? 😳 )
Edit: sorry, that was rude. Here's my [url= http://www.cyclingweekly.com/fitness/training/eat-like-train-221295 ]sauce[/url]
No Scaredypants, what you suggest is a perfect way to create some better fat adaption. I don't think there's a lower limit on triggering the effect.
If you can work out the night before and go to bed afterwards with no carbs, you can get an even stronger effect but will be at slightly higher risk of bonking.
(I'm talking about encouraging your body to get better at fat burning here, not going full Keto....)
Sounds like Nath is taking it a step further and going full carb ban (possibly for medical as well as performance) reasons. In theory once adapted he shouldn't see much change to his FTP as he just becomes much better adapted to using fat as a fuel. I'm a bit sceptical how it'll work out in the 1-15min power range.
It's certainly not going to hurt, but ideally would want to be longer and more steady than the typical commute I think.(I'm guessing that a 10 mile fasted commute 2-3 mornings a week would be worthless in this respect ? )
I took small steps in this direction last year (i need to be careful not to cut calorie intake too much as i'm prone to weight loss). No carbs on my easier rides up to 2hrs, and 'low' (100-150kcal/hr) carb for easy rides in the 2-5hr range.
It certainly seemed to make a positive impact on my endurance (and by extension cruising speed).
took small steps in this direction last year (i need to be careful not to cut calorie intake too much as i'm prone to weight loss). No carbs on my easier rides up to 2hrs, and 'low' (100-150kcal/hr) carb for easy rides in the 2-5hr range.
Much the same here, but on a diet with much reduced carb from usual (though far from no carb.) Never really had problems with it, just got to get the intensities right. Needs a lot of volume to balance that out. Improved endurance and a bit more power. MFP to make sure I was still getting enough cals and having the right balance of macros.
Past month has been getting back up to speed. Will do the above again Dec, jan and Feb.
Well, im deffo going to blaze the STW trail for as long as i can at 4.30pm in the weird name race if anyone else fancies a bimble. Don't expect miracles though.
Well that mostly went well...
Group of 11 of us went off hard at the front, 10s lead, 20s, 34s, next thing you know we've got a minute. We're now on the 2nd lap proper and we're cracking on. The HR was 174 at the kicks, but for some reason that felt OK. Onto lap 3 of CCW and we've dumped a couple and picked up 1 A and 1 B guy who had a head start, they're now riding with us. Nice feather and onto lap 4 in the bunch of us, we've now got 1min 30 over the next group. Sadly over the line i got NOTHING in the PUs, damn. Up the kicker in a decent position but as we crest the hill we've split. The A guy tries to go with the lead 3, so i try and get on his wheel hoping he'd tow me.... but he can't... Another fella comes from behind over the line and gets after them, but he's at 5.3w/kg on the screen and i can't match him.
Starting lap 5 we're 3s behind, which isn't a lot... but we're dropping slowly, me, the A and 1 other C guy... He's not really taking a turn... we end up losing ground on lap 5, so it's now a 3 way battle..
Onto the kick up and i nail it, then over the line i pick up an aero and hit the power, suddenly i've got 20m on them 2 riders and going up... 4s, 5, then 10s.... I gradually pull it out to 15s by the time we hit the little snakey downhill and i sit at 280w churning it out to the hill.... he pulls 2s back so down to 13s, but i wasn't losing that on the hill.... So i crusied to 5th place in C with a cracking 283w average which i'm darn well happy with 🙂
I'd have liked a trophy and depending what happens in the mix-up later i may end up with one.. but it was at least a decent race, result and finish 🙂
with a cracking 283w average
I appreciate I was guilty of this myself yesterday, but we’d all be better off quoting w/kg for a general understanding of effort. 11 and 5.5 for reference to yesterday’s intervals btw...
Sadly, being a Jabba means my figures are not too different. 280w is only 2.9w/kg.
Still a good result though!
see, even just discussing it wih crosshair has made you faster up the kicks 😀
3.8 for my 1 min I'm pretty happy with and 4.5 for my 15s isn't bad either. Minor regret I didn't go with the others, but they've hit a DQ anyway as usual.
I've just noticed on zwift power that from Friday afternoon it looks like you can race either London or watopia. Some of the races are at the same time e.g. 510 WBR three laps hilly on watopia and WBR four laps on the London classique course. Seems to be WBR races only at this stage.
I would check the app rather than ZP to confirm although there are a variety on there too. Selectable courses for race/event organisers is coming so perhaps this is a low key test launch....
BTW - that plan I posted was this summers plan, that I followed to the letter and moved from 4.5 to 5w/kg. It really worked I promise! What I didn't plan on was moving from 70kg to 68kg which was too much and I caught flu for the 3 targeted races!!
What I'm doing right now is reversing all that hard work, hopefully temporarily. I'm moving away from carbs/sugar to fat, in the ratio of 5% carbs (50g max) 20% protein 75% fat. This has KILLED my top end, I really mean that. Tonight for instance I was at 190bpm to keep to 20mph on my commute home. My resting heart rate is up from 45bpm to 57bpm. I think I'd struggle to keep up with a B race at the moment, CH was walking all over me at Hillingdon the other day.
Ultimately I'm sure once I've reached ketosis, my intended state, I can attempt to start rebuilding again with a proper plan. But right now I'm just trying to hang on to what fitness I have left with Z2'ing and traffic light sprinting until I'm over this hump.
P.s. Final point is I've gone into this knowing it will probably damage my cycling, but hoping the medical benefits (coming off omeprazole) will far outweigh it. I'm planning on TT'ing next year with my pancake power curve 😆
Somewhere up there ^ I linked to the league that CVR are launching.
I finally clicked on it myself and it's the first event I'm aware of that is using CVR Divisions as race Categories. E1,2 are all in Cat A so I would have to race it as an A.
https://cvrworldcup.com/cvr-league/
There are 8 races a day (Tuesdays) to make sure all time zones are catered for and you have to register for one of those and stick to it for the duration of the series.
The winner of each A race gets a ticket to the live final!
The winner of each of the B,C and D race 'brackets' get prizes too.
Frank is definitely pushing the Zwift racing boundaries....
Signed up, 7pm one.
Interesting - but I'm oot, for now at least
(I thought you were a cat4 CH ??)
I'm signed up for the 10pm one.
Not ideal, but if i'm going to be sure that i'll make it it's the only option
scaredypants - Member
Interesting - but I'm oot, for now at least(I thought you were a cat4 CH ??)
On here: http://zwiftrankings.com
He's a cat 2.
I'm still down as an Elite, ha that's not going to last long.
ah, I see
on there I'm a 2, inactive, 4, 4 - work that out
sounds interesting, I might have to give that a go. Would be good to give some structure to the racing, plus being up against the same people each week would lead to some interesting dynamics/rivalries I’m sure!Somewhere up there ^ I linked to the league that CVR are launching.
Edit: guess I’ll be bringing up the rear in B as that’s what they reckon I am 😯 7pm for me
OK, we'll give it a whirl potentially. 4pm for me.
[url= https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4528/24868987668_c9fcd7cfe6_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4528/24868987668_c9fcd7cfe6_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/DTA4Bs ]hilltervals[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/152318156@N08/ ]Steve Weeks[/url], on Flickr
Hilltervals !
aww, imagine how proud CH is going to be !
Good work weeksy - interesting HR recovery "drift" between sprints.
interesting HR recovery "drift" between sprints.
Depended on who was around me after finishing sprint etc, sometimes I went harder than others, I was also texting a mate a fair few times.
So KISS are now running the Zwift official EU/USA ECrit series (like they did for the Australian one) after the Zwift one imploded just before the finale. The exact reasoning isn't clear but a lot of the guys and gals who committed to racing it were pretty pee'd off!
Anyway, the new incarnation is as follows:
Starts 7th December, 10 races, Thursdays, 8pm, mass start, no cats, best 7 races to count for points, top ten men and top ten women to race at a live final.
All quite exciting really, it's CVR v KISS in a way. Although I'm sure some guys will race both.
https://m.facebook.com/groups/644249712382917
Did the WBR 4 lapper last night. Think I'm getting the hang of it now as managed to stay with the front group fairly consistently. In fact it felt fairly pedestrian so managed to have a bit of fun by launching a couple of sustained attacks. Didn't stay away but also didn't get dropped so fairly content. Didn't have the legs for the final sprint but that's not a suprise as I've never been a sprinter.
is that not just gonna balls up Zwift again?! Or have they upgraded the infrastructure?mass start, no cats,
dazh - Member
Did the WBR 4 lapper last night. Think I'm getting the hang of it now as managed to stay with the front group fairly consistently. In fact it felt fairly pedestrian so managed to have a bit of fun by launching a couple of sustained attacks. Didn't stay away but also didn't get dropped so fairly content. Didn't have the legs for the final sprint but that's not a suprise as I've never been a sprinter.
It's nice when you can have a bit of a play, although 99.5% of them i'm not able to do that.
Apologies for not posting for a while, been a bit ill for the last month, seem to better now...
I did my first KISS 100, suffered, and then I was under the weather at the same time as Zwift kept going offline and ZP went down, a strange coincidence. My first proper return ride was the World event last Saturday and I got dropped on the first hill but then warmed up and stayed with the chasers to finish 71st.
Checking CVR today shows that I have not done much lately but I am now in the Elite category so the challenge is now to stay there. I may do some of the CVR & KISS series, just for training, the initial pace is always too much for me. In the World event, which was 120km, I set new PR's for every segment from the start until I got dropped.
I have kept up with everyone else's progress on here recently, Zwift does make a big difference once you get the hang of it.
Today I will try FulGaz for a bit of variety for a recovery ride and then may be the KISS 100 at the weekend.
I don't think the numbers for a weekly series will be quite as big as the one off events that cause the real problem.
Zwift are anticipating 12000 concurrent users this winter by all accounts. I saw 4500 the other day.
What's the most you guys have seen?
Thanks for all the advice and pointers on PC setup etc. I've now got a refurbished tower PC on its way and also ordered a good budget graphics card, so will hopefully get it all working by next week.
Tried the WBR Cat C last night, and held the lead group for nearly a lap until the lag became too weird to keep pace. I think most of that is the slow internet connection here, rather than the my current PC (work laptop).
Good race all the same, and looking at the other results in that category, I'm not that far off the pace, so hoping that once I get an improved setup working, I should be able to focus on pace and stamina, rather than cursing the kit!
Gavinb - it wont matter if you have the greatest kit in the world coz if you are anything like me then any losses/bad performances are always the kits fault as i am too awesome a rider to come second. 😀
Haha - that did occur to me too! Once I have this new setup working, the excuses bucket is looking pretty empty.
Use mine...
" I was 14th, but all the others should be DQ'd for breaking cat limits"
I like that one 🙂
Well, I'm finally on it and have done just a couple or rides so far. Going to sign up to pay this weekend a the trial ends. Great so far, but holy moly, aren't there any other fatties on there? Everyone seems to power away up every hill. I suspect I'm going to loose a lot of weight soon to enable me to keep up!
It's astonishing how hard I'm prepared to ride as well, genuinely flat out, sweaty smelly mess and want to do it again. I bloody hate turbos, this is good fun.
Another few weeks and I'll start entering a few events.
What weight are you mate ? I'm at 95 or so, there's others on here in the 3 figures....
But yes, there are plenty of light ones on Zwift !
I'm 93kg but the power output is pants! Doesn't help that 10kg of that is lard....
It's astonishing how hard I'm prepared to ride as well, genuinely flat out, sweaty smelly mess and want to do it again
My experience exactly. I'm fairly fit (do endurance races) but have always struggled in the past to push it when training out on the road (intervals etc). I rarely come back from a road ride absolutely wasted, an hour on this though and I can barely walk.
an hour on this though and I can barely walk.
I nearly crashed my bike, on the turbo (final sprint in my first ever race).
Did a little warm down spin for about 15 mins after that then cramped up getting off the bike.
I managed to tip the bike and turbo nearly 45 degrees yesterday trying to get off it after a rather sprinty workout organised by mgcc left me quite wobbly and unstable. That being said i have done this before on the road but that was down to being clipless and incompetent.
My bike came completely out of the turbo (Kinetic Road Machine) racing the other day! I grabbed my pedestal fan off to the side, smashed that on the way down and ended up on the floor!
It was well clamped in when I started but the clamping bar unscrewed over the length of the 4-lap race I was in. I contacted Kinetic and they are sending me the upgrade parts. Must be a known problem with older Kinetic turbos as they only have a lock ring on the non-drive side whereas the newer ones have a lock ring both sides.
Extracated myself from the wreckage, put the bike back on the turbo and finished the race. It doesn't get much more realistic than that! 😆
My chain snapping now firmly in perspective