[Closed] Winters coming;all inclusive rugby thread.

Italy are a decent team and have improved and the younger players look impressed with the locks yesterday and winger venenti (?).

England lacked good decision making yesterday, good points about three quarters passing BUT line/blitz defence is encouraging players to kick behind or take contact added to choke tackle really hard to get the ball unless you go deep, go deep and the defence line up.

Fitness and muscle mass may kill the game, gone is the time you looked for the ponderous prop to zip around 😉 Scrums do not create space but penalities, problem.Rules do need to be reviewed on the scrum.

Give Twelvetrees and Burns a go.....

AShton has been awful since his debacle at Nrthampton, needs to be dropped Manu on the wing twelvetrees in.

Billy V was very good yesterday.

Intrestin video on Savea..............clearly fast and strong but great balance and timing on the 'bump' down on the tacklers. Dagg was the most disappointing player I watch from the stands, had really long forward to seeing him.

Flood did regain some self esteem by admitting to the ref that he didn't ground it. Still waited for the TMO tho.

[i]As for Goode, he may be ok in defence but he is nowhere near as good as foden going forward[/i]

Or Mike Brown. Can't understand Goode at full back myself - bit of a Charlie Hodgson - does everything [i]OK[/i] but really nothing special and there are better players for the position.

Brown is crap in defence though. I've seen him miss too many tackles now.

Problem with smashing Warbirton back "onside" is as he technically isn't part of the ruck it would be a penalty offence, possibly deemed dangerous depending on how hard you drove him. A clever tactic employed by Wales and Ireland when teh fringe defence is stopping the pick and drives.

Sinbad, brilliant player but utterly fragile. As soon as England came knocking, he got crocked and continued that way for 5-6years until people stopped watching. At which point he seems to become more robust...

Sinbad, brilliant player but utterly fragile. As soon as England came knocking, he got crocked and continued that way for 5-6years until people stopped watching. At which point he seems to become more robust...

Sorry for my ignorance - who is "Sinbad"?

I fink its him:
[img] [/img]

(Not sure what "he got crocked" means though)

vondally - Member

Intrestin video on Savea..............clearly fast and strong but great balance and timing on the 'bump' down on the tacklers. Dagg was the most disappointing player I watch from the stands, had really long forward to seeing him.

He scored a lovely try in the game the Savea clip is taken from and didn't have such a bad game overall, but he's not looking as good as he has in previous seasons.

onehundredthidiot - Member

Problem with smashing Warbirton back "onside" is as he technically isn't part of the ruck it would be a penalty offence, possibly deemed dangerous depending on how hard you drove him. A clever tactic employed by Wales and Ireland when teh fringe defence is stopping the pick and drives.

It all depends on what the ref has classified that breakdown as. If it is a ruck (which a_a thinks it isn't..) then Wyn-Jones should technically be penalised for picking the ball up and running with it. He is part of the ruck and can't handle. I can only remember one ref giving this in an international. Also if a ruck then isn't Warburton offside from being in front of the ruck and not connected with it?

Whatever, poor play by Scotland for allowing Wales to do that without intereference or were they playing clever by not putting players into the breakdown and weakening the defensive line?

Sinbad is James Simpson Daniel apparently

Wyn-Jones can pick the ball up as it is at the "back" of the ruck in a playable position. As long as he came in from an on-side position he can pick it up. However as soon as he does the ruck is over and the offside line also moves accordingly. Scotland,for being crap,are quick to read a ruck situation and avoid commiting men, hence the Scots on the edge of the above clip. Warburton opens a gate and I suppose is "sort of" retreating back onside....sort of... 😉

It strayed into a complete bitch fest between TJ and zokes or toys on the RWC thread, so if you don't mind leaving it out, ta!

Totally forgetting a_a's 'input', of course.

But, as you were...

duckman - Member

Wyn-Jones can pick the ball up as it is at the "back" of the ruck in a playable position. As long as he came in from an on-side position he can pick it up.

Hmm, I can see what you mean. I'd assumed that AWJ was bound in to the side of the ruck and then picked the ball up.

Yes, sinbad is James Simpson Daniel, and was (IMO) one of the brightest talents of English rugby.
'He got crocked' refers to the number of times he had very serious injuries as he was on the cusp of being called up to the England team yet again.

Extract from the mighty Wiki:

He represented England at the Hong Kong Sevens in 2002 and scored a hat trick in the final, which England won. He flew back and followed it up with a hat trick in a club game against Bath. Four days before his twentieth birthday he rounded Jonah Lomu to score a famous try for an uncapped England XV against the Barbarians at Twickenham.[citation needed]
He made his international debut for England against New Zealand in November 2002. An injury to his foot meant that he missed a tour to Argentina. He recovered for the Autumn internationals against Australia and New Zealand but was diagnosed with glandular fever and missed out on playing against South Africa. He was playing again within a few months and was able to be a part of Gloucester Rugby winning the cup.
He narrowly missed selection to the final 30 for the 2003 Rugby World Cup because of a back problem, although he had celebrated his first Six Nations Championship start some months earlier with a try in the match against Italy. Unluckily, injury once again prevented him playing a part in the 2004 Autumn series in November and he missed further game time for the build up to the 2005 Six Nations. Picked in the centre for England's final 2005 Autumn test against Samoa but a hip injury forced him off at half-time.
In 2006, he made the squad for England's tour of Australia and scored two tries in their win over the Barbarians on 28 May. However, he suffered a dead leg midweek during training, and as a result missed both tests, in which England were resoundingly beaten.
Once more, he was beset by bad luck and suffered a comminuted fracture of his collarbone in a pre-season match for Gloucester Rugby, which greatly reduced his chances of playing in the autumn tests.

Sort of sums it up really!

Meh he's no Tom Varndell 😀

The ruck thing is thefirst smart tic tak I've seen from wales in the last few years. Scotland compete until the ball is lost and then fan out so wales did a lot of picking and driving straight down the middle. Warburton isnt off side as its no ruck as the only scot around is lay on the floor.

He may have drawn the defender away though i suppose. See Adam Jones really smart move prior to mike phillips try v ireland in the world cup.

It is an arms race though, as soon as IRB say look at a particular infringement the focus shifts to another.
When I played we used to have refs come (almost) straight from meetings to allow us to stay "on the correct side of the law" (by a gnats bawhair).

Problem with smashing Warbirton back "onside" is as he technically isn't part of the ruck it would be a penalty offence, possibly deemed dangerous depending on how hard you drove him. A clever tactic employed by Wales and Ireland when teh fringe defence is stopping the pick and drives.

From the IRB

A ruck is a phase of play where one or more players from each team, who are on their feet, in physical contact, close around the ball on the ground. Open play has ended.

That defines it as a ruck,doesn't matter if their was just one Scot. Warburton is clever in that he doesn't actually impede anybody...unless you want to go down the middle to get to W-J before he makes the gain line, and then the not-quite-so-innocent Welshman is in the way...as he retreats to his own side... Just shows, I suppose,how hard it is to be a ref in the professional era (not that is an excuse for Joubert,oh no!)

ITS NOT A RUCK IF THE ONLY SCOT IS LAYON THE FLOOR.... You never see the defending team run round the side and pick the ball up though. Have seen teams disengage mauls and then run round and tackle the ball carrier though. Italy did it a lot a few seasons ago.

Ashton was shocking, doesn't even deserve to be on the bench. I really hope England don't choke!

From what I've read, he may well keep his place. I'd just stick strettle in personally.

Big calls for Wales at loosehead between James, who is a very strong scrummager, and Jenkins for his work raye and at six. Can Wales risk two opensides?

Have Wales ever played Tips and Warbs together? There was talk of Croft starting in the Torygraph!!

From what I've read, he may well keep his place. I'd just stick strettle in personally.

I know what you mean, but I guess there is always that thing, who are we to judge. I mean Lancaster can analyse some pretty interesting stats and surely must be better at this job than the rest of us, he must have a reason for keeping Ashton?

Oi are you doubting my interweb rugby expert credentials 🙂

Jonny may is up next is he not?

Tips and Warbs have never started together. Ended the game v scotland though.

Adam thinks wales are going to get stuffed in the scrums

http://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10152650728375514&id=120113291391290&_rdr

1/2p is the new Gav
[img] [/img]

wrecker - Member

Jonny may is up next is he not?

Is he the lanky one, looks like he's got Peter Crouch's body?

edit: no he isn't. I remember May now. So who is that lanky dude who was looking good? Anyone?

I was meeting with two Welsh blokes today and both were confident that Wales are going to get stuffed. I must say, I don't see it that way at all.

Maybe that's down to my natural English conservatism....

I see it as a close game. Either England sneak it, or they capitulate in unfortunate but grand fashion.

Doesn't matter A-A; once a ruck always a ruck. It will have started as one, even Jobbie-rt will have called ruck,it remains a ruck until the ball is played.Unlike a maul which can become static,the only way a ruck ends is if the ball is unplayable. Otherwise teams would just pull/drag all their players out and just run round and pick the ball up from the other side. (Seen it done to line out drives)

I see I thought there must be something like that. If the scot was the tackler and never regained his feet would it stll be a ruck? Intresting. Italy went through a phase of doing that maul thing and sacking tbe ball carrier.

Scotland did the fall off the maul thing a few years ago and it worked. Would have taken some nerve for NZ to do it against that 15man wales drive in the summer.

Didn't Scotland do that in the Autumn v SA? First time all went well and prevented a try....second time SA walked over for a try.

Very bad idea,you can do it once and possibly get away with it. Next time? Well all the rest of the mauling teams forwards are still nearer the ball...I have see the players open up and take a step back(retreating onside,v-good) and then as soon as the smart arse team re-engage join again, but by now they are 5-10m nearer the try line. And that was Connacht who are crap,but had still drilled for it.

England team: A Goode (Saracens); C Ashton (Saracens), M Tuilagi (Leicester), B Barritt (Saracens), M Brown (Harlequins); O Farrell (Saracens), B Youngs (Leicester); J Marler (Harlequins), T Youngs (Leicester), D Cole (Leicester), J Launchbury (Wasps), G Parling (Leicester), T Croft (Leicester), C Robshaw (Harlequins, capt), T Wood (Northampton).
Replacements: D Hartley (Northampton), D Wilson (Bath), M Vunipola (Saracens), C Lawes (Northampton), J Haskell (Wasps), D Care (Harlequins), T Flood (Leicester), B Twelvetrees (Gloucester).

Suprised by Marler and Croft. Could be a game of lineout v breakdown.

Wow I thought that Vunipola had done enough. Croft is a big call too. As for Ashton. **** me!!!

Ashton is the only really dubious call I think. Lancaster can only pish with the cock he has.

You're right duckman....ashton is a cock 😀

The pack looks a bit more mobile. Trouble is, Wales will smash us in the scrums.
This could be Ashtons' last chance. If he doesn't perform, I wouldn't be surprised if A.N. Other doesn't take the slot.

Even more dubious than Ashton, Freddie M keeps his place for France!